A Savage story almost 10 years in the making

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@LoonWulf, thanks for reminding some of why I didn't sell the rifle. I would never sell a defective item without full disclosure which normally means taking a big hit in the wallet so I'm pleased that the rifle turned out good in the end. I don't plan on selling this rifle, but if I did I would tell the new owner all about the work I've done and that would crash the sale price, and that's one reason why I most likely won't sell it.

On a side note, it looks like a member here will be buying the factory 1:11.5 twist barrel that has less than 50 rounds through it which will help me recoup some of the cost of the McGowen barrel. He wants to use it for cast lead bullets. I checked the twist rate four times on Saturday and got something around 11.5 to 12 which confirms that it does indeed have a slow twist. I might have confirmed that 10 years ago but if I did I'd forgotten about it and didn't want to sell the member a barrel that was faster than he needed.

hps1 said:
It's been way too many years since I mounted scope on a Savage, but IIRC the front and rear bases were different height and hole spacing is the same???? You'd think Savage would have mentioned that when you called if it was the case, though, so I could sure be wrong on this. Above video might have saved you bunch of elbow grease, however.

I do have a Savage 10 short action and measured difference in height of front and rear Weaver bases as best I could w/o removing scope and looks like front base is .020" thicker than back base. Based on your picture looks like a lot more than .020" difference on your receiver. Would be interesting to have seen actual measurement of front and rear bridges OD before sanding down.

The difference in height between the front and rear bridges was about .100" but the fact that the tops of the bridges weren't horizontal was a big part of the problem. As I mentioned in my first post, the bridges sloped down front to back. When I measured the thickness of the receiver in four locations i.e. front bridge front and back, rear bridge front and back it was clear that the tops of the bridges were not parallel to the bottom of the receiver. I hope this makes sense.
 


It's been way too many years since I mounted scope on a Savage, but IIRC the front and rear bases were different height and hole spacing is the same???? You'd think Savage would have mentioned that when you called if it was the case, though, so I could sure be wrong on this. Above video might have saved you bunch of elbow grease, however.

I do have a Savage 10 short action and measured difference in height of front and rear Weaver bases as best I could w/o removing scope and looks like front base is .020" thicker than back base. Based on your picture looks like a lot more than .020" difference on your receiver. Would be interesting to have seen actual measurement of front and rear bridges OD before sanding down.

Regards,
hps

The round back savages are "supposed" to be on the same plane. I use Savage one piece mounts on alot of my sporterized projects just because they are even.

The older flat back savages, before MCMXIs, did have taller and different profile rear bases.
 
LoonWulf said:
The round back savages are "supposed" to be on the same plane. I use Savage one piece mounts on alot of my sporterized projects just because they are even.

The older flat back savages, before MCMXIs, did have taller and different profile rear bases.

Exactly. When I ordered the Picatinny base from TPS they were shocked that it didn't fit. I sent them photos thinking that they'd shipped me the wrong part but they were adamant that the bridges should be in the same plane for my model the 16FCSS. When I spoke with Savage they had no reasonable explanation for the issue.
 
The difference in height between the front and rear bridges was about .100" but the fact that the tops of the bridges weren't horizontal was a big part of the problem. As I mentioned in my first post, the bridges sloped down front to back. When I measured the thickness of the receiver in four locations i.e. front bridge front and back, rear bridge front and back it was clear that the tops of the bridges were not parallel to the bottom of the receiver. I hope this makes sense.

Makes perfect sense. I read first post but was confused as picture of straight edge looked parallel with front bridge. But digital pics are not all that accurate when it comes to thousandths of an inch :). Sounds like the bridges were ground as opposed to lathe finished as someone previously alluded to.

I've heard of lapping scope rings before, but never lapping a receiver. :what: Congratulations on your perseverance in resolving the problem and not passing it on to some poor unsuspecting buyer.

Regards,
hps
 
And screwed someone else.......
I realize it's just sorta something we say, but it also seems to be a common sentiment, and I'd bet it's partially why companies are comfortable letting garbage out the door.
If we just pass it along, and never call them on it, why should they give a crap.

