Make or break characteristic of a gun. What's your dealbreaker?

FlSwampRat said:

The support hand runs the new mag in. I must have short thumbs. Here's two pictures, one with a Glock 19 and the other with a Sig 250. See how my thumb easily engages the slide release on the sig but just bare touches the slide release on the Glock.

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I think you are needlessly eliminating quality firearms from consideration.

As primarily a 1911 guy, who spends a lot of time on 1911-specific forums, there are always threads from new guys looking for extended slide stops, extended mag releases, and grip panels with scoops on the mag release side, because they can't reach the slide stop or mag release with their right hand in a shooting grip.

I believe that those things are intentionally put out of your reach to avoid fouling the gun while shooting.

The things you should be touching while shooting the gun are within your reach, like the trigger, and on a 1911, the thumb safety. The things you don't want activated while shooting, like the slide stop or mag release, should be out of your reach.

Shannon Smith on mag changes with a Glock. You don't have to watch the whole video, but note his mag release comment in the 2:05 - 2:20 mark, and how he likes to drop the slide at the 7:45 - 8:05 mark.

Larry Vickers on the slide release at about the 1:15 - 1:45 mark.

Since you mentioned the SIG and the easy to reach slide stop here is Bruce Gray on how that handy slide lock could be a problem (note comment above from Vickers)

FlSwampRat said:

I was presuming a reputedly reliable gun that you'd perhaps read about but never handled, what thing, once in your hand, was the dealbreaker.

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Oh, okay - I misunderstood.
As a matter of fact, there has been a dealbreaker on a few of the guns I've considered in the last few years - fiber optic front sights. I don't care how well they work, I don't like how they look. Period.
If I was to buy myself one of those new Colt Cobras, which I have handled, loved both the DA and SA trigger, and studied the reviews, the first thing I would do is replace the front sight. But I won't buy a Colt Cobra until Colt starts offering different factory options for front sights.

I look for a lot. How it feels in my hand is first and foremost. If the grip isn't comfortable I am not going to want to practice with it. Looking at you Walther PPS M2. Can't test reliability in a gun store.

Controls play a big part. I wouldn't want to use a 2x4 as a hammer. So why would I use a gun with a trigger I didn't like? Or slide release? Or magazine release? I have to comfortably reach everything in order to use it correctly.
Sight. Bad sights, I put it back. Even though I use a laser on my handguns (usually) for exotic shooting (on my side etc) I still appreciate good sights. Or at least have an aftermarket for better ones.
Natural point of aim. This plays part of the grip equation. If I can't point it naturally, it doesn't have much use.

Weight isn't that much of an issue. Sometimes if a handguns feels too heavy unloaded at the store, it balances out with ammo inside.

I look for a few things.

• How does it feel? I wear XXL gloves. I have fairly big hands so many guns do not feel right to me.
  
• How is access to slide release, mag release, cylinder release, safety (if available)
• Weird controls - safety the opposite of “normal” kills it for me. Up to fire? Down to the top of counter it goes.
  
• Weight and feel of the weight. If a gun is not balanced or too heavy for what it is I am not interested.

One thing I must say. For years I wanted a CZ75 and I wanted a Browning Hi-Power. They felt great in my hands. I would check them out at gun shows and gun stores but I never seemed to have the money when I found them for sale at reasonable prices.
The indoor range I belong to has them for rent so a couple of months ago I decided I was going to sell my Glock 19X and G45 (I can get a lot of money for these in California) and I was going to get a CZ75 and a Browning Hi-Power.
I rented them and fired them.
I did not like them one bit.
I didn’t like the controls on the CZ and the Browning hammer bit my hand and I didn’t like the way it rocked in my hand(s) when cycling. They went back to the range master.

• So, I can add that before I buy a gun I want to test fire the same model.

FlSwampRat said:

... You pick it up, clear it, point it in a safe direction and now what's your biggest deciding factor as to whether to buy it or put it down ...

