Budget vs expensive hunting guns?

ohihunter2014 said:

Do you argue just for the sake or arguing with me? I wasn't the one who said the axis was junk in my OP but seems to be a consensus. I own two of them and like them very much and would have no problem saying my 223rem could hang with or out shoot a rem 700 in the same caliber with the same ammo cause I've seen it done. All the target shooting and woochuck shooting and coyote hunting I've done with both rifles the stock doesn't allow use of a bipod because when you load the bipod the stock either touches the barrel or feels like it wants to snap right off. I can feel the palm swell of the stock flex too when i get it tight on bags or bipod. IMO that's junk and i knew that when i purchased them and have every intention of putting a Boyds on it when $ becomes free. Everything else on the rifle is just fine.

As far as Glock goes i have no issue with them and don't use them because they don't point well for me. You have polymer which is what a Glock and M&P frame is made from and you have downright plastic which is what kids toys and my savage axis stock is made from. I would put $ on it that the types of material are way higher grade for a Glock than axis stock so they cant even be compared. If your having issues with the Glock rubbing you i suggest buying a real pistol like the M&P or an Hk or something similar. Maybe even a Hogue grip or some 1k grit sand paper.

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A real gun huh? Hmmmm....I'm leaving this reply alone lol

George P said:

I know folks who shoot VERY expensive shotguns, some upwards of $100K. None of them have ever looked down their nose at somone shooting something less expensive. They buy guns like that for two reasons:
1 - They have the money to do so
2 - It's something they wanted.

Period

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Absolutely!
My wife and I have been blessed, or lucky, or whatever you want to call it in the fact that we've always had the money to buy the guns we wanted. However, the guns we've "wanted" over the years have seldom been the more expensive ones. We like Winchester (not "Super Grades") Ruger and Remington hunting rifles and shotguns.
The one exception to my buying an expensive hunting rifle is my beloved, custom built, .308 Norma Magnum. By the time I had it scoped, it was a little over $3000. But it was my retirement gift to myself, and I'd wanted a custom built .308 Norma Magnum since I was 16-years old. Even at that, it's stainless with a granite-grey synthetic stock, and it wears a regular, 3X9 Weaver scope and a nylon sling. My taste in hunting guns has always been more about function than form and my .308 Norma Magnum testifies to that.
On the other hand, my wife's retirement gift to herself is her Jeep Wrangler that cost over 10 times as much as my custom built .308 Norma Magnum. And it won't do a darned thing more than my old 4-wheel drive F-150 will do.

But happy wife = happy life!

I think a lot of guys here are confusing better equipment with showy equipment. There’s a reason military snipers use U.S. Optics scopes.

Where higher money comes in typically would be in optics. You can maybe think your $100 scope is adequate. Maybe it is, maybe not. But I can pretty much guarantee that a more expensive scope will have better optical resolution and be more mechanically reliable. Found this out the hard way

Spending more for a gun that has fancy wood and gold inlays doesn’t mean it’s gonna kill critters any better. I’ve also seen guys go on a $7,500 elk hunt using a cheap scope and have it fail.

My turkey guy is an SP-10. Remington 10 gauge with a $80 Tru-lock hand made choke. I used Hevi-Shot loads that are maybe $3 each. It’s killed multiple birds at 50+ yards.

It sounds all kinds of cool to bring ‘em in close. Yeah, sometimes that works. Other times not. I’ve got limited hunting time. And if the bird decides to hang up at 50 I can take them. Grandpa had all the time in the world to hunt. I don’t.

My new rifle is a Browning X-bolt. Gonna have a Leupold VX-6 scope. I expect my rifles to be sub 1”. I expect my scopes to hold up, not fog, not fail, not lose zero and track true.

If you think a cheap scope works as well as a VX-6, you’re only fooling yourself. I was on a prairie dog hunt with a guy who was proud of the fact that his equipment was cheap but “adequate”. First day the interval of his Tanco scope came loose and rattled around. I mounted my extra Leupold scope that I had taken as back-up. Within maybe 15 minutes the extractor on his budget .17 HMR broke.

Paying for higher quality doesn’t guarantee success, but it stacks the odds more in your favor.

mcb said:

I agree there are many factors. I was just point out that many hunters are hunters first and the gun is only viewed as a tool to facilitate their passion for hunting. Other are hunters because its something to do with some of their guns and the guns are the focus of their passion. That is certainly as spectrum with most people existing between those two extremes.

