1911 Mysticism

The 1911 was designed for a 200 gr bullet. The Army requested a 230 gr bullet so adjustments were made.

Colt released the first 9mm 1911 in 1950.

You need a better class of friends.

Mr. Mosin said:

Anyways, my buddies say I need a hi cap 9mm; but I don’t necessarily want one.

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Then don't buy one. Spend your gun money on stuff you want.

Ignore your 'buddies'. You get to decide what you want/need. Not them.

A .38 is plenty, and a .45 is more so. I have had some reliability issues with the venerable 1911, but they're usually not difficult to address. I have never had a lick of trouble of any sort with my Colts, Sigs, Ruger, or Dan Wesson.

If .38 and .45 is what you shoot well, then that's what you should shoot, the way I look at it.

Mr. Mosin said:

I have been more accurate with a RIA 1911 and a snub nose .38 than any other handgun I’ve dealt with; including several Glocks. The 1911 is understandable. The snub .38, not so much. ?

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Do you understand what the differences are between a single action semi automatic, double action revolver and a striker fired semiautomatic? Think about what pulling the trigger makes each of those guns do differently.

In addition, handguns with a short sight radius (distance between front sight and rear sight) are more difficult to shoot accurately than handguns with a longer sight radius.
Take identical .38 revolvers, one with a 2.5" bbl, the other with a 6" bbl and all else being equal...…….that 6" will be much easier to shoot accurately.
Same with semiautomatics.

Anyways, my buddies say I need a hi cap 9mm; but I don’t necessarily want one. They say the 1911 is finicky, unreliable, and junk.

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Buy what makes YOU happy.
Some 1911 ARE finicky, unreliable and junk. I shipped back a $2200 Les Baer for a customer because it was unreliable. Turns out the firing pin channel was off center, and would not strike the primer dead center. Not a problem with most .45acp, but some .45 is loaded with small pistol primers.....and the primer strike was off center. Les Baer shipped the gun back with a note "don't use small pistol primers" So, that 1911 was finicky and unreliable, but not junk.

But the vast majority of 1911 aren't junk. It's a great design, but the problems are due to manufacturing. To squeeze the greatest accuracy out of the design, manufacturers will have pretty tight tolerances (no "slop"). Those close tolerances may positively affect accuracy, but may negatively affect reliability. It's quite possible to have both.

I get that the platform was designed to run with 240 grn FMJ, but if it had been finicky or unreliable, the US Military would not have used it. So... what gives

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In 1911, it was cutting edge modern technology. In 2019 there are firearm materials that are faster to produce, don't require the same level of maintenance and above all else....cheaper.
And the US military has used several finicky, unreliable or poorly designed weapons in its time, so don't rely on them for the "best" choice".

Mr. Mosin said:

I have been more accurate with a RIA 1911 and a snub nose .38 than any other handgun I’ve dealt with; including several Glocks. The 1911 is understandable. The snub .38, not so much. Anyways, my buddies say I need a hi cap 9mm; but I don’t necessarily want one. They say the 1911 is finicky, unreliable, and junk. I get that the platform was designed to run with 240 grn FMJ, but if it had been finicky or unreliable, the US Military would not have used it. So... what gives ?

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A properly built 1911 can be a wonderous thing. One of the copies that isnt, can be very frustrating. All depends on what you have.

"Snubbies" also depend on what you have. I prefer S&W's, and have J through L frame snubbies, and they all shoot well. The larger framed guns are a tad easier and more pleasant to shoot, especially for extended outings with full power ammo, but the J frames do well too. Your hand may not agree, but thats between you and your hand.

Four inch Smiths are a lot of fun and great shooters too.

If you dont want the hi-cap, dont get it. Simple as that. Do what's best for you.

Just be careful if you do start to slide that way. Once you get used to them, and "see the light", they tend to quickly multiply. As much as I like my 1911's and S&W's, and still shoot them regularly, I havent carried/used either in decades. A couple of Glocks have been filling that role for quite a while now.

And I can still remember saying back in the 80's "Who the hell would want one of those ugly things?".

Mr. Mosin said:

They say the 1911 is finicky, unreliable, and junk.

