.22-250 fast twist light bullets?

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horsey300

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I have a friend who has decided that his .223 and .243 have left him with a gap....:confused: however, I'll also not tell a feller he DOESN'T need another rifle...;) he's going the fast twist route for reasons that I hope don't need explained(1:9), we'll be handloading for it so the options are quite varied. I'm curious though, if anyone has experience with a fast twist please help me out, how light can we go without shredding them? Obviously, the dogtown bullets will probably shred before they hit the target based on their performance with a standard twist, but say a quality nosler (excluding the varmageddon I think) or Speer or Sierra (excluding the blitzking?) Or hornady (excluding the sxsp) type bullet was used in a 50-55 class on days when he just wants to play with splosion factors on relatively close targets? Would these hold together? If not, what's the lightest you would go?
ETA twist could be 1:8 or 1:9 depending on which would be more beneficial, feel free to weigh in on which you would choose.
ETAA let's say the bullets in play are the 53vmax, 65 gameking, and 70 gmx (this one is purely optional and can be ruled out if a slower twist will give the gameking AND lightweight bullets an advantage)
 
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I doubt that a 50- or 55-grain flat-base bullet will disintegrate from spin.

I say that because a Sierra guy once commented in a thread that the flat-base was somewhat stronger than a boat-tail. Less likely to come all apart with a high-speed impact.
 
I doubt that a 50- or 55-grain flat-base bullet will disintegrate from spin.

I say that because a Sierra guy once commented in a thread that the flat-base was somewhat stronger than a boat-tail. Less likely to come all apart with a high-speed impact.
Thank you, I am a fan of flatbase bullets, but wasn't sure which ones could take the excessive rpms, I know the dogtown, nightmare, varmageddon lines have all had a reputation for not always being able to withstand the extra spin, and Sierra (and midway and nosler iirc) puts a Max mv on a few of their bullets, but as with minimum twist rates they don't explain which twist has that velocity requirement. If I shoot varmageddon bullets out of a .243 fast twist, they don't go very far, but in a 1:10 with equal velocity, they're OK. I know many people fire the lightweight pills put of their ar-15 fast twists, but they're also not at the extra speed of the .22-250 and that's where my question comes from.
 
Id add the 50grn tnts from speer to your list of blowereuppers. Shot a few from my 06 with sabots, just cause, and they all pretty well came apart. Shot fine from my blackout tho.
 
Id add the 50grn tnts from speer to your list of blowereuppers. Shot a few from my 06 with sabots, just cause, and they all pretty well came apart. Shot fine from my blackout tho.
Thanks! I had them on the radar but wasn't sure how they'd fare one way or another, the Barnes offerings too are a question mark, though I know most lead free need a faster twist anyway due to their length (I.e. btlf from nosler, but nosler specifies that that bullet will work in an 8twist .22-250) but so much data I feel is targeted towards a .223 chambering due to it's popularity that determining the right combo for something faster is somewhat annoying. Bart B. said he thought that instead of recommended twist rates, manufacturers should offer recommended rpms and I wholeheartedly agree with that!
 
It's velocity that causes bullets to disintegrate not the twist. The rate of twist is about stability for heavy bullets.
Anyway, there's a formula here for determining the twist rate.
http://www.chuckhawks.com/rifling_twist_rate.htm
Then why do (at nearly identical velocities) the varmageddon bullets shred out of a fast twist, but make it to the target in a slower twist? I understand what twist does, and to quote from the very article you posted:
"A faster twist increases pressure, barrel wear and also the strain on the bullet jacket, which can actually come apart if spun too fast. This particularly applies to frangible varmint bullets, which have very thin jackets, fired at high velocity in very fast twist barrels, such as the 1 in 7" twist barrels supplied on many .223/5.56mn AR-15 type rifles."
 
Sierra BlitzKings, i thought they WERE ok for the superfasts?...just checked they are "good" upto 4400, so youd probably loose a few fps spinning them faster.

I believe its a combination of speed and twist that shreds bullets, mostly related to the RPMs that are reaching, Centrifugal forces etc.
I WAS surprised when my 06 took apart those tnts, and im glad i didnt try chrono them, but i wouldnt have expected that rpm to be an issue out of a 1-10 at the "advertised" velocity that came with the sabots....anybody want those? and some randome .22 bullets?
 
Its been a few years since I had my 22-250 but if I remember correctly, the Barnes Varmint Grenade bullets, made of a sintered powdered metal, could withstand the highest velocities and twist rates. I personally pushed the 36gr pills to 4,400 fps. Their 50gr option is long for weight and would probably hold up well.
 
Sierra BlitzKings, i thought they WERE ok for the superfasts?...just checked they are "good" upto 4400, so youd probably loose a few fps spinning them faster.

