The sad quality of Marlin firearms nowadays

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I just picked up a new 1895 guide gun that was sent direct from the factory.

IMG_3021.jpg

My first impressions were that I didn't think much of the metal finish. The receiver is half matte bead blasted blued finish and the sides have been finished with some type of belt sander looking finish. I don't care for it and I wish it was all gloss blued but that sort of finish is rare these days. There are no burrs or sharp edges on the outside of the gun and the finish on the barrel, barrel band, and mag tube is very nice. The wood is of good quality walnut but was very flat and dry when I took it out of the package. The forend shape does not really fit the end cap and receiver which leaves end grain exposed on both ends, but it is even and fits well and is tight. The buttstock is very nice except the slot for the upper tang is cut about an 1/8" too long leaving a small gap between the end of the tang and the stock. The checkering is very chincy on both the forend and buttstock. The wood does not match between the forend and buttstock. The forend is lighter color. The sights and all fittings were straight and tight and well assembled. It had one of the heaviest triggers I've ever encountered on a gun, probably 8 or 9 pounds. I took it apart and did a trigger job on it down to a nice 4 or 5 pounds. The action was reasonably smooth and did not require any internal smoothing. I cycled the action 100 times or so on the couch and it smoothed out well on its own. Finally I gave the stock a very liberal coat of RemOil and let it sit over night to soak into the wood. It now has a very attractive semi gloss sheen and the grain really came out.

This will be a working gun for me so the aesthetic nit picks are not a big deal to me since all the mechanical's are in order. It has and overall solid and quality feel and I am happy with my purchase and would buy it again. I paid $430 shipped for it plus $25 for transfer, and I sent in for the $100 mail in rebate. For $355 total cash outlay for a new lever action 45-70 I think I did very well.
 
BigBore44 said:
Which is kind of my point Craig. But this isn't a "one guy gets" situation. This has been going on for years. Many people have gotten them. And yet you didn't. You got a great example of how they should be. So what changed from your rifle to the OP's?

I don't expect a $450 rifle to have the fit and finish of a $20K H&H. I don't even think it's realistic the have one be of the same standards of any mid/upper end lever rifle. But I would expect the sights to line up vertically on the barrel, metal to wood fit to not have massive gaps, barrel bands tight, and an action that doesn't require a night of working the lever with properly applied lapping compound to operate semi-smoothly. Obviously from your example, you purchased what what I'm referring to.
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Oh I realize that after Remington moved productions there were a lot of problems. I was referring more to the later guns and just in gener. It happens all the time with other manufacturers too. One guy gets one bad example and now quality control is dead!


someguy2800 said:
My first impressions were that I didn't think much of the metal finish. The receiver is half matte bead blasted blued finish and the sides have been finished with some type of belt sander looking finish. I don't care for it and I wish it was all gloss blued but that sort of finish is rare these days. There are no burrs or sharp edges on the outside of the gun and the finish on the barrel, barrel band, and mag tube is very nice. The wood is of good quality walnut but was very flat and dry when I took it out of the package. The forend shape does not really fit the end cap and receiver which leaves end grain exposed on both ends, but it is even and fits well and is tight. The buttstock is very nice except the slot for the upper tang is cut about an 1/8" too long leaving a small gap between the end of the tang and the stock. The checkering is very chincy on both the forend and buttstock. The wood does not match between the forend and buttstock. The forend is lighter color. The sights and all fittings were straight and tight and well assembled. It had one of the heaviest triggers I've ever encountered on a gun, probably 8 or 9 pounds. I took it apart and did a trigger job on it down to a nice 4 or 5 pounds. The action was reasonably smooth and did not require any internal smoothing. I cycled the action 100 times or so on the couch and it smoothed out well on its own. Finally I gave the stock a very liberal coat of RemOil and let it sit over night to soak into the wood. It now has a very attractive semi gloss sheen and the grain really came out.

This will be a working gun for me so the aesthetic nit picks are not a big deal to me since all the mechanical's are in order. It has and overall solid and quality feel and I am happy with my purchase and would buy it again. I paid $430 shipped for it plus $25 for transfer, and I sent in for the $100 mail in rebate. For $355 total cash outlay for a new lever action 45-70 I think I did very well.
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Have you never picked up a new Marlin at any time in the last 30yrs? They have never been top drawer for fit and finish. The metal finish you describe was much worse 20yrs ago, long before Remington, than it is now.
 
