Loading 9mm for S&W shield

With only the one gun you can tailor the ammo more towards that one gun. I try to set the OAL as long as possible.

From looking at your Silhouette target and believing it was shot at 7yds I would have to say that's not all bad with a 9mm. That working with the ammo a little more and practicing with that gun it will get only better. All my 9mm and larger pistols have barrels at least 4" long. Even my 380's are 3.6" long. I have shot an LC380 and an XDs 9 3.3 and I don't like any of the compact/subcompacts. This Shield you have is it a compact?

Waterboy3313 said:

9mm for a S&W shield ... I have been using a 124 gr RN plated bullet with titegroup. Started at 3.8 gr and moved up to 4.2. I can't get a group anywhere close to as good as the cheap white box junk.

Anyone here loading for a 9mm shield using titegroup? If so I'm just curious what you are doing that works.

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While I found in general for plated bullets to be not as accurate as jacketed bullets, I tend to be careful with taper crimp so as to not cut into the plating or reduce the bullet diameter. I usually add .022" to the diameter of the bullet so for .355" sized bullets, I use .377" taper crimp and for .356" sized bullets, .378" taper crimp. And for 124 gr FMJ/RN bullets, I tend to load around 1.135" OAL.

As to using Titegroup and plated bullet, here's Berry's 124 gr RN (Solid base) and Titegroup 25 yard groups (They were loaded longer because I was doing comparison testing with Berry's HBRN-TP with longer base) - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...e-pistol-reloaders.746062/page-2#post-9382933




As to Shield 9mm's accuracy, it benefits from break in as rough trigger jerks/jumps the front sight quite a bit and trigger smoothed out with about 500 dry firings and subsequent several thousand rounds fired and many Shield owners report the same that their Shields shoot more accurate as round count increases.

My general purpose range blasting ammo (which is more accurate than Winchester white box) is loaded with RMR 115 gr FMJ with 4.0 - 4.2 gr of Promo loaded shorter at 1.110" OAL. Even with pulled plated RN bullets I got from RMR loaded to around 1.125" OAL, they are comparable, if not more accurate than Winchester white box.

Waterboy3313 said:

Where I am we qualify for ccw carry at 7 yards. That's really all I want out of the shield but I would like to shoot it the best I can.

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I've done a bunch of reload testing with my Shield 9 and found it to be my only short barrel pistol that was tough to zero in the most accurate load. BE-86 and CFE-Pistol are my best powders for lighter bullets(105-115gn), BE-86 and Autocomp for 124s and for 147s it's Power Pistol and Longshot. I test at 10 yards from a rest. For range practice I use SNS 125 CRN and are about the most accurate bullet I've found for my Shield, and more accurate than any factory ammo I've tested. As for defense loads, Speer 124 Gold-Dot is what I load and using BE-86 I've dialed them in to be more accurate than factory Gold-Dots. Also, contrary to what others have said about c-oal, I've found the Shield to do best with the shortest c-oal possible.

Waterboy3313 said:

The shield is my least favorite pistol. I carry it mostly because it's a lot more comfortable to carry than my full size 1911 especially when driving or sitting for any length of time. I do shoot it when I go shooting more or less just to practice and since I am starting to reload my goal is to load for everything I shoot.

Where I am we qualify for ccw carry at 7 yards. That's really all I want out of the shield but I would like to shoot it the best I can.

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I got the Shield as I wanted a single stack 9mm option that was smaller and thinner than Glock 23.

And you can't compare an ultra compact pistol to full-size pistols as their purpose and application are different and some compromise is expected. If you compare the Shield to other ultra/subcompact pistols, you will find that its recoil and accuracy is way better than average. There are some ultra/subcompacts I have shot that I won't even consider as trigger, accuracy, felt recoil and shootability were too much of a compromise for me.

I teach/share defensive point shooting and many female shooters, even elderly shooters, have found Shield 9mm particularly attractive due to size that fits their smaller hands well and compared to other subcompacts, they demonstrate greater degree of proficiency and accuracy. We conduct point shooting training at 5-7 yards, and many do not have any issues placing all of their fast shots on the multiple copy paper targets, usually with 2"-4" groups (This is fast double taps). I do fast headshot demonstration with Shield at 7 yards and can consistently produce fast double taps and readily demonstrate magazine dumps to COM (intended practical application of the Shield).

Keep in mind, Shield is a close range pistol intended for defensive shooting, not long range target shooting and fills that role quite well.

In my recent group, elderly wife of one of the shooters shot the Shield better than other pistols we had and produced 2"-3" groups at 5 yards point shooting and consistently outshot all the other shooters shooting my Glock 22/23 with 40-9 conversion barrels.

Waterboy3313 said:

I don't have more than 500 rounds through it yet so hopefully it will get a little better with age.

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Dry fire the Shield while watching the front sight. If it jerks or moves when the striker is released, it will affect the group size on target and you should continue to break in the Shield until the front sight doesn't move when the striker is released before finalizing an accurate load.

For my Shield, I dry fired several hundred times before I started shooting it to smooth out the trigger.

The in house FMJ bullet from RMR is a fine projectile and priced at or lower than most plated bullets if you buy 1000. The perform very well with BE86 and Power Pistol in my Shield
I probably shoot my Shield worse than about any gun I have. I can do great at getting them all in a 6 inch circle, and can often land double taps that almost touch but I just don't have the precision of other guns with it but it's plenty good for self defense

Waterboy3313 said:

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One of your "issues" you're having is the target. The human eye simply can't refine its aim at a huge target. Next time you go to the range, print some 2" black circles on your computer and take them with you. Tape those to the corners of your target and see if your groups don't shrink considerably. Same gun, same ammo, smaller groups.