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At that point, since I can already see many of the external features (and I am confident that I can fix/mitigate most trigger-action issues), the most important to me is whether or not it feels right in my hand.

Manually actuated safeties (besides the glock dingus trigger). It is a no go. Maybe be on when you hope its off and off when you hope its on. Flat out deal breaker, a man must trust his equipment. A little spring and flappy bit to prevent me from unintentional body piercing? No thanks.
I own a couple that have them but i never use them , never.

I know this is the SA forum, but I look for revolvers where I can feel the cylinder lock drop into its slot before the hammer falls, DA. With practice, it can make DA as accurate as SA and a lot faster. Security Sixes were good that way.

Of course the new S&W 642 that wouldn't let anyone open its cylinder was a pass too. Why does Smith let turkeys like that get out? LGS guy said, "I guess you'll need to send it back". Ended up buying a used M37.

Not much on impulse buying of guns. If I’ve ask to see it most likely it’s a done deal unless some thing wasn’t obvious in the display case.

Rejection criteria:

• Can't get three fingers on the front strap.
• Poor fit to my hand. Smooth, simple grips are OK. Highly sculptured grips (e.g. Walther, HK) not.
• Trigger reach too long or, rarely, too short. (Most DA/SA guns are too long.)
• Combination of gun & cartridge painful to shoot. (May be fixed with lighter loads and/or bullets.)

I look inside the gun, is it dirty? Is it scratched up? Does it have the original box or the extra mag that came with it? I tend to lose interest if it looks like the gun hasn't been taken care of.

I've owned or at least shot all of the common handguns and a lot of the less common ones. How it fits my hand is WAAAAY down on the list of concerns. Except for the extremes of being too big, or too small, my hand will conform to any shape I place in it.There are only 2 guns that I simply wouldn't own as a gift.

CZ's are way over rated in my opinion. But the design feature that is a deal killer is the slide inside of the frame. It makes the slide too narrow to get a good grip on when operating the slide and is just plain ugly. I've owned a few sold them all and won't be coming back.

The grip safety on XD pistols is also a deal killer. It is far more likely to prevent the gun from firing when you want it to fire than prevent it from firing when you don't want it to fire. I can tolerate a grip safety on a 1911 simply because that is just part of the iconic design. It would be a better pistol if it were not there. But at least the 1911 grip safety is well designed. Even at that disabling the safety was a common modification among those who actually carried 1911's back in the day.

I'm not crazy about most DA/SA pistols, but it isn't a deal killer.

Other than that I can make any of them work for me. I have preferences if I'm buying. But if I worked for someone who was issuing the gun I can make any of them work and would have confidence in the gun and my ability to use it.

Like a rifle or shotgun, a handgun has to FIT me

Agree with jmr40 on the grip safeties. They are deal killers.

First impressions:
1) How well the gun feels in my hand.
2) How well the gun points/how easy the sights are to acquire.
3) How good is the trigger pull.

Long term concerns:
1) Reliability.
2) Accuracy.
3) Durability/Overall fit and finish.

If when I pick it up, it does not feel right in my hand, I go no further.

Trigger break and reset.

Hence why I tend to only buy 1911s for semi autos.

Revolvers I dont have any interest in calibers over 357, and prefer full sized heavy 357s at that. Im a recoil baby after wrist and elbow surgery.

A type of rifle or handgun which was issued to (mostly foreign) police or military units. Just being frank.

That's why there are the CZ PCR, four Sig P6/228 series (all German-proofed) and just ordered, a Walther P99 AS.
Most of these are basic DA/SA, but the Walther P99 is a striker with a DA function, plus a Different option to use the long first pull, AS function.

It can't abuse me just by shooting it. No pinching, biting, and no over the top painful recoil.

Nothing that may make me develop a flinch.

Manual safety. If i am handling a pistol and it has a safety. I always pass. Regardless of the price.

can't be plastic or ugly