CraigC said:
Have you never picked up a new Marlin at any time in the last 30yrs? They have never been top drawer for fit and finish. The metal finish you describe was much worse 20yrs ago, long before Remington, than it is now.
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I never said anything about old vs new Marlins, I'm just giving my impressions of what I thought of mine good and bad. The metal finish thing is subjective, some may love the bead blasted finish, I don't care for it. I've shot maybe a half dozen older marlins and they were all good quality utilitarian guns, as is my new one. There is nothing on my gun that I would consider as a quality problem.

The gun shop that did my FFL had a new 336 on the shelf that was really poor. The wood was a really cheap looking blonde finish, the whole gun was a matte bead blasted finish, and the magazine tube was just flopping around. I would not buy that gun.

edit:

I believe this is the one they had which I looked at. I think this is the economy model they sell at larger retailers.

https://www.marlinfirearms.com/lever-action/model-336/model-336w

I have looked at a few 336C's which I thought were nice quality guns with good finish

https://www.marlinfirearms.com/lever-action/model-336/model-336c-30-30-win
 
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The thread is new vs old(er). The point is that they have LOOOOONG been a little rough in the metal finish department. The new guns are actually better than those we typically compare them to.
 
Here is my take on this. Let's take a $400 Marlin lever at Walmart. So we have a $400 rifle. So now you have QC has been getting called for lighter shadings between the stock and fore end. Now we add 3 inspectors who do nothing but check the wood on every rifle. Price goes up. We have another complaint, the actions are tight and not smooth. Now we hire another guy to do nothing but check the actions. Price goes up. On top of these people we now have to hire other people who do nothing but replace the wood if it has different shading. One per shift for a total every 3. Price goes up. Now we have to hire more people whose soul job is to make the actions like butter. Price goes up. All the meanwhile products getting out the door are slowed by all the extra work involved. No product going out, means no product on the shelf. All the while the price is climbing. A $400 rifle is now $550 and the retailer won't get them for 2mos due to backlog.

Canted sights are one thing that I would not stand for though. They should automatically reject those. Period. I also wish the triggers were at least a little trigger.
 
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Moparnut said:
Here is my take on this. Let's take a $400 Marlin lever at Walmart. So we have a $400 rifle. So now you have QC has been getting called for lighter shadings between the stock and fore end. Now we add 3 inspectors who do nothing but check the wood on every rifle. Price goes up. We have another complaint, the actions are tight and not smooth. Now we hire another guy to do nothing but check the actions. Price goes up. On top of these people we now have to hire other people who do nothing but replace the wood if it has different shading. One per shift for a total every 3. Price goes up. Now we have to hire more people whose soul job is to make the actions like butter. Price goes up. All the meanwhile products getting out the door are slowed by all the extra work involved. No product going out, means no product on the shelf. All the while the price is climbing. A $400 rifle is now $550 and the retailer won't get them for 2mos due to backlog.

Canted sights are one thing that I would not stand for though. They should automatically reject those. Period. I also wish the triggers were at least a little trigger.
Click to expand...
I say fire the guy who inspects brakes on your car! I mean you don't really need them right? Just another worthless employee! These things should be checked by the person assembling them and not a dedicated inspector!
 
From the many reports I've perused and from my own experiences over the past couple of decades or so, it seems that some firearm makers, long known for their excellence in workmanship and quality, have become more known now for producing less than stellar examples of second rate products. My solution for the "problem" has been to buy used quality firearms from yesteryear and avoiding newer guns of today exhibiting shoddy and questionable workmanship. I sincerely hope that changes for the good are not far away.
 
ohihunter2014 said:
I say fire the guy who inspects brakes on your car! I mean you don't really need them right? Just another worthless employee! These things should be checked by the person assembling them and not a dedicated inspector!
Click to expand...