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My Dad was like that. His trusted deer/elk rifle was an old Savage Super Sporter .30-06 that his dad got him for his 16th birthday for $35 (1939). That was his main rifle until mid 1960s when he upgraded to a Remington 760 in .308. Being a lefty and a pheasant hunter he liked the pump action rather than a right-handed (or "wrong-handed" to him bolt action). I cannot recall that he ever "wasted" one round of ammo for fun. Sight in, shoot deer, shoot elk, put up gun. That Savage and Banner scope would be pretty much right on year after year and still shoots excellent groups for a hunting rifle.

I on the other hand enjoy a little more fun with my rifles. When the Savage Sporter stock cracked badly I replaced it with a custom, figured hand rubbed walnut stock and replaced the old Banner scope with a Leupold VX2. When the Savage reached 70 years old I finally retired it and replaced it with a Sako A7 stainless, synthetic in .30-06. Not fancy, but pure function, yet beautiful to hold, slick action, crisp trigger and for me mounts and points perfectly. Being a handloader I enjoy shooting a couple of hundred rounds per session with it to test out new components and loads. I don't think my dad would ever quite understand any of that, beyond it shoots straight every year!

My turkey guy is an SP-10. Remington 10 gauge with a $80 Tru-lock hand made choke. It’s killed multiple birds at 50+ yards. It sounds all kinds of cool to bring ‘em in close. Yeah, sometimes that works. Other times not. I’ve got limited hunting time. And if the bird decides to hang up at 50 I can take them.

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You'd be surprised how well a standard 12 or even 20 gauge with regular ammo will kill a turkey at 50 yards.............

Where exactly should the cutoff between weath signaling and average person be?

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That’s pretty much it. I have firearms worth a few hundred that are “safe queens” to me for one reason or another and some worth more than a few thousand that I shoot the heck out of. That said I don’t own a $15,000 motorcycle, a $25,000 boat or a $250,000 RV like some folks do.

jmorris said:

That’s pretty much it. I have firearms worth a few hundred that are “safe queens” to me for one reason or another and some worth more than a few thousand that I shoot the heck out of. That said I don’t own a $15,000 motorcycle, a $25,000 boat or a $250,000 RV like some folks do.

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SO?

George P said:

SO?

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So it doesn’t matter what something costs as long as it does the job and makes the individual happy.

There are different strokes for different folks, we are all different and how an individual decides to spend their income to satisfy their needs isn’t “wrong” as long as it does.

“Expensive”, “wealth”, are not a number, qualitative words that mean different things to different people, living different reality’s.

When I started shooting $800 might as well have been a million dollars yet I still had fun with what I had and was able to take game just fine.

Glad you get it................

redneck2 said:

I think a lot of guys here are confusing better equipment with showy equipment.

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I am not so sure? Its more akin to some sort of pseudo class warfare. Course if we are honest bolt rifles and shotguns really haven't changed much in over a century. Your average 250 dollar gun can shoot the same cartridge/shell as that 100K gun. There is some sort of imaginary line drawn in the sand that separates individuals pocket books, it seems more apparent in the gun community than anywhere else. Am I snooty if I buy a BDL instead of the ADL? Supergrade vs M70? Is that really what this thread is about?

IMO the biggest changes have been in a lot of our ancillary equipment over the years. Glass, gear, clothing, packs, etc. That is where I think your dollars are better spent. Sure I've taken Deer in jeans, cheap boots and a cheap jacket. After decades of hunting, now-a-days my other gear cost more than my gun/bow.

Speaking of Bows, as the OP mentions. They are like computers of a decades ago. Technology makes them better and better every single year. Can a 30yrs old Bear kill just as good as a new Hoyt? sure. But why not take advantage of the fact that Bows depreciate rather rapidly, unlike guns...

I've not always had better quality guns. I've hunted with a loose actioned Belgium hammer gun and a Harrington and Richardson single shot 12 bore that nearly fell to pieces when you shot it. Had to repair the H&R with fencing wire. Not forgetting the Webbly and scot .410 bolt action that i carried on my bike on the way to work on the farm. Killed a mass of rabbits and the odd pheasant and duck with that .410.
In the 60s i had a Remington Wingmaster, I still have a soft spot for the Wingmaster. I used to load 250 cartridges on the back of my BSA 175cc Bantam with pigeon decoys and go out decoying wood pigeons. I bought my first rifle, a Brno ZKK 601 in .243 when i had a Reliant 3 wheel super van, lovingly called, the plastic pig, and go of hunting Roe and fallow deer. It wasn't easy fitting a large fallow in the back of that Reliant especially if i had my old farting spaniel with me.
Non of my family have been interested in guns and hunting. My father said he had seen enough of guns during the six years he was away during WW2. But hunting is Me. Guns, ammo, reloading, dogs,etc,etc.
I've lived in a time when I've had it so much better than my fathers generation had it. I'll not be worried if my guns are worn and tatty when i die at least I'll have had the fun of using them.
I bought my double rifle last year and i must say what a great fun thing it is to shoot. It makes me smile every time.

