Police Seize Guns From Man Thought to Be Neo-Nazi Leader

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I think they should have to charge and convict you with some sort of criminal threatening/harassment or terrorizing … not that familiar with how they approach this or all the scenarios, but - really it seem to me as I'm learning about this - that if you qualify for some sort of red flag, it should be qualified with some sort of crime that can be attributed to it. For mental illness, maybe you get attributed some outpatient status for mental health care - after being determined to be a threat to yourself or others due to mental instability. If they can go after you just because you have ideas and can speak, possibly those ideas are a parody, or a joke, or you're just a wise hytss who like to be a contrarian … if there is no crime, or proof that you are a threat to yourself or others, well - that seems to open a Pandora's box of confiscation due to not liking someone - for whatever reason, different ideas than you - and well, to be honest - we all watch the news and see how tolerant some groups are of ideas that are different in any way than their ideas.
 
Propaganda and influence rule the day, for those of you that haven't been on the planet for the last few decades.

The MSM spreads this the most and is unequivocally biased against everything, every SINGLE thing, non progressive.

Just about every item in our BOR's has been and is currently under attack. What gets my goose is that this "attack" is only aimed at non progressive entities. Patriot, Nationalist, 3%'er all get labeled as racist, Nazi or "White this or that".

Just be careful what you're judging when it comes to MSM articles.
 
ApacheCoTodd said:
Right, and as such, the implied Nazi affiliation should have NO bearing on the decision, the reporting nor the final outcome.
Jack-wagon laws putting people like me in the position of defending odious stands like Nazism really tweak me.

Todd.
Click to expand...
Like the First Amendment? ;) The SPLC thinks so, too.
 
Jammersix said:
When I read "no due process", I know I'm reading something written by someone who doesn't know what due process is.
Click to expand...

Many posters on these boards, declare laws "unconstitutional" without ever having read the US Constitution: Never mind they're not qualified to rule on the Constitution. Same folks often rage about "red flag" laws without ever having read an ERPO.
 
IDK what an Erpo is but then again I drink Coke (never Pepsi) and have no clue what's in it having never read the ingredients. All I know is it taste good, my burps taste good, and it really does a good job in cleaning the toilet bowl.
BTW alsaqr, are you a real Falcon or just identity as one? I love Arabic btw.
 
Thanks, The Falcon made me look it up. I had one of those a long time ago, soon to be ex-wife (2002 at the time) made outrageous claims that took me 2.5 years in court to prove as false and luckily got my (at the time) one pistol back from the popo. This happened 4 years after my retirement from the popo and I still knew many of the investigators which still didn't help me. It was called an Order of Protection I guess, didn't know there were now Extreme Orders, is that like 91 octane vs 86? Thank you God for making me old in this confused time, and thank Jesus for Coke so I don't have to drink Pepsi.
 
Show me he made a specific threat, and I'm all for taking his guns. The following is a quote from the New York Times article. Law enforcement can't point to that, which is concerining for me. As I mentioned in the last thread regarding this, my parents came here immediately after WW2, during which they endured unimaginable horrors. I lost quite a few family members to Nazis, including my grandfather who was taken away in the middle of the night, put in a camp and killed there because he was hiding a Jewish friend and refused to tell the Nazis where he was. IMO the Nazis and their supporters are among the most repugnant people who have lived. That being said, you have the right to be repugnant as long as you're not a threat to anyone. For those who are in favor of taking his guns, can you list the specific threat he made? I'm not saying he didn't make one, only that I don't see it and acording to the NYT article law enforcement didn't either.

Some other food for thought. The San Francisco city counsel has labeled the NRA a terrorist organization, and the far left agrees with them. Is that enough to confiscate guns from NRA members? I'd tread carefully when tossing Constitutional rights out the window.

"Ms. Wyatt said law enforcement officials have continued discussing what criminal laws might apply to Mr. Cole’s case. She said criminal statutes focus on threats made to an intended victim.

“What do you do when there’s a general threat versus one specific individual?” Ms. Wyatt said. She said officials were discussing their options under state law.

Federal investigators have also faced this issue as they struggle to balance First Amendment protections that allow hate speech and actions that could be an indicator of future violence. In some cases, the F.B.I. has turned to local prosecutors to handle the cases."
 
What can one expect from a nation that no longer understands human anatomy?

Macho ma'am Randy Savage YouTube



I wonder if Red Flag or ERPO applies to YouTube for posting this violence?
 
old lady new shooter said:
So once a felon is released from prison you believe s/he should be allowed to own guns?
Click to expand...
Most felons who are released from prison should be still be in prison. While we are talking about "should be" and what I THINK, I also think they should all be hot bunking like our service men in many military situations and they should be breaking rocks and building MORE prisons when it is not their turn in the rack they share with 2 other low life convicted criminals.
 