That was just an example of what can happen. Two of the biggest complaints about Marlins are their wood mismatch and actions being stiff. I am assuming the stock and fore end may not even come from the same piece of wood. My guess would be they make stocks out of one and fore ends out of the other. If they were to make them out of the same piece I believe the amount of unused wood would be enormous. Not to mention guy in production grabs a 1 of each out of the bin. Doesn't match. Now he scrounges around looking for a better match. Lost time, lost production, lost money.
Secondly, the action. Smooth, install, check. Repeat as many times as necessary. Gets pretty expensive, really fast.
 
Moparnut said:
Here is my take on this. Let's take a $400 Marlin lever at Walmart. So we have a $400 rifle. So now you have QC has been getting called for lighter shadings between the stock and fore end. Now we add 3 inspectors who do nothing but check the wood on every rifle. Price goes up. We have another complaint, the actions are tight and not smooth. Now we hire another guy to do nothing but check the actions. Price goes up. On top of these people we now have to hire other people who do nothing but replace the wood if it has different shading. One per shift for a total every 3. Price goes up. Now we have to hire more people whose soul job is to make the actions like butter. Price goes up. All the meanwhile products getting out the door are slowed by all the extra work involved. No product going out, means no product on the shelf. All the while the price is climbing. A $400 rifle is now $550 and the retailer won't get them for 2mos due to backlog.

Canted sights are one thing that I would not stand for though. They should automatically reject those. Period. I also wish the triggers were at least a little trigger.
Click to expand...

This is a great point. It's best to look at guns at the Marlin levergun price point as kit guns, to a degree. Assuming the rifle functions reliably and is acceptably mechanically accurate, tweaks and improvements can be made over time. I have an additional $200 in my $500 1894, but I was able to spend that $200 over a longer period of time which is less painful to me than ponying up $700 on the spot for a gun of that price.

For example, my rifle out of the box was of course a little rough action wise, had a smoldering dumpster fire of a trigger, and Marlin levergun sights have always been pretty useless, IMO. So, I installed a WWG trigger for $120 and while I had everything taken apart, I polished some of the internal parts. After an hour of cursing and aggravation, I had everything back together and a much smoother gun. I also invested in a Skinner peep sight ($80) and while I haven't tried that out at the range yet, I really like how fast it lines up.

Maybe some day I'll have the money I need to have an 1894 converted into the configuration I really want, which is a stainless, all weather version with a synthetic stock some other color than black, with an 18" barrel and an XS peep/sight scope rail combo. That project will have to wait til I have a way better job though.
 
EVERY company I've EVER worked for had its share of bad employees. Is it remotely possible that Remington/Marlin has at least one bad employee that would let a rifle with issues ship to a distributor?

EVERY new vehicle I've EVER owned required warranty work. Three firearms I've bought new required warranty work, I've bought more new firearms than I have vehicles. It seems to me some people hold firearms makers to an impossibly high standard.
 
cdb1 said:
EVERY company I've EVER worked for had its share of bad employees. Is it remotely possible that Remington/Marlin has at least one bad employee that would let a rifle with issues ship to a distributor?

EVERY new vehicle I've EVER owned required warranty work. Three firearms I've bought new required warranty work, I've bought more new firearms than I have vehicles. It seems to me some people hold firearms makers to an impossibly high standard.
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Some days, I think Remington is just like the big kid at the end of the road. Everybody wants to beat him down, just because he is the biggest kid they know.
Remington is a firearms juggernaut, I think alot of people just like to kick them around because of it, and yes, every company has a crappy employee in the woodwork.
 
Jason_W said:
It's best to look at guns at the Marlin levergun price point as kit guns, to a degree.
Click to expand...

Not me. If I want a "kit" gun, I'll buy a box filled with parts and plan on finishing them and putting them together to eventually make a gun at a drastically reduced price because I supplied the labor instead of the maker. If I purchase a firearm already finished and "put together", I expect it to be fully ready to use and to be appreciated for its acceptable if not fine workmanship-regardless of "price point" or labor costs. If it costs more to make right, then sell it for more or don't sell it at all.
People who continue to make excuses for manufacturers who turn out guns evidencing subpar quality are only enabling continued shoddy workmanship and buyer disappointment.
 
