WWII Japanese Rifle

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357mag357

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Hello,

A friend of my asked me if I new anything about a rifle his Grandfather gave him. It is a Japanese bolt action with only one marking. I have not seen the rifle in person, only pictures. It does have the bayonet but it is not in the pictures. Any thoughts on the make of rifle and the caliber? Also, if its worth anything besides being a piece of history. Thank you.

Jim
 

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Looks like a Type 99 Arisaka. The Type 99 was a 311 caliber rifle. There were some shorty Type 38's, they were 6.5 caliber, but I think yours is clearly a type 99.

Seems to be missing some parts and is rusty as can be. The WW2 generation thought so poorly of all things Japanese that these rifles were an absolute bargain till the 1990's, but prices have begun to rise. But given the rusty condition and that it is missing parts, it falls into the same value category as a vehicle that does not run.

A lady at work told me her deceased husband's 1963 truck was in her garage and she wanted to sell it. She claimed our vintage vehicle expert said the thing was worth $3500. Then she mentioned the truck did not run. I was not interested in a non running vehicle that had been mucked around with and the only person who knew what he had done was no longer around.

I went to the vintage vehicle expert and asked him about the high value he had put on the truck, and he said "she never told me it was not running"! A non running vehicle means a lot of work. Trying to figure out what mistakes someone else made, and maybe something expensive, such as a cracked engine block or ruined transmission, can be real cost drivers, exceeding the restored value of a running vehicle. Potentially, when you have to rent a wrecker to tow the thing to your house, I think she would have had to pay me money, to get it out of her garage.
 
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Slamfire is correct, I believer it is a type 99 Arisaka. Key is two receiver gas holes indicates a type 38 generally, one gas hole in the receiver is a type 99. The Kanji script on the receiver ring also states the type.

You might find this website interesting or not if you want to decipher the markings http://www.castle-thunder.com/index.htm This datasheet on Type 99 provides a way to decipher the markings and where they are to determine when and where it was made. http://www.castle-thunder.com/datasheets/99ds2010e.pdf

From your pictures, it is rusty but doesn't appear badly pitted (this is not to say that it is safe to fire without gunsmith ok). The stock appears to be in relatively good condition and the parts missing appear to be minor.

Two options that might make sense to you--one is to sell it to a collector who often prefer it to be left alone. This works best if it is some odd variant--certain arsenal and series makes are pretty rare and someone wanting to complete a collection might want to purchase it. Condition and rarity will determine the price. In this case, it is best to leave it as is and let the buyer deal with the hard work of restoration.

As is and absent any special rarity, my guess what it might bring is about $150-250 which is in the training rifle range. It is also equivalent roughly to the value of the individual parts if sold. If cartouches and most markings are still present, etc. maybe a bit more as the stock and handguard appear in good condition and not buggered up.

Second option, restore it. If you don't want to do so, then ignore the rest of the post.

Demount the rifle receiver, take down the bolt, etc. Verify and acquire missing parts--gpc has some and some can be acquired through ebay/gunbroker. There are several ways to remove rust which in some cases may actually leave bluing present. Remove all dirt via a eco friendly degreaser/detergent spray and wipe down clean and dry. Then, apply a light machine oil (I prefer something like KROIL but any penetrating oil can work) then use bronze wool, steel wool 0000, or an Big Frontier 45 rust remover scrubber to scrub LIGHTLY to dislodge the rust. (I have also used Blue Wonder gun cleaner--it is a gel and sits on the surface and does help eliminate rust but not any residual bluing--you alternate it with the penetrating oil).

At this stage, do not try to get into any deep rust pits--simply remove the surface rust. You get those later with picks and specific attention to each pit. Use different clean parts of the steel or bronze wool or rinse your scrubbing pad periodically in mineral spirits to get rid of rust particles. These rust particles removed are abrasive and can scratch surfaces/bluing that remain. Go slow. Do the same process with barrel bands etc. Clean and de rust all of the parts thoroughly inside and out. You are breaking the oxidized metal surface by removing the rust and improper storage and partial cleaning can lead to new rusting of the surfaces. Use oil plentifully.

