What's the best choice for a defensive round in 40 S&W

whatnickname said:

police agencies are forced to consider ammunition on the basis of things like the ability of a given round to penetrate barriers such as car bodies and automotive glas

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I don't know about your area, but in the Chicagoland area carjackings are becoming more and more common.

This morning three men blocked off a highway entrance ramp, a few weeks ago carjackers "bumped" a car and when the woman got out to exchange insurance, they took her car, about three weeks prior, carjackers took a couple out of their car right on a fairly busy downtown street of a Chicago suburb.

https://patch.com/illinois/newlenox/carjacking-reported-new-lenox

You may need a round that is capable of going through car glass or a car door and still be effective.




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It wasn't listed, but I like 180 grain HST.
I voted 180 Grain Gold Dot.
The 165 grain HST is a little to snappy for me in terms of recoil.
Not that recoil bothers me, but in a self defense situation a follow up shot may be slower to do with the little extra snap.
The 180 grain seems to have less recoil and has great statistics on paper work.
It also seems that more police departments use 180 grain for these reasons.

Rexster said:

Well, the good news about .40 S&W, is that all the decent duty loads seem to work well, if the shooter does his part in placing the rounds well. We have to buy our own duty ammo, within guidelines, and for while, Gold Dot was very popular, due to local availability, and lately, Hornady Critical Duty was been more available, with Gold Dots becoming difficult to find. Winchester Ranger has a local following, too.

I returned to using 9mm and .45 ACP duty pistols, starting in 2015, because shooting started to hurt, about age fifty. Yes, .45 ACP has more recoil than .40S&W, on paper, but .40 S&W seems to have more Snap & Whip, pun intended. Plus, all-steel, full-sized 1911 pistols have a nicely low bore axis, and pleny of mass to damp the suddenness of the recoil impulse. Yes, I can, indeed, carry a 1911 in my duty holster, in one of the largest cities in the USA. Life is good. (As a matter of practicality, however, a G19 works better, as a duty pistol, while inside our terribly small new patrol vehicles, particularly with a right-hand holster, while in the passenger seat, or a left-hand holster, while in the driver's seat. I wear a size 34 duty belt, so being "big" is not the issue.)

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I guess the .40 duty loads penetrate enough as written above. In the past I've wondered if they didn't. On video I saw the aftermath of a bad guy shot twice in the upper torso by a LEO. I remember seeing the perp being led away in cuffs after he was shot. The way he was walking looked like he wasn't shot, which is to say like nothing happened. Maybe he was hit in the upper chest/lower shoulder area.

The steel CZ 75 is available in .40 to dampen the recoil.

That's neat you're able to carry a 1911. In New York, Boston, or LA, hell would probably have to freeze over before LEOs could chose a 1911.

Any hollow point from the major manufacturers is fine with me. Winchester/Federal/Remington all make a good defensive cartridge. Of the ones on the survey, I'd choose the HST/Gold Dot/Golden Saber, and in that order. I prefer something in the 165gn range.
str1

C0untZer0 said:

You may need a round that is capable of going through car glass or a car door and still be effective.

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Is truncated cone good for car glass?

I was always partial to the 175gr Critical Defense. ( Ny buddy told me to go with Zombie Max same Hornady load but a bit cheaper)

peacebutready said:

Is truncated cone good for car glass?

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You don't have to get a truncated FMJ, there are hollow points that pass the FBI tests and are in service, so they're proven to go through glass and have good terminal ballistics afterward. Federal's HST is one of those, Winchester PDX, Winchester 165 and 180gr bonded, Hornady Critical Duty 175gr... and others.

Almost any law enforcement ammo will go through auto glass and penetrate 12 to 18 inches afterwards.

I've heard a few people, Hornady reps, ShootingTheBull410 and others say that non-law enforcement people don't need the law enforcement ammo because they're not going to be shooting through barriers.

I'm just saying that in a car jacking situation - that might be exactly what you need to do...

Before retiring we were issued 165 gn hst for duty glock 22 and 23 and have used them for years. Agency still uses them and have had nothing but success with them afaik.

"Best choice" is going to get a lot of responses. In all honesty, there are a lot of great options and the best choice will depend on your particular firearm, sight picture, muzzle velocity, etc. For 40S&W, I would stick to the 180gr options since that is what the factory sights are typically based upon. If your handgun does not shoot to the sights vertically, then it may be worth trying other weights. There are a lot of opinions, but truthfully, one cannot hardly go wrong when buying top of the line defensive ammo. Federal HST; Speer Gold Dot; Winchester Ranger Bonded, T series, PDX1 - all great options. With Hornady, make sure to go with the Critical DEFENSE since it's made for the HD/CC market and attains great terminal performance in CCW's. The Critical DUTY is a great product when used it in a full-size handgun AND you need to shoot through a barrier - but for HD/CC use, it's way too tough and most likely won't expand in shorter barreled handguns. Hornady does not hide this info. I have no experience with the Remington Golden Saber or the GS bonded - I'm sure there great as well.
In years past, there were a lot of unknowns and only personal accounts of terminal performance. People opined for ages how the Hydra shok compared to the Silvertip and others. Now, so much factory R&D and testing is done to get consistent mushrooms that the playing field is very level. Although, I'm sure ballistic gelatin manufacturers are probably still kicking themselves for not investing in Youtube!