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Well over 100yrs after it was introduced its easier to name the companies that do not produce a 1911 variant than those that do. Finicky, unreliable, junk doesn't tend to last long in the firearms world.

Mr. Mosin said:

Anyways, my buddies say I need a hi cap 9mm

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Did they happen to explain why exactly you need one?

I own or have owned... I dunno, around a half dozen 1911's, plus some near copies (such as my Star BM). One was a lemon and had to go back to the factory to be fixed. The rest have been trouble-free. I am guessing that enough time has passed that all of the bugs have been worked out of the design?

Tallball said:

I own or have owned... I dunno, around a half dozen 1911's, plus some near copies (such as my Star BM). One was a lemon and had to go back to the factory to be fixed. The rest have been trouble-free. I am guessing that enough time has passed that all of the bugs have been worked out of the design?

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Not by a long shot.

Ive owned right around 40 1911's in my life, and two-thirds of them were trouble and/or needed work to be reliable, or function properly at all. And there were some well-known names in that lot too.

Colt and GI guns were always the ones Ive had the best luck with overall, and trusted to carry. Even then, the early guns often needed help too, if you wanted reliable function with anything beyond "ball".

Up until just recently, I was so pissed at Springfield that I swore I wouldnt buy another (handgun or rifle), and didnt, since the late 90's. A couple of months ago, I broke that, and Im happy to say, Ive been pleasantly surprised. They still do some stupid crap, but they also seem to be coming back around. At least they figured out what the more or less correct specs for the frames are.

I still wont buy anything Kimber though.

Ive owned a number of Star copies over the years, and they were always good guns. Just finding parts was always an issue, especially with the "P" series.

If youve got a good one, Im sure youre happy. If you get a bad one, I feel your pain.

AK103K said:

Ive owned right around 40 1911's in my life, and two-thirds of them were trouble and/or needed work to be reliable, or function properly at all.

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Ive owned lot more and yet to face the issues you have. Still own dozens..

Must be your Glock shades blinding ya...

Mr. Mosin said:

Anyways, my buddies say I need a hi cap 9mm; but I don’t necessarily want one. They say the 1911 is finicky, unreliable, and junk.

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Then your buddies are stupid.

Buy what you like not what others tell you you should like.

tarosean said:

Ive owned lot more and yet to face the issues you have. Still own dozens..

Must be your Glock shades blinding ya...

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LOL. 1911's are the main reason Im using Glocks now. No blinding at all, and Ive seen the light!

I like 1911's (if they work), and still have four (four that work), but its hard to beat a gun that works 100% out of the box, with no fiddling. I got that from every Glock, SIG, and HK Ive owned. It was a rare thing from any of the 1911's, even the "better" ones. And I didnt have to "break-in", on my dime, any of the others.

I initially switched from Colt's, to SIG's, and then to Glock's. Pretty hard to beat what you get for the money with the Glocks. That was the main reason I switched from SIG's. I like the SIG's, I just get more for my money with the Glocks.

A high capacity 9mm to be mystical about would be a Hi-Power. That would be a good response to your buddies.

It is the size of the hole and where it is that matters.

Mr. Mosin said:

my buddies say I need a hi cap 9mm;

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RIA makes a reasonably-priced 9mm 1911. You'd have the advantage of being totally familiar with the platform already, and you could shut up your buddies. (Is it possible they only want to bum ammo off you? [] )

If you were of a mean disposition, get an RIA 1911 in .38super--it's a "9mm" of sorts (and way too much fun, even if factory ammo is $$$$)

Personally I own one 1911. It is made by Ruger. When I first got it I was getting hit in the head by spent cartridge cases. I did a little research online & tuned the extractor. It has been fine since then. To be honest I don't like snubbies. I actually tend to like .40 more than 9mm but here's the thing. I ain't you. It isn't my money you are spending. I think your buddies need to mind their own business. If I do think someone might be interested in a certain type of gun I am not above taking them shooting with me & letting them shoot my stuff just to see if they like it. If they do fine I might try to help them find a good deal to get one for themselves. If they don't that is fine too. If you are interested in a high capacity 9mm try one to see if you like it. If you don't like it don't buy it. If you aren't interested don't bother.