Regarding cleaning crevices, etc, bamboo skewers for k-bobs work well, plastic picks also can work but are fragile, metal picks are useful in some circumstances where wood or plastic won't but they can scratch so use with care. I also use pipe cleaners, small rags, etc. Old dirty surfaces often require multiple rounds of cleaning.

Electrolysis can be used to clean up rusty parts but be very careful and avoid doing it with any chromed product. Haven't tried ultrasonic cleaners but often the result of either process is any residual bluing is gone. Naval Jelly, Evaporust, etc, are generally acids and do attack and remove rust along with etching the surface. Not recommended, nor is media blasting etc. Toothbrushes, nylon and bronze also are very useful to break up rust and crud.

Oil and scrub small sections, clean out or get new cleaning scrubber, clean and dry. On screws, it is very possible that they are stuck fast with rust along with the sight ladder etc. DO NOT force anything. Apply penetrating oil and let it sit, try using normal GUNSMITHING screw bits that fit the screw head (these will be hollow ground bits) and normal pressure--no gorilla grip here, and try to turn it. If you have a brass punch, you can lightly tap with a light hammer on and around the screw head to help break the rust bond holding the screw in place. Go slow as it may take repeated cycles of tapping, penetrating oil, and trying the screw before it loosens. Heat and cold can be used as a next step but generally not necessary as beyond the normal. Usually repeated penetrating oil application (don;t get this one the wood if you can help it and remove it promptly if you do--non-natural distilled oil softens and weakens wood.

Clean the stock and handguard with Murphy's wood soap first using cloth rags. DO NOT SAND THE STOCK. Arisakas were generally finished with Japanese lacquer that comes from a variety of poison sumac. Sanding it will put those particles in the air and breathing them is not good. If you have a severe reaction to poison ivy/oak/sumac, then make sure to use gloves when cleaning the stock. The compound that causes problems should decline with age but not something you can take for certain. Don't use any solvents to remove the finish either, the Japanese having a shortage of good wood, glued the buttstock from two pieces. Solvents can weaken the glue bond. Best to clean it and leave it alone.

Make it a project and it can actually look quite nice but depending on the condition, it may takes several weeks of working on it bit by bit. Getting in a hurry usually botches stuff.

Now, whether you can fire it--many of the Arisaka 99's had chromed bores until mid war. Often the outside looks like garbage but the barrels are quite nice. Not close enough look to tell you if that is so. Second, many, including the U.S. Army, tried to shoehorn a .30-06 by crudely rechambering into the Arisaka. I would not try to shoot these. IF the U.S. Army did the conversion for the Korean War, it is actually collectible as is and leave it alone.

Outside of special ordering one made by Manson, etc., there are no headspace gages for the Arisaka. Reamers 4 Rent might conceivably have some for rent. But, the only safe way is take a chamber cast to determine what, if anything, someone has done with it before you got it. Then, depending on the bolt condition, the receiver condition, the bore and chamber condition, IT MIGHT be safe to fire with normal ammunition. You can buy it at Grafs and Sons or a few other places have it here and there. Brass, bullets, and dies are available to shoot it.
 
Slamfire & Boom Boom got you some great info.
There are four parts on a Type 99 Arisaka that will increase the value if still presents.
#1 The dust cover
#2 The Aircraft sights
#3 The Monopod
#4 The cleaning rod.
From the pictures I can only see the cleaning rod.
Another thing that will increase the value is manufacturer and series (who made it and when). Those markings are on the left side of the action.
I can tell you that it is a late war production rifle but not a last ditch rifle.
If you friend decides to restore it, I recommend doing his homework before doing anything. WWII Japanese Collector are an odd breed and have a different set of rules when placing value on rifles.
I do agree with Boom Boom that the value is in the $150 to $250 range.
 
The stamping in front of the blow hole puzzles me. I can see the remains of the Chrysanthemum on the overhead view but the close up seems to show some letters or script across the top of the chamber that I have never seen on any of my Arisaka's. Warn your friend that Arisaka's are like Lays potato chips, you can't have just one!
 