I believe its a combination of speed and twist that shreds bullets, mostly related to the RPMs that are reaching, Centrifugal forces etc.
I WAS surprised when my 06 took apart those tnts, and im glad i didnt try chrono them, but i wouldnt have expected that rpm to be an issue out of a 1-10 at the "advertised" velocity that came with the sabots....anybody want those? and some randome .22 bullets?
But the superfasts standard twist is 1:14, ;) I'll probably try them through his fast twist because even if they don't work, I've still got an old slow twist that likes to come out and play now and then....
 
But the superfasts standard twist is 1:14, ;) I'll probably try them through his fast twist because even if they don't work, I've still got an old slow twist that likes to come out and play now and then....
Ill send you whats left of the box i have, i think i might have a few more random light .224s also gotta dig to the bottom of the brass drawer...they been downgraded from the bullet drawer....
 
Ill send you whats left of the box i have, i think i might have a few more random light .224s also gotta dig to the bottom of the brass drawer...they been downgraded from the bullet drawer....
Hahahaha! You're making them feel like subclass bullets doing that!!!
 
Lol, well since i dont shoot any centerfire .22s right now they got moved....found some 65sgks, but it seems i already got rid if the other .224s
 
Lol, well since i dont shoot any centerfire .22s right now they got moved....found some 65sgks, but it seems i already got rid if the other .224s
You might wanna hang onto those sgks in case you get back into the .22 game, might make a good load for your kid's first axis.........ermmm no, you don't need another gun...
 
It's velocity that causes bullets to disintegrate not the twist. The rate of twist is about stability for heavy bullets.
Anyway, there's a formula here for determining the twist rate.
http://www.chuckhawks.com/rifling_twist_rate.htm
From the article you linked ROTFLMAO
"A faster twist increases pressure, barrel wear and also the strain on the bullet jacket, which can actually come apart if spun too fast. This particularly applies to frangible varmint bullets, which have very thin jackets, fired at high velocity in very fast twist barrels, such as the 1 in 7" twist barrels supplied on many .223/5.56mn AR-15 type rifles."
 
I do have a 1-9" twist .22-250 Ackley and it does cause the "varmit" type bullets I use in my regular 1-14" twist Browning B-78 .22-25-0 to trace with some kind of shedding of jacket. The 60 grain and heavier bullets I shoot in the fast twist .22-.250 do'nt do that nor do the lighter monolitic copper or FMJ ones
 
Then why do (at nearly identical velocities) the varmageddon bullets shred out of a fast twist, but make it to the target in a slower twist? I understand what twist does, and to quote from the very article you posted:
"A faster twist increases pressure, barrel wear and also the strain on the bullet jacket, which can actually come apart if spun too fast. This particularly applies to frangible varmint bullets, which have very thin jackets, fired at high velocity in very fast twist barrels, such as the 1 in 7" twist barrels supplied on many .223/5.56mn AR-15 type rifles."
Bullets shredding out of fast twist is more of a construction issue not a stability issue. More twist and fast heavy bullet would work on paper, however its not realistic to the average construction of average bullet designs.
 
I do have a 1-9" twist .22-250 Ackley and it does cause the "varmit" type bullets I use in my regular 1-14" twist Browning B-78 .22-25-0 to trace with some kind of shedding of jacket. The 60 grain and heavier bullets I shoot in the fast twist .22-.250 do'nt do that nor do the lighter monolitic copper or FMJ ones
Thank you! THAT was helpful!!
 
Well, I know he's a big vmax fan, but I turned him onto my sxsp loads quite awhile back, so we'll probably test some kind of vmax, both the sgks, it appears they make a high velocity sp 55 gr that I had missed before now somehow, and a few monometals for giggles in the lightweight sections and then of course move up to the long heavies for his longer reaching serious business!
I'd like to thank everyone for their input and assistance thus far, and will welcome pointers on anything that hasn't already been covered.
 
Bullets shredding out of fast twist is more of a construction issue not a stability issue. More twist and fast heavy bullet would work on paper, however its not realistic to the average construction of average bullet designs.
True enough, but nobody buys a .22-250 for average performance ;) trying to figure out which cakes are available to be eaten;):)
 
Fast spin can make thin jackets fall victim to centrifugal force. Bullets designed to merely expand from a .22 Hornet often blow up when goosed by 1,000 feet per second and more.

My vague memory has it that there is a "Blitz" bullet that the maker says it's not for use in such as the .22-250 or the .220 Swift...
yes, my grandfather loaded blitz bullets up in his 220 swift and blew them up half way to the 100 yard target. all he saw (this anectdote per my father present at the time) was a grey puff of smoke.

murf
 
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