Gunsmith "Rule"?

The smith can make whatever rules he wants to. And so can you.

frogfurr said:

The smith can make whatever rules he wants to. And so can you.

Click to expand...

Yup. Maybe he has some weird insurance, maybe there was an incident and an adjust claimed it was 'negligently adjusted', maybe he just has personal complaints about some kind of quirk or return-on-investment on any extra time it takes to set it to a certain point.
Who knows? He has his reason, good or no, and you can either find his work otherwise acceptable and keep with him or find it worthwhile to find another smith in the future. Couldn't blame you for either.

It may simply be that if you want it lighter, you will have to do the adjustment yourself which relieves him of some liability concerns.
One standard policy may be what is prompting this.

Not sure what model you have but most Timneys are capable of being adjusted by the user.

Everyone wants to sue someone even if they are the ones to screw up. I think the GS is covering his A-- and feels like 3 pounds is a safe limit for someone who he has no idea of their skills. Thats why factory triggers are so heavy. A light trigger can get people shot in the wrong situation..

We live in an era where people want to hold everyone for ransom, even if the accidents that they caused was their fault. They do not want to hold themselves accountable, instead want to blame everyone...just like the woman that sued McDonalds’s because she spilled hot coffee on herself and supposed burned herself...duh! It’s hot coffee.

I made a couple varmint shooters sign waivers before I set their triggers down below 2 lbs. I still have the originals of the waivers.

His shop his rules. He has reasons for the rule and it sounds as though the rest of what he did was up to your satisfaction so use him for other things or just tweak the trigger yourself after he has done his good work each time. It will be interesting if others have had such similar interactions with their gun smith in the past.

I’ve had a gunsmith tell me that he wouldn’t adjust a trigger on a hunting rifle at less than 3 pounds; he explained that he knew I might be wearing gloves while hunting, and less than 3 pounds could be dangerous. I appreciated his honesty, and the trigger broke so clean after his work that it was just fine.

But yeah, lawyers have screwed things up so much in the United States; but as long as the lawyers make lots of money, that’s all that matters.

It's not just the lawyers but also the person who hired the lawyer. Money for nothing, and the blame for free.

If he does good work, adjust the trigger yourself and hang on to him.

Sniper66 said:

Said his insurance policy would not allow him to do it.

Click to expand...

Time to find another gunsmith. A professional will do exactly what the customer wants as long as it's legal and safe. It's not the job of a gunsmith or his insurance company to take responsibility for user-induced problems.

As has been stated I'm sure he's just covering his rear. I expect he must assume that any number of his customers may be walking around breaking Jeff Coopers #3 rule with fingers inside the trigger guard. Not that a 3 pound trigger, or 10 solves the problem but at least it bends things in his favor in court.

hq said:

Time to find another gunsmith. A professional will do exactly what the customer wants as long as it's legal and safe. It's not the job of a gunsmith or his insurance company to take responsibility for user-induced problems.

Click to expand...

Very naïve comment.

Ruger redesigned the Blackhawk (1973) to use a transfer bar after losing a large lawsuit when a owner managed to shoot himself.

It is not up to you to decide what is legal and safe. It will be up to the District Attorney to decide if the work was the result of criminal negligence and the jury deciding your case in a criminal and resulting several million dollars personal injury lawsuit.

BSA1 said:

It is not up to you to decide what is legal and safe.

Click to expand...

Legal isn't a matter of individual discretion. Safe is. How much the government intervenes in personal responsibility for one's actions varies quite a bit by jurisdiction, of course. In my neck of the woods people are probably so "naive" that pretty much the only products that have warning stickers of any kind on them are either tobacco products or imported.

hq said:

Time to find another gunsmith. A professional will do exactly what the customer wants as long as it's legal and safe. It's not the job of a gunsmith or his insurance company to take responsibility for user-induced problems.

Click to expand...

Apparently Finland isn't as sue happy, and Finnish juries (or jurists) dimwitted enough to reward idiots as they are here.

entropy said:

Apparently Finland isn't as sue happy, and Finnish juries (or jurists) dimwitted enough to reward idiots as they are here.

Click to expand...

