Hand loads for self defense?

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Mr_Flintstone

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I have always used commercial ammo in my SD/HD guns. That said, what are your thoughts on using hand loads for self defense? In addition to possible reliability issues, I have heard there are various legal reasons why you shouldn't use hand loads. Just wondering what your take on the issue is?
 
If the distance the shot was taken becomes a question, the inability to replicate the powder burns/unburned powder stippling by forensic testing of your gun and the ammo used will leave that question hanging if you are using handloads.

About 1968 or so I examined a gun kept by a person for home defense; the ammo was from three different makers, a few were fresh looking, some were badly tarnished, and the gunshot residue and powder stippling would probably have varied from shot to shot.

ADDED: An "indict a ham sandwich for burning the Hindenberg" prosecutor might make use of handloads as proof of a depraved mind seeking unusual and dangerous mayhem (you bloodthirsty brute you). My handloads tend to be wimpy for maximum accuracy and minimum stress on my gun. For defensive use I do choose factory +P JHP because that's what the police use. Except the first round up in my revolver is a shotshell because my anticipated self defensive use has been against snakes first, rabid animals next, carjackers third.
 
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I have loaded over 750,000 rounds of ammo since 89 and had one squib 18 years ago. I trust my loads completely, and I just couldn’t possibly insult myself and buy self defense ammo that I’m not sure of. It could possibly work, I don’t know. Mine will and I also know mine is loaded for accuracy in each gun I load for. I implicitly trust my ammo to do what it needs to do so long as I put it where it needs to go.
 
I load my own SD rounds and have never been concerned about legal issues for using it. The components that commercial ammo is made from is widely available, gold dot, XTP, HST, for example. I work up loads from established sources and tested. I don't go to extreme with wild hot loads or anything out of the ordinary
 
I’m loading gold dots with be-86 and I’m finishing up my second thousand of them. They aren’t full power, but They are dead nuts reliable and accurate. To me that is most important.

Keep in mind, the odds of ever having to use them are incredibly slim, and unless you do something questionable them ammo should never come into play.
 
My thought is I trust my hand loads but for SD I prefer factory ammo.
(and I always shoot a box out of the lot I am going to use)
That way in case I ever needed to use it, nothing could be brought up about using special "killer" hand loads.
Distance to target could be established if necessary, etc.
Should it make a difference, no, but if it might it's not worth the risk.
Lots of different feelings on this, but that's my take.

off thread but
wrench459, not the saw, the BFG9000.
I remember (years ago) the pink monsters used to scare my 6 year old niece to death (had to leave the computer and the room and come get me) until she found the saw and could saw them, then she was good to go.
The pistol was tough when deal with the pink monsters,shotgun was better, but the saw was best:)
 
i load all my defense ammo. i prefer to do all the checks myself and know that everything is 100% correct. i once read somewhere that during WWII they would tell the women assembling rifles to treat each weapon like their son's life depended it, because it might. this is the same philosophy that i apply to my carry ammo. pay attention like my life depends on it, because some day, it might.
 
My thought is I trust my hand loads but for SD I prefer factory ammo.
(and I always shoot a box out of the lot I am going to use)
That way in case I ever needed to use it, nothing could be brought up about using special "killer" hand loads.
Distance to target could be established if necessary, etc.
Should it make a difference, no, but if it might it's not worth the risk.
Lots of different feelings on this, but that's my take.

off thread but
wrench459, not the saw, the BFG9000.
I remember (years ago) the pink monsters used to scare my 6 year old niece to death (had to leave the computer and the room and come get me) until she found the saw and could saw them, then she was good to go.
The pistol was tough when deal with the pink monsters,shotgun was better, but the saw was best:)

I sat thru a SD Course several years ago, the Attorney presenting had the position that Factory loads should always be used for Self Defense, due to a Prosecuting Attorney could and easily would claim to the jury that you had created the "Man Killer Bullets that were Devastating" and would get the Jury's attention with it. I decided then, I would use Factory for SD, Always. Better Safe than Sorry...
 
Mr. Flintstone wrote:
That said, what are your thoughts on using hand loads for self defense?

This has been discussed ad nauseum on the Legal forum. Please search there.

I don't pretend to summarize several years worth of posts by attorneys who know how to handle the law and read the cases; but while the ammunition you use will probably never become an issue during the investigation or at trial, if it does, the fact you used reloads of unknown characteristics could complicate matters for your defense counsel.

Speaking personally; there are so many good, specially made defensive loads available that there seems little reason to add the additional litigating hazard of handloads to the equation. Do you really want to be doing 5 to 12 years in prison because you used handloads and your attorney couldn't convince the jury they weren't loaded "hot" with the intention to be more lethal than factory ammunition?

Remember, in court, "reality" is not what you believe to be the case, but what your attorney can convince a jury to be the case - all the while beset by the opposing counsel trying to paint an entirely different picture of your actions and motivations.
 