Hope this helps.

+1. Shooting with smaller targets definitely helps.

For my point shooting training, after going over the basics of shooting and synchronizing natural POA with POI, full sheets of copy paper targets are reduced to 1/2 then 1/4 sheets for fast double tap drills.

What kind of seating die are you using?
The only time I've had poor accuracy with the 9mm is when the seating stem doesn't match the bullet profile.
I had a big jump in accuracy years ago when I switched from a Lee seater die to a Redding comp die.
Right now I'm using Rainier plated 124 RN and getting great results at 25 yards using Bullseye or W231 in my 1911.

PO2Hammer said:

What kind of seating die are you using?

The only time I've had poor accuracy with the 9mm is when the seating stem doesn't match the bullet profile.
I had a big jump in accuracy years ago when I switched from a Lee seater die to a Redding comp die.

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I use unmodified Lee combination bullet seating and taper crimp die and found that OAL variance results from the consistency of bullet nose profile (ogive) where the seating stem contacts the bullet. And not tilting the bullet when seating helps too.

With many bullets with less consistent nose profile (ogive), I get greater OAL variance but with bullets with more consistent nose profile (ogive) like RMR jacketed bullets, I get more consistent .001" OAL variance even when using mixed range brass - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...progressive-press.833604/page-2#post-10779806

Perhaps that's one of many reasons why ELEY chose to use RMR jacketed bullets for their new line of match grade ammunition - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...or-their-new-line-of-match-ammunition.854750/

Here's Shooting Sports USA review of ELEY .38 Super Comp match ammunition using RMR 124 gr FMJ with .001" OAL variance - https://www.ssusa.org/articles/2019/9/20/review-eley-38-super-comp-ammunition/

That thou variance is really good. We typically try to keep the bullet within 3 thou but accept 5 thou oal variance.

LiveLife said:

And not tilting the bullet when seating helps too.

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That's the key IME.
I don't worry at all about minor AOL variance, I only worry about getting the seated straight.
With 9mm it seems very easy to seat bullets crooked.

OP, try rolling your handloads on a smooth table, you can sometimes see the wobble in the bullet nose when they are seated crooked.
Also look for un-even bulges in the brass at the bullet base.

Waterboy3313 said:

I have a Taurus 605 snub nose 357 that has 96 rounds through it so far and I can actually get better groups with it than my shield at 7 yards. I would like to think it would be the opposite way around.

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At 7 yards, Shield should be shooting smaller than 2"- 3" sized groups - https://mp-pistol.com/mp-shield-pistols/70948-shield-extremely-accurate-defense-pistol.html

I have just received a MP Shield M2.0 with a Crimson Laser Compact from my brother and now I will have to try it as I have never shot this gun but I have shot a Ruger LC380 and a Springfield XDs 9 3.3 compact and I do not like shooting any of the subcompact pistols that I cannot get a full 3 fingers on the grip. I also have another full size pistol that is very accurate only it is hard for me to shoot because I just have a hard time picking up the sights.

As soon as I can get to the range I will report back on how this one shot.

Lastly there is nothing wrong with your equipment. I load on 3 different Lee presses and have 5 different sets of Lee dies and they all produce very accurate ammunition. Shooting free handed unsupported at 7yds if I can keep a group within the spread of my index finger and little finger then I feel I did good. Then again if I was able to shoot once a week I am sure my groups would get smaller.

I would use my Shield for COM accuracy, and call it a day. The WWB ammo is good and inexpensive, so I don't reload 9mm other than for plinking.

Which Shield do you have? The 2.0 model or the original that is still for sale for $250.00 in the discount houses? The original like mine had a terrible trigger and there were Apex kits for sale for $90.00 each to fix the triggers when I got mine.

I couldn't afford $90.00 to fix that nasty trigger, so i fixed mine my self. I wouldn't advise you try that unless your a machinist and understand what an Apex kit fixes. I'm in what's called the multi-talented field, I am an industrial electrician and controls guy by trade, but I had to be the machinist for 16 years also for one of the companies I worked for.

If you have the 2.0 model and the trigger is that bad then you need to send it back to Smith and Wesson for repair.
If you have the original and has the crappy trigger mine had, take it to a gun smith and get an estimate for fixing it.
If the quote to fix is too much than trade it off on something else.

I have come to terms with mine and just today at the range, at 25yds I hit the 6" steel swing plates 4 out of 6 times with my old original Shield. I was pretty happy with that.

Waterboy3313 said:

Yes it's compact and I have XL hands. Not a great combo for me.

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I don't want to veer us off track, but I have XL hands also that are pretty boney. Shooting compact guns is challenging for me also. That being said, I like the original XDs, but the P938 Legion has supplanted it, and is a gun you may want to consider, especially with your familiarity with the 1911. Assuming it's CA approved.

Watching this thread as I just started loading 9mm myself. Hoping to try them on Saturday.

to fix crooked bullets: barely seat the bullet in the case, rotate the case at least 90 degrees, seat fully. if that doesn't do it: barely seat, rotate, seat a bit more, rotate, seat fully.

luck,

murf

460Shooter said:

P938 Legion has supplanted it, and is a gun you may want to consider, especially with your familiarity with the 1911. Assuming it's CA approved.

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Unfortunately it is not on the roster - https://oag.ca.gov/firearms/certified-handguns/search?make=150970

Not having a Shield nor shooting one prior to this one I just received I completely forgot the issue with the early triggers and that nearly everyone was doing an upgrade kit to them. That may just be something to look into. Too bad you do not have someone with a Mod 2.0 that you could shoot and see if you are having the same results.