Self-evident causalities like sticking your fingers in a running lawnmower resulting in them being severed or spilling hot coffee on your lap causing burns are taken as common knowledge instead of unexpected surprises. Anything this side of having your cell phone spontaneously combust in your pocket and burning you into a crisp will reward you zilch in court. Unless you count the judge laughing his a__ off before dismissing the case as such...

hq said:

Time to find another gunsmith. A professional will do exactly what the customer wants as long as it's legal and safe. It's not the job of a gunsmith or his insurance company to take responsibility for user-induced problems.

Click to expand...

You wouldn't say that if you had lived in the USA your whole life. Things have gotten really stupid here.

Sniper66 said:

I recently had a trigger installed by a new gunsmith and he declined to set the trigger ( a new Timney) below 3 lbs. I prefer mine to about 2 lbs. Said his insurance policy would not allow him to do it. I know, I know....I should do it myself. I plan to look for another smith, but good ones are hard to find since my previous smith/friend died. Is this guy just being unnecessarily cautious or have you heard of such policies?? I'll appreciate your thoughts.

Click to expand...

I did have a gunsmith tell me he would stop at 3 1/2. He said anything lighter was, in his opinion, patently "unsafe".... Frankly, 3 1/2 or even 3 is fine with me. They (the gunsmiths) may be considering personal liability. I don't know.

A 3 lb or even 5 lb trigger pull is light enough be able to shoot more accurately than most rifles, shooters, and ammo are capable of. The important thing is that it be crisp and consistent. Three pounds is as light as I'd want, and I can do just fine with a heavier trigger as long as it is consistent.

My only beef would be that I have a high powered silhouette rifle and the rules allow a 2 pound trigger. I certainly do not want to handicapped myself with a 3 pound trigger. I like 2.25 pound trigger to keep me on the safe side of the rules. If the NRA Ssilhouette committee thought 2 pounds was unsafe they would bump up the pull weight.

Rifles also go through tech inspection in part to ensure the firearms are safe.

If you like the Smith's work then keep using him and follow Timney's instructions on how to adjust the trigger pull weight.

Sniper66 said:

I recently had a trigger installed by a new gunsmith and he declined to set the trigger ( a new Timney) below 3 lbs. I prefer mine to about 2 lbs. Said his insurance policy would not allow him to do it. I know, I know....I should do it myself. I plan to look for another smith, but good ones are hard to find since my previous smith/friend died. Is this guy just being unnecessarily cautious or have you heard of such policies?? I'll appreciate your thoughts.

Click to expand...

I read through this thread & then I went back to the original OP's post. It looks like he told you about his trigger weight rule ahead of time. So I don't fault the 'smith, but I agree with your plan to look for a new one.

FWIW...

Sniper66 said:

The model I bought says it is adjustable from 1.5 to 4lbs, which is why I was puzzled by the smith's policy. He promised to make it crisp, which he did. And it is in my Rem 700 .243 deer rifle, so it is fine for it's purpose. I'll probably make other arrangements for future trigger jobs (prairie dog rifles), but he did the work quickly as he promised and for a reasonable price. So, I'm certainly not bad mouthing him. And I'll see about adjusting it myself in the future.

Click to expand...

When I was in business for myself, I discovered your insurance agent(if he's a good one) will give you some risk management tips/advice as part of their customer service. Sometimes you take that advice as policy. Also, when you can claim it's your insurance making the rules, customers don't make you out to be the Bad Guy to them, just an honest businessman followin' rules. If they think it's your rule, they tend to whine more and beg longer for you to bend that rule. I myself would not want a deer rifle trigger less than three pounds on my deer rifle. While 'nother 1/4" at a hundred yards might make or break a competition, it ain't gonna matter on a deer. You said he made it crisp and that is probably more important than taking 'nother 1/2# or so off the pull. Most honest 'smiths have honest opinions.

I once owned part of a manufacturing company. We had 2 employees get in a knife fight while at work, fired them, and were sued for unlawful discharge. It went nowhere in court but we still had the hassle. Some lawyers search out clients and file suits for the chance to get companies to offer to settle rather than go to court. I understand you gunsmith's position, but if something happens, he's still in the crosshairs of somebody looking to make a quick buck.