SwampWolf said:
Not me. If I want a "kit" gun, I'll buy a box filled with parts and plan on finishing them and putting them together to eventually make a gun at a drastically reduced price because I supplied the labor instead of the maker. If I purchase a firearm already finished and "put together", I expect it to be fully ready to use and to be appreciated for its acceptable if not fine workmanship-regardless of "price point" or labor costs. If it costs more to make right, then sell it for more or don't sell it at all.
People who continue to make excuses for manufacturers who turn out guns evidencing subpar quality are only enabling continued shoddy workmanship and buyer disappointment.
Click to expand...

Lemons not withstanding, a Marlin is still a functional rifle for $400-$500. I had a pre Remington 1894C for years that was great little carbine, but it was not exactly smooth right out of the box and the wood quality, fit finish, etc. was no better than my Remlin.

Name another current production levergun in that price range that has better fit, finish, reliability, etc. In fact, the only other levers in that range are Rossi and Mossberg, both of which get wildly mixed reviews. Now, a person could save another couple hundred and go with a Henry (which is a much smoother, more polished gun out of the box) but the lack of a loading gate is a deal breaker for most people.
 
SwampWolf said:
Not me. If I want a "kit" gun, I'll buy a box filled with parts and plan on finishing them and putting them together to eventually make a gun at a drastically reduced price because I supplied the labor instead of the maker. If I purchase a firearm already finished and "put together", I expect it to be fully ready to use and to be appreciated for its acceptable if not fine workmanship-regardless of "price point" or labor costs. If it costs more to make right, then sell it for more or don't sell it at all.
People who continue to make excuses for manufacturers who turn out guns evidencing subpar quality are only enabling continued shoddy workmanship and buyer disappointment.
Click to expand...

Quality is kinda a perception of what people expect. To me quality is usually function, reliability and accuracy. Not necessarily wood grains, hues or how tight a bolt/action may be. As far as shoddy workmanship, to me if the rifle has good tolerances, won't blow my face off or have to be sent back, every time I shoot it, for a different reason. Is not really shoddy. Canted sights would be a sign of shoddy workmanship to me.
 
After I get my rebate in, I will have $350 in a brand new Guide Gun. When I compare it to my revered JM 1894, the quality between the two is very similar. To the OP, the sight hoods are the same. Wood to metal fit is a bit better on the GG. The forearm on the 1894 has rounded edges vise the squared off edges of the newer Marlins. The 1894 is stainless, so it is kinda hard to compare metal finish, but both are fine. I have yet to shoot the GG, but it WILL be more accurate than the 1894. The wood on both is pretty nice. The GG has a little more figure, but that's luck of the draw.

OP, it sounds like you got a bad one. I would call Remington and send it back. I have had better luck with newer Remingtons than I have had with Rugers.
 
SwampWolf said:
Not me. If I want a "kit" gun, I'll buy a box filled with parts and plan on finishing them and putting them together to eventually make a gun at a drastically reduced price because I supplied the labor instead of the maker. If I purchase a firearm already finished and "put together", I expect it to be fully ready to use and to be appreciated for its acceptable if not fine workmanship-regardless of "price point" or labor costs. If it costs more to make right, then sell it for more or don't sell it at all.
People who continue to make excuses for manufacturers who turn out guns evidencing subpar quality are only enabling continued shoddy workmanship and buyer disappointment.
Click to expand...

Don't buy a Ruger if you have that expectation. My SR22 would not make it through a magazine without jamming. I had to completely disassemble it, clean it, lightly lube it and put it back together. My AR223 had to be sent back. Magazines wouldn't seat. My Hawkeye Predator had a bur on the bolt face I had to smooth down. It leaves nasty scratches on the brass when I cycle ammo through. My SP101s sights cannot be adjusted to hit the point of aim. I have the rear sight elevation screw backed all the way out and it still won't hit the point of aim. The stainless finish on it is rough. My Ruger Charger was shipped with a non-functioning 15 round magazine. It does function well with 10 round magazines.
 