Sure, you can hunt successfully with most anything that is functional. I have a neighbor that is rich as three foot up a bull's butt and he hunts with a 303 Enfield when he gets in the mood to hunt. Bought it sometime back for $56 .
I like nice guns myself. If I had the excess cash I would own the nicest stuff I could afford.

After 33 years od dedication to my career, some of my early difficult decisions are paying dividends now.
I find myself able to afford Blazers and Ljutics, but H&Rs and Remingtons are good enough for me. It satisfies me to not spend too much on myself. Guns are my weakness, and i have way too many.

Guns are my weakness, and i have way too many.

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Some would burn you at the stake for heresy!!!!!.....

Personally, I would rather have a few guns of top-tier quality than safes full of guns of low quality or that I don't shoot.

Now I feel bad. Cheap is a relative term .
If you hunt with the "label" side up........go for it.
If fact, an awful lot of game has been harvested by what you consider, cheap.
All my cheap stuff has seen many hunting seasons .
Cheap vs Expensive. It`s all in the eye of the beholder. JMO.

I have friends with safes full of guns they never shoot; they always come back to that 1 or 2 shotguns, that 1 rifle and handgun; And that's what I am about to start as I get older. So, to that end, I would rather have a few guns of high quality to last me the rest of my life that are not only pleasant to look at, but are well-made, accurate, and reliable. Life's too short to shoot an ugly gun........

Forget the Joneses. It depends on what YOU want to do and how YOU want to do it. Some folks don't care what they hunt with, as long as it does the job. For those, a $400 Ruger American or Savage Axis will be all they need for their entire hunting lifetime. For others, every minute detail is important. For me, the guns I use are a very important, integral part of the experience. I have a passion for fine firearms and that includes using them in the field. I got a Marlin 60 for Christmas at about age 10, bought a Browning Buckmark at 15 and couldn't wait to buy a Remington 870 Express on my 18th birthday. I still think about the adventures I had with those guns. However, as time has passed and experienced gained, so too have my tastes changed, along with my budget. These days, bird hunting with a Merkel 28ga gives me more pleasure than the old Remington. Just as the custom flintlock is more enjoyable to hunt with than the old GPR. Same goes for my custom revolvers. It pleases me to no end to have an engraved custom revolver in my holster. Just as I look forward to rabbit hunting with the new 1929 Colt Police Positive Target, over the various S&W's, Rugers and Brownings I've been using. In the next couple years, I want to liquidate some of my lesser guns in favor of a fully optioned Cooper .22LR and probably an original Mauser sporter. Does this mean I do not enjoy hunting with my Ruger Americans? Of course not. Does this mean I look down on less expensive guns or the people that use them? Hell no. Other people don't factor into it at all. Life is short, live a little. If nicer equipment will enhance the experience, go for it.

Expensive doesn't always mean good. Years ago Outdoor life had a review of the best rifles for that year. They had a gorgeous $2500 Sauer rifle with an exceptional piece of wood listed as No. 1. It shot 3.5"-4" groups. Now if I spend $2500 on a rifle, it had better be sub-MOA or I will have some major conversations with customer service.

I think what you mean is that expensive doesn't always mean accurate. While, 3-4MOA is unacceptable but I think people have a strange perception that expensive guns should be surgically accurate. For some reason a lot of folks judge a rifle based solely on accuracy but there's a lot more to a rifle than that. Especially a hunting rifle.

I'm all over the place. I have a rifle that cost me $180 new and one $1,100 new and some others in between. I like my handguns to be better brands though.

I've duck hunted most of my life on salt marsh tideland/state WMA in said salt marshes, etc. The attraction is not having to lease land here in private land Texas. I really didn't hunt deer or hogs hard until I bought myself a place in 1988. My shotguns for waterfowl, I have owned 870 Wingmaster, several Mossberg 500/535s, and my Winchester 1400 autoloader, are all low end guns. I much prefer Mossberg's ergos for several reasons. I like the tang safety as I shoot lefty and I like the lack of a shell elevator in the way when I reload since when you have a cold thumb, that 870 can hurt and I've yanked my thumb out too soon and jammed the works doing that. My fave Mossberg has a camo finish and plastic stocks, GREAT in the marsh banging around against a decoy bag and marsh chair while walking in or out and getting dunked occasionally in brackish salt water. I wouldn't subject a nice B gun to that. I like the Browning BPS ergos even better than the Mossies, but they're a little more expensive. Might get a 10 gauge one of these years, though, to replace my H&R single shot which I really like for goose hunting.