I once bought a Philippine-made copy of a BMW and had nothing but problems. Therefore BMWs suck and are unreliable, unlike my Toyota Corolla which starts every time.

guyfromohio said:

I once bought a Philippine-made copy of a BMW and had nothing but problems. Therefore BMWs suck and are unreliable, unlike my Toyota Corolla which starts every time.

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Was that BMW copy a carabao and a cart?

I had many 1911,s over the years and am very fond of them as I carried one in the vn war. my latest one is this 1948 colt that spent the last 25 years or so in a holster and had the finish screwed up some and the price was about 500 dollar in trade goods. I gave it a very good detailed cleaning and I have been shooting two boxes of Winchester white box HB 230 gr(good magizines) a week thru it and I only clean the barrel, leaving the rest alone until I,m done(14 boxes of the white box left) or it jams. I also have a glock 22 in .40 S&W (police trade in 275.00) and did the same test running 250 round of 165gr HB thru it with out a jam. the two pistols are not to different in size and loaded weight and I find it easy for me to use both with little worry.

1911s certainly are not finicky unreliable junk. I love my 1911s.

For self defense and daily carry, I prefer one of my Glocks though.

guyfromohio said:

I once bought a Philippine-made copy of a BMW and had nothing but problems. Therefore BMWs suck and are unreliable, unlike my Toyota Corolla which starts every time.

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Part of the problem.. Toyota makes a Corolla. There are not dozens of manufactures producing Corollas to their own specs. Not that "Toyota" is the definitive answer.

AK103K said:

I like 1911's (if they work), and still have four (four that work), but its hard to beat a gun that works 100% out of the box, with no fiddling. I got that from every Glock, SIG, and HK Ive owned. It was a rare thing from any of the 1911's, even the "better" ones. And I didnt have to "break-in", on my dime, any of the others.

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Oh yes you're one of the elusive few fanboys that have glocks that run millions of rounds without malfunctions...

I still own 5 Glocks, owned 10, not a single one is malfunction free... I sure as heck wish I could find the one the internet clamors about .

Not really a knock on Glock as the only guns I own that are not malfunction fee simply have not been shot enough...

tarosean said:

Oh yes you're one of the elusive few fanboys that have glocks that run millions of rounds without malfunctions...

I still own 5 Glocks, owned 10, not a single one is malfunction free... I sure as heck wish I could find the one the internet clamors about .

Not really a knock on Glock as the only guns I own that are not malfunction fee simply have not been shot enough...

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Not really a fan boy, just appreciate things that work.

Never said they were malfunction free either, I have them all the time with my reloads, and I do with other things too, as I load my brass to failure, and that's just the nature of the beast. Never had a failure so far, with new factory or new reloaded brass that I can remember though.

The one thing that all of my Glocks (past 30 now) have all done, new or used, was work without any fiddling, new, right out of the box or used, right out of the shop. Thats something most of my 1911's didnt do, for one reason or another, but especially the new clones.

The newer Colts (90's era Series 80's) were pretty good for the most part, but I still had to replace those silly plastic parts in them. Not that they didnt work, but they just bugged me.

I still like them basically box stock Colts (with steel parts, albeit the fiddling again) too. Decent sights are a nice touch though. Beyond that, seems like a waste. Was never into the tuned up versions. They just seemed to be more problematical.

Though I will say, this new Springfield Defender is not to shabby.

Shot these yesterday. Had three or four stoppages, but other than that, pretty much trouble-free. Its got a little over 500 rounds through it now, but I guess Im still in the "break in" period, as this has been common since I got it.....

This one has some from around 15 yards (static) and in (with a bit of moving and back and forth) with some double and triple "hammers" at 5-7 yards or so.



And this one was basically unsighted "trips" at about 5-7 yards, depending on where I was when I started shooting. Those outliers were a bit of over/under swing from going back and forth (both targets were about 5 feet apart).



It does OK, but nothing really any better than my Glocks 9mm or 45acp either, when shooting the same way.

AK103K said:

Never said they were malfunction free either, I have them all the time with my reloads, and I do with other things too, as I load my brass to failure, and that's just the nature of the beast. Never had a failure so far, with new factory or new reloaded brass that I can remember though.

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Ive got ocean front property in AZ too...