Depending on when it was made it might not have come with some of the stuff...AA sights and monopod are not on all 99's

Also no mum generally means a surrender rifle and not a pick-up
 
The stamping in front of the blow hole puzzles me. I can see the remains of the Chrysanthemum on the overhead view but the close up seems to show some letters or script across the top of the chamber that I have never seen on any of my Arisaka's. Warn your friend that Arisaka's are like Lays potato chips, you can't have just one!

Not an Arisaka expert by any means of the different subtypes but most of the Arisakas have the model number in script on the receiver ring in Kanji script. A lot of times that was scrubbed when the mum was obliterated probably with a grinder. Sometimes the mums are simply defaced and there was a separate mark when the Japanese took a rifle out os service. In the example, the script looks a bit weird as it appears to have the script dinged when they got the mum. Who and when these were scrubbed is open to question and probably have different answers depending on the rifle.
 
Slamfire & Boom Boom got you some great info.
There are four parts on a Type 99 Arisaka that will increase the value if still presents.
#1 The dust cover
#2 The Aircraft sights
#3 The Monopod
#4 The cleaning rod.
From the pictures I can only see the cleaning rod.
Another thing that will increase the value is manufacturer and series (who made it and when). Those markings are on the left side of the action.
I can tell you that it is a late war production rifle but not a last ditch rifle.
If you friend decides to restore it, I recommend doing his homework before doing anything. WWII Japanese Collector are an odd breed and have a different set of rules when placing value on rifles.
I do agree with Boom Boom that the value is in the $150 to $250 range.
One other thing that increases value. An intact mum.
 
Definitely an Arisaka.
Notable, and discerning is the wooden butt plate.
This makes it a late production, “desperation” production, rifle.

Heat treating and metallurgy of reciever is questionable.
It’s a wall hanger, or parts source.

Appears the bolt cover/striker/firing pin have been removed. This was a recommended disabling suggested frequently back in the late 60’s, early ‘70’s to prevent the rifles from being fired. It was also often suggested that some of the guns had been intentionally altered or “booby trapped” to make them unsafe to fire. I’ve seen a few that were intentionally disabled by welding drill rod in the bore.
(I worked in a lgs in high school circa 1971-1973).
 
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Definitely an Arisaka.
Notable, and discerning is the wooden butt plate.
This makes it a late production, “desperation” production, rifle.

Heat treating and metallurgy of reciever is questionable.
It’s a wall hanger, or parts source.

Appears the bolt cover/striker/firing pin have been removed. This was a recommended disabling suggested frequently back in the late 60’s, early ‘70’s to prevent the rifles from being fired. It was also often suggested that some of the guns had been intentionally altered or “booby trapped” to make them unsafe to fire. I’ve seen a few that were intentionally disabled by welding drill rod in the bore.
(I worked in a lgs in high school circa 1971-1973).
Not all last ditch rifles are the same. The OP’s rifle is considered a late war production, made around when they first started cutting corners to get more rifles made.
Here’s a last ditch I have in my collection. It's a 34th Series "Substitute" ( last ditch ) Type 99 short rifle manufactured by Toyo Kogyo of Hiroshima City under Kokura Arsenal supervision during the last quarter of 1944.
Simple barrel band:
F25D61EB-3294-41E0-8F92-8A472E7A7DFA.jpeg

Rough-finished metal:
8BBAA873-9365-4D35-B1A7-1FB8A5B3316E.jpeg

Super-simplified rear sight:
FCA5673E-1A0D-4B77-87CE-13E4C8C78246.jpeg 9CD7D4E0-1C89-4645-BA1A-CA70235184C3.jpeg

o ears on front sight:
70665D4F-6002-4FE8-BBF6-AE7801AE47F1.jpeg

Original wooden buttplate:
63F03D2D-C174-43DE-AD27-0C260206BE00.jpeg

This rifle has an intact mum, due to it being a battlefield pickup. I got if from a friend, who’s dad picked it up during the Island Hopping campaign on or around the island of Saipan.
 
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