My dove guns are 20 gauges. Originally, it's what I bought the Winchester 1400 12 gauge for, but I'm more effective with a lighter gun. The Remington Spartan (Biakal made) was 300 bucks and effective. I mostly got it for my trips to Waco on a motorcycle, could break it down and put it in the top box of my GoldWing. But, I haven't ridden up there in some seasons. The new CZ Redhead Delux my wife got me Christmas before last is AWESOME. I'd been looking at it and she knew I wanted it, fits like a glove, just flies to the shoulder and points itself. WOW, whadda shotgun! I know it ain't no B gun, won't give 2 grand for a B gun, can't ride the damned thing to work....that is, if I worked. Hell, the motorcycle I'm riding now I bought used for $1300. The CZ is an 800 dollar gun and that's a splurge for my cheap butt, actually a Turkish built Huglu. For me, it oozes quality, though. I mean, it's all comparative, being used to Mossbergs. But, I love that thing and am determined to take care of it cosmetically. Good thing about being a 20, won't be tempted to take it to the marsh.

.22s, I have a 10/22 with Hogue stock and Bushnell optic. Good enough for the squirrels around here when I'm not handgunning 'em with a TC Contender or Ruger Mk 2.

Deer rifles. My old Remington M722 short action still drives little 1" groups at 200 yards. It's a .257 Roberts. I killed a deer last with it in 2013, 50th anniversary of my first kills with the same gun in 1963 at age 11. It was my grandpa's old gun. In the 90s, I took it to a gunsmith and had him take the front sight off (never has a rear sight since my gramps gave it to me) and reblue it. I refinished the stock, put a Bushnell scope on it, and it's worked ever since. I've won a couple of bench rest matches with the club using it. These are "deer rifle" matches, no 40X or other target guns. I beat out an old boy who was real proud of his rifles, owned Weatherby and Kleingunthers and topped with Schmidt and Bender scopes. He was retired and had nothing better to spend his money on. He got so mad at being beat by my cheap little junky Remington, he packed up his stuff and went home even though the BBQ they were making for lunch was almost ready to serve.

My fave rifle now days is a Remington M7 Stainless in .308. I acquired it by trading a brand new in the box Remington BDL in .25/06 for it. I won the BDL at a gun show door prize raffle, cost me 5 bucks. Now, I'd have kept that nice rifle, but I already had the .257 and .25-06 seemed a might redundant. Also, I'd been reading about the M7 and had the serious wants. So, I made the trade, spent 300 bucks on the Weaver KV and Millet rings/mounts, so it wasn't totally free. I've been killing deer and hog with it ever since. It's a 3/4 MOA shooter. I have a 7 mag Savage 110 I bought in 1992 that I've shot four whitetail and a mulie with out west, but I don't really use that gun anymore. It's another bargain gun and good shooter.

So, you see, ain't no Kleingunthers, Perrazis, H&Hs, Anchutzs, or other in MY safe. But, I like what I have and it works just fine for me.

Oh, bows? I bought a 150 dollar crossbow and shot my first bow kill with it.

The only gun purchases that I've regretted are the cheap ones

This has been a fun thread to read through. I have my opinions of what junk is and what qualifies as worthy but I don't feel entitled to treat with open condescension the rust pitted 30-06 my buddy bought for $95 with the gritty bolt. He's killed a few deer with it and takes pride in having "restored" it. To me the trash heap would be a merciful end for it, where for him preserving the "trash" is honorable. Which of us is right? In fact, I've come to appreciate his sentiment for the poor thing. The dead deer don't know the difference. We all carry with us an interwoven conception of what's acceptable and worth our consideration based on objective pragmatism of function (most of which is based on our own experiences) mixed with the biases of our mentors and our own notions of beauty and form. I've "upgraded" from a sporterized Spanish Mauser 91 chambered in 257 Roberts to a paddle-stocked, stainless Ruger 77 in 30-06 to a Sako AV Fiberclass in 338 win mag. Have I really upgraded? Absolutely, because what I have now is much closer to what I've always wanted and what my experience and current applications in the field call for. Would I pay $3000-$5000 (or more, I made up the numbers) for a custom built stainless 375 H&H on a Granite Mt. Arms action? Yup. If I had the dough but I doubt it's what most you would throw your money at. I guess if you like what you like and you have reasons for liking it that include consistently getting the results you want from the tools you own, then you go for it. But good luck trying to convince me!