500 yard ammunition

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Lash3006

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Hi I was looking at getting into somewhat long range shooting and wasn't sure if the federal power shok 180 grain 30-06 for my Remington 700 long range edition would be accurate( as long as I get 1 MOA at 100 yards) at 500 yards or if I would need to switch to a boat tailed ballastic tip bullet like the precision hunter from hornady to get consistent results. Thanks guy!
 
Well that would probably tight up your groups, but I suggest getting out and actually shooting at 500 first before you worry about messing with loads.
 
Well that would probably tight up your groups, but I suggest getting out and actually shooting at 500 first before you worry about messing with loads.
Ok thank you! I will definitely get out and try them out
 
Howdy, welcome to the forum.
IMO, ballistic tips are for cartridges with marginal velocity, which isn't a problem with the 06. You might want to try some 165 Sierra Game Kings. I've had very good luck with 'em. Boat tails do fly better. 180s are good for elk or moose.
 
A 1 MOA rifle-ammo at 100 yards won't be 1 MOA at 500. More like 1.5 MOA, at least.

Through 500 yards, bullet quality is more important than boat tailed ones having less drag.

Shoot some 10-shot groups with different bullets at 500. Pick the one you like.
 
Thank you for your help everyone! I will get out and try some different loads and see what works!
 
A 1 MOA rifle-ammo at 100 yards won't be 1 MOA at 500. More like 1.5 MOA, at least.

^This

Through 500 yards, bullet quality is more important than boat tailed ones having less drag.

^And This

At midrange, the importance of aerodynamics really hasn't started to kick in, but the bullet quality for overall precision will rule. Consider it this way, if we only consider the bullet itself:

Bullet quality dictates a bullets potential for precision, whereas aerodynamics simply contribute to how far it can sustain that precision.

500yrds isn't far enough yet to make a good bullet with poor aerodynamics start looking bad, and there is NEVER a distance where good aerodynamics will make a bad bullet look good. Frankly, boattail heels will make a bullet longer for a given weight, so it has been seen boattail bullets can need a faster twist to shoot as well as a flat base of the same weight.

The Powershok is a cheap factory load for 30-06 (Midway has them a nickel over a dollar per shot right now), so if it groups well for you, there's likely very little reason to change bullets. More rounds down range in different conditions will accelerate your mid-range shooting learning curve more than a switch to a higher BC bullet ever could. I've never been impressed with the precision of the Power Shok loads, but if you can hold them 1MOA at 100 and have realistic expectations for 500yrd group size, it'd be a good practice round for the near term. A guy could spend over 50% more and run the Hornady 178 ELD load at $1.65 a shot, or spend twice as much and shoot the HSM 168 Berger VLD load, but there's no guarantee either of these loads with better aerodynamics will group any better than the cheap bullets. There aren't a lot of 30-06 loads available at a dollar per shot, so if cheap ammo shoots reasonably well for you, and it means you'll spend more time at the range, then grab a few boxes and start making noise!
 
At midrange, the importance of aerodynamics really hasn't started to kick in, but the bullet quality for overall precision will rule.
Explain why that's reality when bullets lose velocity as range increases. If true, then we should shoot bullets at lower velocities so they'll thing they're at longer ranges.

What happens when aerodynamics really starts to kick in? Why ain't it kicked in at higher velocities?

If aerodynamics kicks in, does the bullet's BC go higher?

Why does all of Sierra Bullet's G1 BC's drop as their velocity slows down? They're less aerodynamic when that happens, aren't they?
 
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Explain why that's reality when bullets lose velocity as range increases. If true, then we should shoot bullets at lower velocities so they'll thing they're at longer ranges.

What happens when aerodynamics really starts to kick in? Why ain't it kicked in at higher velocities?

If aerodynamics kicks in, does the bullet's BC go higher?

Why does all of Sierra Bullet's G1 BC's drop as their velocity slows down? They're less aerodynamic when that happens, aren't they?

What a waste of breath... But usually that's how it works out when you're so intent upon arguing such you insist on forcing your own words into someone else's mouth.

I never said anything about BC dependence upon velocity. I specifically stated at midrange - the 500yrd context in this thread - the importance of aerodynamics - as in helping shoot smaller groups, as the context of this thread - really hasn't started to kick in.