Well done on getting it running.
You have to be honest on selling but I realize some aren't. When I sold 2 Savage rifles that gave me problems I realized I was spending money trying to fix things I shouldn't have to. The people that bought got a deal and felt they could correct the problems. Some people are like that.

Good point about companies putting out garbage. But, what do you do when they don't want to own it? It's nice to hear the OP fixed the problem but I won't spend money and time doing that anymore.
 
You have to be honest on selling but I realize some aren't. When I sold 2 Savage rifles that gave me problems I realized I was spending money trying to fix things I shouldn't have to. The people that bought got a deal and felt they could correct the problems. Some people are like that.

Good point about companies putting out garbage. But, what do you do when they don't want to own it? It's nice to hear the OP fixed the problem but I won't spend money and time doing that anymore.


That's exactly how I'd handle a situation where I didn't have time, or ability to fix something. As long as your honest about what is wrong, than there's no issue at all. My comment was meant for the folks that WILL dump crap on unsuspecting people.

There are a few things we can do if we get stuck with a deficient product. None of which is LIKELY to be o get you any money back, but sometimes you can get service, or atleast it gets the info out there in a fair and honest way.

Filing a complaint with the BBB isn't horribly difficult.

Posting a thread outlining the issues with the item, and the companys response, or lack there of. These can go badly depending how the issues are outlined etc, but it can help other folks avoid similar problems and be educated buyers.
This works in personal interactions/conversation, as well as on the forums.

Call and speak to someone as high up the customer service ladder as you can get, explain the issues, and that your extremely unhappy with the product and service you've received up to this point. I've never had any issues getting service after getting a hold of a shift manager or higher.

In the end sometimes you have to eat it and never deal with the company again. This has honestly never happened to me with gun related stuff.
 
That's exactly how I'd handle a situation where I didn't have time, or ability to fix something. As long as your honest about what is wrong, than there's no issue at all. My comment was meant for the folks that WILL dump crap on unsuspecting people.

In the end sometimes you have to eat it and never deal with the company again. This has honestly never happened to me with gun related stuff.

You're absolutely right about some people dumping on unsuspecting people. I was burned like that in my younger years, but we learn from our mistakes.
 
When I built up my Savage in 257 Roberts I went defensive. I called first Tally with serial number of the rifle. This call was due to Savages forty eleven variations with the same name. Calls were made to Tally and Houge to make sure of the right parts. The barrel is an Adams&Bennet. Green Mountain was recently closing out A&B barrels. Savage will not work on rifles made before a certain serial number. This; has to do with only taking care of firearms only made by the current ownership. I was told this when ordering parts or about defective firearms. Should I build another Savage it, too, will be on the defensive.

Addendum. My barrel was ordered from Midway. Also, down in the Skunk Works is a Shaw barrel made up not to use a barrel nut. The caliber is 458 Winchester Magnum. There is a Savage in 7mm Magnum also in the Skunk Works.
 
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I started load development this morning before the wind and rain picked up. I broke down some of the Barnes VOR-TX 120gr ammunition. I probably wouldn't buy 120gr bullets for this rifle but since I have a couple of hundred rounds at least of the Barnes VOR-TX stuff I figured I might as well use what I have. I pulled the bullets, put the powder into a remarked powder container (hard for me to throw powder away), neck sized the brass, punched out the Remington primers, deburred the inside of the case mouths, pressed Wolf primers in, added Varget and reseated the 120gr TTSX bullets. Barnes lists the COAL at 2.800" in their load data but I opted for 2.850" which as it turns out puts the bullet about .022" off the lands (COAL of 2.872" puts the bullet up against the lands). I shot three groups this morning, nothing great, nothing terrible and a good start. The 44.1gr load only had an ES of 10 fps for five shots and an average velocity of close to 3,000 fps. I messed up the last shot of the 44.4gr group sending it lower left. Basically I would say that all three loads are capable of around 1" at 100 yards. I think my next step will be to try the 44.4gr load with different bullet jumps. I'll probably go with .010", .020", .030", .040" and .050" off the lands to see if the groups will tighten up a bit. All in all, things are going much better than they did 10 years ago.