I take apart and modify every gun I buy in some way usually before I ever shoot it. Most guns of mine get a trigger job and some smoothing at a minimum. I'm okay with that and I enjoy doing it. My ruger sp101 is my favorite gun I own but it took 5 hours of polishing and tuning and Wolff springs to get it that way. I guess if I didn't want to do any work I would have to either buy nicer guns or put up with clunky ones. The only gun I own that is 100% unbodified is a BPS shotgun. By my standards my guide gun was one of the nicer guns I've bought as it took no more work than a trigger job to make it acceptable.
 
hdwhit said:
From that, can I take it that you ordered this gun sight-unseen and had it shipped to a nearby FFL and that's the first time you saw it?
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If I wanted one, that's how I'd have to do it. Unless someone dropped something in on consignment or trade-in, no store local to me has *any* lever guns in stock.
 
Moparnut said:
Quality is kinda a perception of what people expect. To me quality is usually function, reliability and accuracy. Not necessarily wood grains, hues or how tight a bolt/action may be. As far as shoddy workmanship, to me if the rifle has good tolerances, won't blow my face off or have to be sent back, every time I shoot it, for a different reason. Is not really shoddy. Canted sights would be a sign of shoddy workmanship to me.
Click to expand...

We obviously have different ideas as to what passes for "quality" these days. In addition to other quality control complaints concerning recent Marlin firearms cited in this thread (I'm not referencing "lemons" which, as has been noted, any company is susceptible to) RWMC (the op) referenced having an off-center front sight, a flimsy front sight hood, unsealed wood grain, terrible checkering and a butt plate that was markedly off-center on his new Marlin. When it comes to "perception", this so-called quality is not what I would expect in any new rifle, Marlin or otherwise.
Some people have apparently come to expect shoddy workmanship from Marlin simply because, it's claimed, Marlin has a long history of selling rifles having mediocre quality. Just because you've always done it this way (which has not been my experience, by the way, in the case of Marlin) is no excuse for continuing to do it this way. That's a great formula for going out of business.
Most of the dissatisfactions evidenced here seem to be cosmetic in nature and easily corrected if employees would just take pride in their product. As I opined earlier, if it costs more to make it right (a decently finished and fitted rifle), then sell it for more-or don't sell it at all. This is not an "impossibly high standard" to measure up to.
 
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With the new ones: The barrels are good shooters. Nothing wrong there. If you can get one where the other QC issues do not overcome this, then you have a good rifle.
 
someguy2800 said:
I just picked up a new 1895 guide gun that was sent direct from the factory.

View attachment 760111

My first impressions were that I didn't think much of the metal finish. The receiver is half matte bead blasted blued finish and the sides have been finished with some type of belt sander looking finish. I don't care for it and I wish it was all gloss blued but that sort of finish is rare these days. There are no burrs or sharp edges on the outside of the gun and the finish on the barrel, barrel band, and mag tube is very nice. The wood is of good quality walnut but was very flat and dry when I took it out of the package. The forend shape does not really fit the end cap and receiver which leaves end grain exposed on both ends, but it is even and fits well and is tight. The buttstock is very nice except the slot for the upper tang is cut about an 1/8" too long leaving a small gap between the end of the tang and the stock. The checkering is very chincy on both the forend and buttstock. The wood does not match between the forend and buttstock. The forend is lighter color. The sights and all fittings were straight and tight and well assembled. It had one of the heaviest triggers I've ever encountered on a gun, probably 8 or 9 pounds. I took it apart and did a trigger job on it down to a nice 4 or 5 pounds. The action was reasonably smooth and did not require any internal smoothing. I cycled the action 100 times or so on the couch and it smoothed out well on its own. Finally I gave the stock a very liberal coat of RemOil and let it sit over night to soak into the wood. It now has a very attractive semi gloss sheen and the grain really came out.

This will be a working gun for me so the aesthetic nit picks are not a big deal to me since all the mechanical's are in order. It has and overall solid and quality feel and I am happy with my purchase and would buy it again. I paid $430 shipped for it plus $25 for transfer, and I sent in for the $100 mail in rebate. For $355 total cash outlay for a new lever action 45-70 I think I did very well.
Click to expand...
What is a lever 45-70 best used for? All of mine have been 30-30.
 
mshootnit said:
What is a lever 45-70 best used for? All of mine have been 30-30.
Click to expand...

Making half inch wide holes in animals that want to eat you. I think it will be a great 150 yard deer rifle with moderate loads.

I have taken a real liking to straight wall rifle cartridges. I also bought a 357 maximum and a 444 marlin handi rifle this year and love them both.
 
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