TomJ said:
Show me he made a specific threat, and I'm all for taking his guns. The following is a quote from the New York Times article. Law enforcement can't point to that, which is concerining for me. As I mentioned in the last thread regarding this, my parents came here immediately after WW2, during which they endured unimaginable horrors. I lost quite a few family members to Nazis, including my grandfather who was taken away in the middle of the night, put in a camp and killed there because he was hiding a Jewish friend and refused to tell the Nazis where he was. IMO the Nazis and their supporters are among the most repugnant people who have lived. That being said, you have the right to be repugnant as long as you're not a threat to anyone. For those who are in favor of taking his guns, can you list the specific threat he made? I'm not saying he didn't make one, only that I don't see it and acording to the NYT article law enforcement didn't either.

Some other food for thought. The San Francisco city counsel has labeled the NRA a terrorist organization, and the far left agrees with them. Is that enough to confiscate guns from NRA members? I'd tread carefully when tossing Constitutional rights out the window.

"Ms. Wyatt said law enforcement officials have continued discussing what criminal laws might apply to Mr. Cole’s case. She said criminal statutes focus on threats made to an intended victim.

“What do you do when there’s a general threat versus one specific individual?” Ms. Wyatt said. She said officials were discussing their options under state law.

Federal investigators have also faced this issue as they struggle to balance First Amendment protections that allow hate speech and actions that could be an indicator of future violence. In some cases, the F.B.I. has turned to local prosecutors to handle the cases."
Click to expand...

You can't jail people for making threats. If you did half the Democratic party would be in jail right now. HE wasn't JAILED FOR MAKING THREATS. He was NEVER CHARGED WITH ANY CRIME. He was attacked by left wing political hacks and their lackeys in the government. He was attacked for his politics and WHAT HE THOUGHT or at least what THEY THOUGHT he thought.
 
Jack Ryan said:
Most felons who are released from prison should be still be in prison. While we are talking about "should be" and what I THINK, I also think they should all be hot bunking like our service men in many military situations and they should be breaking rocks and building MORE prisons when it is not their turn in the rack they share with 2 other low life convicted criminals.
Click to expand...

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overturned_convictions_in_the_United_States

We have to be careful, prosecutors are in many cases prejudiced and dishonest by nature.

Reminds me of the tragic bus accident that killed 54 lawyers when the bus was a 55 seater.

Remember Mike Nifong?
 
Edited above. Don't believe that someone is guilty or innocent just because the courts say so. That's my point.
 
Jack Ryan said:
"He has not been charged with a crime."

But his property has been seized by the government under physical threat. His rights have been trampled and HE IS THE THREAT?

"He has not been charged with a crime."
Click to expand...
No one has been charged with a crime when they kick down their door at three in the morning with a perfectly valid warrant.

Why don't you tell us exactly which right has been "trampled"? Be specific. Use citations.
 
film495 said:
I think they should have to charge and convict you with some sort of criminal threatening/harassment or terrorizing … not that familiar with how they approach this or all the scenarios, but - really it seem to me as I'm learning about this - that if you qualify for some sort of red flag, it should be qualified with some sort of crime that can be attributed to it. For mental illness, maybe you get attributed some outpatient status for mental health care - after being determined to be a threat to yourself or others due to mental instability. If they can go after you just because you have ideas and can speak, possibly those ideas are a parody, or a joke, or you're just a wise hytss who like to be a contrarian … if there is no crime, or proof that you are a threat to yourself or others, well - that seems to open a Pandora's box of confiscation due to not liking someone - for whatever reason, different ideas than you - and well, to be honest - we all watch the news and see how tolerant some groups are of ideas that are different in any way than their ideas.
Click to expand...
Why?

If you believe search warrants are legitimate, these laws carry the same weight of legitimacy.
 
old lady new shooter said:
So once a felon is released from prison you believe s/he should be allowed to own guns?
Click to expand...
Yes.

We should not have a class society where people with different rights.

When someone is in prison they technically still have all their rights (they are unalienable); they are just lawfully repressed through Due Process.

Once you are out then your rights should not be continued to be repressed. If someone is too dangerous to let have a gun, then we shouldn't let them out.

Look at it from another point of view. Say someone commits a crime like auto theft and goes to prison for a year. He does his time and then he gets out. He cannot own a gun. Ten years later someone breaks into his apartment and beats him to death. He was unable to defend himself since he could not own a gun.

Is that right?

I don't think so.
 
No Due Process, No confiscation. Thats the crux with "Red Flag Laws" and the Constitution.

If they are making implicit threats, which can range from Terroristic to Domestic violence, then they can be detained/questioned/arrested and go before a Judge....

Haul him/her in and get em evaluated with a Judges order,....... thats how it works.

You are innocent until you have committed a crime, innocent untill your proven guilty in a court of law......... thats how it works.

"Freedom isnt safe" would be appropriate.
 
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