Bump stock ban: what happens when we hit the deadline?

The decision you are facing, will likely be made by many Americans in the coming years, and not just bumpstocks.

Personally, I wouldn't worry too much about it.
Not legal advise, but:
1) There's no way to trace one.
2) To search your home looking for it, they will need a search warrant.
3) If I was really concerned, I own a shovel and sold mine to some guy in a bar.

I see an increase in boating accidents in the coming months.

As I understand it, if their is no injunction granted before March 26th it will be a NFA violation to own or poses a bump stock after that date.
The fact that their will still be lawsuits filed isn’t relevant.

Elkins45 said:

I know there have been lawsuits filed seeking to overturn the bump stock ban, but March 2x (I forget the exact date) continues to relentlessly approach. What owners who don't wish to destroy them are hoping for is an injunction and eventually a declaration that the ban is unlawful. My question is what happens if there isn't an injunction issued by the deadline yet the lawsuits are still in progress?

Is the existence of a legal challenge sufficient grounds to hold onto them, or do owners have to destroy them and then maybe just buy a new one if the suit is eventually successful? Or bury it on public land and then maybe dig it up later? <--this is a joke.

Is the suit even going to be heard before the destruction deadline?

Click to expand...

My guess is there is not going to be any relief. I do hope there will be relief but politically, bump stocks do not have the proponents. We have seen how powerful political views are.

Hunter86004 said:

1) There's no way to trace one.

Click to expand...

In most cases I don't think that's quite true. It's a safe bet that the majority of people who own one bought it with a credit or debit card, which means it's traceable. I've got no dog in the fight since I sold mine a while back but it is something to think about for those who still have them.

bearcreek said:

In most cases I don't think that's quite true. It's a safe bet that the majority of people who own one bought it with a credit or debit card, which means it's traceable.

Click to expand...

No, that would mean they know you purchased it, then what?
Gifted it?
Sold it?
Broke it?
Didn’t like it and threw it in garbage?
It got stole?
I forget what I did with that thing, hummm?
And on and on.
They can’t be traced.

Not to mention I have no idea how the fed government could get a hold to the CC records of every US citizen, then narrow them down to a single purchase. Likely many, many legal issues their, not to mention other logical issues.

Who knows. One can only hope that a court sees the wisdom of not making instant felons of millions of otherwise law abiding citizens and enjoins enforcement of the new rules until it can be adjudicated.

I would guess that if that doesn't happen the ATF is not going to be real serious about enforcing the ban. They have more important things to do. But it is like dealing with the IRS. They don't care all that much about minor violations of the tax laws either but now and then they will go after someone for trivial violations. It is also possible that the president could issue an order not to enforce the ban until it is adjudicated. He certainly has that authority.

You may just have to decide whether you want to take the risk. Personally, I never owned one, and don't have one now, so it is not an issue for me, so I do not have to make such an awful choice.

DeepSouth said:

No, that would mean they know you purchased it, then what?
Gifted it?
Sold it?
Broke it?
Didn’t like it and threw it in garbage?
It got stole?
I forget what I did with that thing, hummm?
And on and on.
They can’t be traced.

Not to mention I have no idea how the fed government could get a hold to the CC records of every US citizen, then narrow them down to a single purchase. Likely many, many legal issues their, not to mention other logical issues.

Click to expand...

lying to the feds is a crime. best bet would probably be to take the 5th if it ever comes up.

ilbob said:

lying to the feds is a crime. best bet would probably be to take the 5th if it ever comes up.

Click to expand...

True, but if you’re illegally keeping an unregistered NFA item, the legality of lying to the ATF probably isn’t your biggest concern. Also the point was as applies to tracking, they can’t trace them because many people would tell them lies, others would tell them the same answers and they’d be true. And they’d be hard pressed to know who’s who.

Obviously, the simple, safe thing to do is simply obey the law, however much we dislike it. That’s my personal advise.

SharpDog said:

I do hope there will be relief but politically, bump stocks do not have the proponents. We have seen how powerful political views are.

Click to expand...

Heck, bump stocks really don't have many proponents on this website, much less the less gun friendly sites. I would imagine they will go away fairly quietly as our "friend of the NRA Prez" does the first meaningful anti gun thing a President has done since Clinton.

If I owned a bump stock I would hold on to it until the 25th of March. If no relief from an injunction while the case was being heard I would destroy it. To do anything else IMHO would be foolish and risking your right to own guns for life. I know there are going to be people who will keep them.
I have never owned a bump stock and have never had an interest in them, but as I see it if I was interested it would only to do a couple of mag dumps to test the bump stocks efficacy and reliability. After that I would lose interest and it would just sit on the shelf.

GAF said:

To do anything else IMHO would be foolish and risking your right to own guns for life.

Click to expand...

I think you just hit a home run. I understand the principle behind non-violent, civil disobedience on this, but I don't understand how that is practical. Getting caught means a felony record and a DQ from ever owning guns again, but what, if any, is the upside of retaining a bump stock and not getting caught? (Answer: not much.) You can never take it to a range and use it ever again. The only thing you can do is store and bring it out during the apocalypse to fight your own government, and from what I've seen, they won't be very effective for that.

This came up in our coffee circle. So, turn it in to closest BATFE office, ask for receipt or record the submission. Or both.
Become a part of respective lawsuits seeking $$$ relief for the documented destruction, loss of future use, appreciation value/future sale, etc.
Further, contact the NRA who GAVE BIRTH (oh! how anti-2A persons in high places must have smiled!!) TO THE MONSTER with a hearty ''THANKS!"