No problem with handloads for self defense. For the most part I hate picking up brass, so I use commercial for autos, handloads for SA revolvers.
 
I live in a very blue state. The last thing I want to happen is to fall victim to the knock out game and blast some kid as he's putting the boots to me only to read this headline the next day.

"Gun wielding nationalist shoots unarmed youth with custom made ammo."
 
I sat thru a SD Course several years ago, the Attorney presenting had the position that Factory loads should always be used for Self Defense, due to a Prosecuting Attorney could and easily would claim to the jury that you had created the "Man Killer Bullets that were Devastating" and would get the Jury's attention with it. I decided then, I would use Factory for SD, Always. Better Safe than Sorry...

I used to drive an armored truck years ago, and the instructor that qualified me to carry said the exact same thing to a class full of people. We got to carry our own guns and choose our own ammo, but we were instructed to carry Glock 17's and load them with Federal HST and under no circumstances to load our carry guns with hand loads for the reason you just stated.

Since the Glocks weren't required, I carried a standard CZ 75b with HST ammo.
 
what are your thoughts on using hand loads for self defense?

I have heard there are various legal reasons why you shouldn't use hand loads.
I load my own SD rounds and have never been concerned about legal issues for using it.
i load all my defense ammo.
Yes, use of handloads for self defense has been discussed to death in many threads - Justified shooting is justified shooting regardless of ammunition used whether factory or reloads.

But if you use reloads for self defense, BE PREPARED to let police take ALL of your reloading equipment and components into evidence for years. :eek::eek::eek: Yes, for YEARS in case court appointed technician has to replicate the reloaded rounds used for shooting to test gunshot residue, etc.
Just wondering what your take on the issue is?
I also use bulk Speer Gold Dot HP, Remington Golden Saber JHP, Rocky Mountain Reloading JHP projectiles to reload practice defensive rounds with similar POA/POI as factory rounds using BE-86/WSF but will only use factory ammunition in pistols designated for SD/HD.

I keep boxes of factory ammunition the rounds in my pistols came from readily available so if/when a defensive shooting occurs, I can simply hand over the boxes to police for evidence along with the pistol used instead of police hauling off my entire reloading equipment for years which the court case could run. (Imagine 10 presses along with various reloading tools and truckload of components). And what am I supposed to use during those years to reload? ;)

For me, buying a few boxes of factory ammunition is way "cheaper" and less inconvenient in comparison.
 
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But if you use reloads for self defense, BE PREPARED to let police take ALL of your reloading equipment and components into evidence for years. :eek::eek::eek: Yes, for YEARS in case court appointed technician has to replicate the reloaded rounds used for shooting to test gunshot residue, etc.
It could happen and maybe it has, especially if self defense was in doubt.
In a justified shooting I think it would be very unlikely.
 
My attorney doesn't tell me what hybrid to plant or what ammo to use.
If yours does, you need a better lawyer.
Here' s a picture of a factory load that didn' pass through a liter bottle.
View attachment 775814
And here's one that didn' fire at all.
20170727_191748.jpg
Both factory loads designed for a defensive pistol.....Hornady Critical Defense
 
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I'm rehashing some of the points already brought up.

If what kind of ammo you used in a SD shooting comes up in court you already have a much bigger problem. You're in court as it seems there is a question that you were justified.

Every major law enforcement agency I know of specifically forbids the use of reloads on or off duty. That should tell you something.

Many will argue to show them a case where where someone was convicted because of using reloads. Well that's an absurd demand because unless you were on the jury you don't know how it was discussed. Why give a jury something else that can complicate your problem?

Forensics can duplicate your claims using factory ammo. If you use handloads it would be up to you to hire experts to prove it.

You eliminate the issue of handloads being brought up for the price of a box of factory ammo. Or you can spend thousands for your lawyer trying to argue away the reload issue.
 
Yes, use of handloads for self defense has been discussed to death in many threads - Justified shooting is justified shooting regardless of ammunition used whether factory or reloads.

But if you use reloads for self defense, BE PREPARED to let police take ALL of your reloading equipment and components into evidence for years. :eek::eek::eek: Yes, for YEARS in case court appointed technician has to replicate the reloaded rounds used for shooting to test gunshot residue, etc.

I also use bulk Speer Gold Dot HP, Remington Golden Saber JHP, Rocky Mountain Reloading JHP projectiles to reload practice defensive rounds with similar POA/POI as factory rounds using BE-86/WSF but will only use factory ammunition in pistols designated for SD/HD.

I keep boxes of factory ammunition the rounds in my pistols came from readily available so if/when a defensive shooting occurs, I can simply hand over the boxes to police for evidence along with the pistol used instead of police hauling off my entire reloading equipment for years which the court case could run. (Imagine 10 presses along with various reloading tools and truckload of components). And what am I supposed to use during those years to reload? ;)

For me, buying a few boxes of factory ammunition is way "cheaper" and less inconvenient in comparison.

Great point.
 
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