QuickLOAD lists the following pressures for the loads below, based on water weight of fired cases, an adjusted Ba for the powder using actual velocity along with other standard variables.

44.1gr > 57.7 ksi
44.4gr > 58.9 ksi
44.7gr > 60.1 ksi

7mm-08rem_120gr_ttsx.jpg
 
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Great read, and like others have said, ton of patience. I almost sold a rifle that wouldn't group after three range sessions, thankfully I got it sorted out after cooling off and reevaluating everything. I couldn't imagine holding on to one for ten years like that. Nice work.
 
Final update: After going back and forth on this, and finally feeling that I wouldn't be screwing someone over, I decided to sell the rifle. I feel good about the sale, and the $600+ for the rifle, and $100 for the original barrel will go towards another worthy cause. The new owner wanted a decent rifle for his young son to hunt with and I think this is a good rifle/cartridge combination for that purpose. I'll ask the owner to share any developments if he's willing, and will be sure to pass them along. Thanks for the interest in my rather long-winded tale.
 
Excellent read although I've got several Savages Model 99 1930 version, Model 110 1950's version, and two Model 93's one in .22WMR and one in 17HMR not to mention my Savage Model 24V, in all but the 93's did I have a problem that was easily repaired, due to the triggers taking two men and a boy in order to discharge the firearm. Incidentally I've never had a problem with the quality control at Savage, reckon I've been lucky.
 
I'm a fan of Savage rifles and I'm glad you didn't give up on yours.

I was "screwed" (read - uninformed) by the 11.5" twist on my first Savage 7mm-08 but have since learned. Having said that, the 11.5" twist worked fine for 120's and 139's and my brother in law has that rifle now and loves it. He feeds it 139 Hornady interlocks and gets 3/4" groups out of it. My later Savage 7mm-08's have all been of the 9.5" flavor, and they shoot everything great, all the way up to my 162 ELD-X's.
 
If you shared the story with the buyer and he is happy, good on ya!

But unless by a "worthy cause" you mean something other than another rifle, this can't be your "Final Update." You have to tell us what you bought with the proceeds of the sale!
 
Legionnaire said:
But unless by a "worthy cause" you mean something other than another rifle, this can't be your "Final Update." You have to tell us what you bought with the proceeds of the sale!

Ummm ... so my final, final update.... the "worthy cause" was an AI AXMC chambered in 6.5x47mm Lapua. I've had it for close to two weeks now. I installed a new scope last Saturday and put some handloads together on Sunday to get the scope zeroed and also get some idea of how the rifle will perform. Group one (bottom) from a cold/clean bore is 41.2gr of H4350 with a Berger 130gr VLD and CCI450 primer. Group two is 41.5gr of H4350 with the same bullet and primer. Both groups are 5 shots and shot off a bench using an Atlas bipod. A worthy cause indeed. :D

There's plenty of load data out there for the 6.5x47mm Lapua so I wasn't surprised that the first two loads I tried shot well. Average velocity for the first load was 2,800 fps and 2,840 fps for the second.

h4350_41.2gr_41.5gr_130gr_vld.jpg
 
Ummm ... so my final, final update.... the "worthy cause" was an AI AXMC chambered in 6.5x47mm Lapua. I've had it for close to two weeks now. I installed a new scope last Saturday and put some handloads together on Sunday to get the scope zeroed and also get some idea of how the rifle will perform. Group one (bottom) from a cold/clean bore is 41.2gr of H4350 with a Berger 130gr VLD and CCI450 primer. Group two is 41.5gr of H4350 with the same bullet and primer. Both groups are 5 shots and shot off a bench using an Atlas bipod. A worthy cause indeed. :D

There's plenty of load data out there for the 6.5x47mm Lapua so I wasn't surprised that the first two loads I tried shot well. Average velocity for the first load was 2,800 fps and 2,840 fps for the second.

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I’m looking forward to a more comprehensive write up on this sweet set up
 
Nature Boy said:
I’m looking forward to a more comprehensive write up on this sweet set up

I'm planning on doing something once I have the rifle set up the way I want it. I'm almost there so will probably start a thread in a week or two.
 
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