Hunter86004 said:

Personally, I wouldn't worry too much about it.
Not legal advise, but:
1) There's no way to trace one.
2) To search your home looking for it, they will need a search warrant.
3) If I was really concerned, I own a shovel and sold mine to some guy in a bar.

Click to expand...

I figure if you are going to violate the NFA simply because of the above... you might as well go whole-hog and build a DIAS/LL. The punishment is the same for BS's after the date, but at least you are really getting a machine gun for your troubles if you have an unregistered DIAS/LL. The responses below are far more realistic and mature.

Risk/reward - hanging on to an unregistered NFA device is full of risk with little to no reward. Even if you destroy the BS, you're only out a couple hundred bucks at most. Just the phone call to your lawyer when you get caught with an unregistered BS will cost far more than that.

GAF said:

If I owned a bump stock I would hold on to it until the 25th of March. If no relief from an injunction while the case was being heard I would destroy it. To do anything else IMHO would be foolish and risking your right to own guns for life. I know there are going to be people who will keep them.
I have never owned a bump stock and have never had an interest in them, but as I see it if I was interested it would only to do a couple of mag dumps to test the bump stocks efficacy and reliability. After that I would lose interest and it would just sit on the shelf.

Click to expand...

D.B. Cooper said:

I think you just hit a home run. I understand the principle behind non-violent, civil disobedience on this, but I don't understand how that is practical. Getting caught means a felony record and a DQ from ever owning guns again, but what, if any, is the upside of retaining a bump stock and not getting caught? (Answer: not much.) You can never take it to a range and use it ever again. The only thing you can do is store and bring it out during the apocalypse to fight your own government, and from what I've seen, they won't be very effective for that.

Click to expand...

pdsmith505 said:

I figure if you are going to violate the NFA simply because of the above... you might as well go whole-hog and build a DIAS/LL. The punishment is the same for BS's after the date, but at least you are really getting a machine gun for your troubles if you have an unregistered DIAS/LL. The responses below are far more realistic and mature.

Risk/reward - hanging on to an unregistered NFA device is full of risk with little to no reward. Even if you destroy the BS, you're only out a couple hundred bucks at most. Just the phone call to your lawyer when you get caught with an unregistered BS will cost far more than that.

Click to expand...

I agree with what you wrote.

However, I also feel that what you wrote will apply to 30 and 20 round magazines next time around.

Doc7 said:

I agree with what you wrote.

However, I also feel that what you wrote will apply to 30 and 20 round magazines next time around.

Click to expand...

Yup. The "gun controllers" are boiling the frog. And the NRA is, for good or ill, letting them get away with turning the heat up a bit in this case.

On the flip side, a standard capacity magazine ban or de-facto mandatory registration (both in draft legislation at this time) are much more serious problems. The NRA, GOA, etc. only have so much money, and have to pick their fights.

I've never owned a bump stock, never heard of them before the proposed ban in fact, but I oppose the ban (heavily because the way the BATFE set up the ban opens the door for many future violations). I put a comment in when the regulation was in draft opposing it. Still, even if I did own a bump stock that's not the hill I'd be willing to die on.

The problem is that I'm sure I know firearm owners who'd feel the same way about standard capacity magazines. Or any semi-auto. Or...

I hope we can figure out how to stand together before its too late.

More gun control laws, more civil asset forfeitures and more of the War on Drugs are NOT making America great again. It's the same old song and dance. Wake up people. You are being deluded and led around by the same old politicians.

Lots being said but it boils down to choices. Go rogue or go legal. Your choice.

Take a look at your devices, and consider how they could be “destroyed” while still being somewhat easily repaired to functional condition. If you cut off a piece, how hard would it be to put it back together should that option ever be realistic. Yes I understand that they could go after you for a work in progress, but that is such a stretch that it’s ludicrous. It’s legal to own all of the parts to make a machinegun, but it’s not legal to possess a machinegun... apply that to a bumpstock.

Doc7 said:

I agree with what you wrote.

However, I also feel that what you wrote will apply to 30 and 20 round magazines next time around.

Click to expand...

Don't get me wrong, even though I think BS's are novelty devices with no real use, I certainly don't agree with the action the executive took. The ban needs to be fought in court, but the benefit to violating the law in the meantime in this case just isn't there. Magazine restrictions? Calculus is a little different because the magazines actually make the weapon more effective.

Like I said, if you are going to buck the NFA to keep your bumpstock, might as well just make a real machinegun. The risk is the same, and you get a real machinegun. (note: I am not suggesting anyone go off and actually build an unregistered MG...)

WestKentucky said:

Take a look at your devices, and consider how they could be “destroyed” while still being somewhat easily repaired to functional condition. If you cut off a piece, how hard would it be to put it back together should that option ever be realistic. Yes I understand that they could go after you for a work in progress, but that is such a stretch that it’s ludicrous. It’s legal to own all of the parts to make a machinegun, but it’s not legal to possess a machinegun... apply that to a bumpstock.

Click to expand...

1) The ATF has already told us how to destroy them... even the home-brew varieties - https://www.atf.gov/rules-and-regulations/bump-stocks/how-to-destroy

2) You are wrong and don't understand the law.

26 USC 5845 said:

...
(b)Machinegun

The term “machinegun” means any weapon which shoots, is designed to shoot, or can be readily restored to shoot, automatically more than one shot, without manual reloading, by a single function of the trigger. The term shall also include the frame or receiver of any such weapon, any part designed and intended solely and exclusively, or combination of parts designed and intended, for use in converting a weapon into a machinegun, and any combination of parts from which a machinegun can be assembled if such parts are in the possession or under the control of a person.
...

Click to expand...