Quoting my own statements here:

At midrange, the importance of aerodynamics really hasn't started to kick in, but the bullet quality for overall precision will rule.

Explain to me how my ACTUAL statement is incorrect? Throw up whatever straw man BS you like, but the challenges you presented do not reflect my statements in any way. Your contention to my statement suggests you'd rather have a lower quality bullet with a high BC for 500yrd shooting rather than having a higher quality bullet, even with a lower BC for this task. However, that's contrary to your statements - but I guess if someone says the same thing, they MUST BE WRONG:

Through 500 yards, bullet quality is more important than boat tailed ones having less drag.

So you say bullet quality is more important than lesser drag, I back your statement and say aerodynamics are less important than bullet quality and you get your panties in a twist... :confused:

To explain a little farther for the OP, and to offer a bit more comparison for the two specific factory loads about which @Lash3006 asked - the contribution of aerodynamics (BC) to your group size just isn't very important yet inside of 500yrds. The difference in a high BC load like the Hornady Precision Hunter 178 ELD-X and the Federal Power Shok 180 is insignificant when it comes to aerodynamics alone. From a 100yrd zero, at 500yrds, there's only ~1mil difference in drop (2.9 vs. 3.9) between these two loads, and there's only 0.1"/yard difference in drop. This means if your range estimate is off by +/- 1yrds (which most laser rangefinders claim to be), with a load capable of 1MOA at 500yrds, you'd see a 5.5" vertical group with the Hornady load and a group with 5.7" vertical with the Federal load. As Bart pointed out, if your load is printing 1MOA at 100yrds, it's most likely going to be 1.5MOA or larger at 500, so the difference in aerodynamics alone will only mean an 8" group vs. an 8.2" group. Comparing for wind drift, in a 10mph wind, you're talking about roughly twice as much drift, however, the difference for windspeed misjudgement isn't really significant either - the difference in drift per mph of windspeed is only 0.2" - so if you misjudge your windspeed by +/- 3mph, you're only talking about a difference of 1.2" in group width - so that 1.5MOA potential group, with +/-3mph means a 12.3" wide group vs. a 17.4" wide group. Get your windspeed down to +/- 1mph and that spread shrinks to a 9" group vs. a 10.8" group - so the wind spread is 1/3 as big as your raw group size...

The aerodynamics just don't make much difference in actual trajectory management inside 500yrds. If you're shooting factory ammo and just starting out at mid-range shooting, you won't be able to tell the difference for a long time.
 
Awesome thank you varminterror! Yeah it'll be a while before I shoot farther then 500 yards. Thank you for your help!
 
Awesome thank you varminterror! Yeah it'll be a while before I shoot farther then 500 yards. Thank you for your help!

With a reasonably good instructor/coach, appropriate gear, sufficiently friendly weather, access to range of sufficient length, a good dirt berm for calling impacts (or a masterful spotter calling trace), and a sufficiently large target (24-36" or larger), almost ANYONE can be brought to shoot 1,000yrds successfully within a single afternoon session. Learning from someone who went before is much, much faster than trying to learn on your own. Even in less than ideal conditions, getting to 600yrds on ~3MOA targets, meeting the other requirements listed, really isn't so difficult. It's when you need to shrink those groups at range when things get really, really challenging.
 
If your gun shoots moa at a 100 yards and holds moa at 500 it will be fine for deer at that range. Problem is not every load that shoots moa at a 100 yards shoots even near that at 500. You need to actually test at the range that will be the farthest you plan on shooting.
 
If your gun shoots moa at a 100 yards and holds moa at 500 it will be fine for deer at that range. Problem is not every load that shoots moa at a 100 yards shoots even near that at 500. You need to actually test at the range that will be the farthest you plan on shooting.
Thanks for the advice I will definitely do that!
 
Try to find some GI 06 Match ammo. IF You have a fast enough twist rate, it should shoot fine. I occasionally see it at MT/NV gun shows for a bit cheaper than Federal GMM.

500 isn't too tough. My experience it that 750 and beyond is where any deficiencies really start to show up. And 1K and beyond is yet another galaxy away from 750. LOL.

Just go out and have some fun, You may surprise yourself. Get a spotter, try to place your tgt where you can see misses. We have tall dirt berms, as good as it gets.
 
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