GLOCK G36 - Or, When Did a .45 ACP 1911-A1 Stop Being Good Enough For SD?

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The thread is in regards to SD/CCW pistols, specifically, but not limited to, the .45 ACP chambering.

While arguably a better HD choice, how many will actually CC/IWB a G30, over a small compact/sub-compact, because they shoot it better?

I shoot the 1911-A1 better, but I gladly carry the G36.

As for "FBI Qualification Course," the 1911-A1 was used as a known quantity benchmark, for power and effectiveness in the SD environment, as the threat wouldn't know the difference.




GR
Ive always carried full sized handguns, and done so my whole life. 1911's, P220's, P226's, Glock 17's etc.

I carry a 26 as a back up to my 17 these days, and in a deeper concealment type holster.

Im not seeing how the 30 or 36 would be any different there, as if I were to carry one, it would likely be in the same place as my 26.

Why give up your "full size" handgun, especially if you shoot it best?
 
Ive always carried full sized handguns, and done so my whole life. 1911's, P220's, P226's, Glock 17's etc.

I carry a 26 as a back up to my 17 these days, and in a deeper concealment type holster.

Im not seeing how the 30 or 36 would be any different there, as if I were to carry one, it would likely be in the same place as my 26.

Why give up your "full size" handgun, especially if you shoot it best?

It is an optimized G23/19 compact, with a 1" thick 4" Bbl. length slide and full three finger purchase.


If you CC full size pistols, you are in the minority.

Compact is the biggest I can go on a CC/IWB pistol.

And the G36 is the cleanest of the group for me.




GR
 
I bought a 36 years ago, sold it. Regretted it. Bought another, it's my favorite 45 now. Prefer it to the 30sf frame.

If you carry it in a thin suede IWB holster, like the Galco Stow-N-Go, consider a Rhinoplasty.

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Easy to do, and really adds to both comfort and ease of holstering.




GR
 
I compared the 30 and 36. 30 is a little wider and longer in the grip and holds 3 more rounds. I bought the 30.

JMO
 
I went from an Officers ACP to a Glock 36 After the slide broke for the second time. I just thought it might not run when I needed it. My 36 was very Glock like, reliability wise. And at least as accurate as my Colt. Probably more so with its favorite load. 185 grain XTP’s.

So why don’t I have it anymore? I put it next to my G19 one day and realized that they were basically the same size. Not exactly, (yes, I know the grip is thicker on the 19) but close enough for me. Traded it straight up for a G17. The G17 would make a better comparison to your Government model 1911.

Red headed stepchild, maybe. But not a bastard at all.

Yep, it's a red headed stepchild. The 36 is not a completely logical choice considering all that's out there now. I got my 36 about 10 years ago and I can't recall the slim .45 ACP options of that time in polymer framed pistols?

For whatever reason, I still like my 36. I have a few other guns that I really question myself owning, but less so my 36.

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I've carried a G36 as a backup gun, especially when I was carrying a Combat Commander as a primary. I'm fairly good sized and have no trouble concealing a Commander, so I prefer the larger gun for CC here in the states. The 9mm is a good round when carrying high performance HP loads, not so much when loaded with ball ammo - as our military was carrying in Iraq and Afghanistan last time I was there. I only used a 1911 (with ball ammo) twice in my one year tour in Viet Nam in 1972-1973 - both times were at fairly close range. Both times I shot two or three rounds, and both times they took care of the job. My last two trips to Iraq I carried a G19 loaded with 124 grain Federal hydra-shoks or Speer gold dot loads; few times I needed to use a pistol, the G19 always got the job done fine for me. I think the G43X would be an excellent small CCW for anyone preferring the 9mm. The Sig 365 is as good, perhaps better for some.
 
I'm biased towards more rounds because of my experiences. But the G36 is a great handgun. If you like it, shoot it well, and are more likely to carry it because you like it, those are the most important things.

Like I said in the other thread.... everything is a compromise. You gotta find the right compromise to fit your situation.
 
The G36 is the least reliable Glock as I understand it. I have had nothing but trouble with my 1911's since 1997-98. I have a mostly trouble-free Valor Government, but it starts jamming around 200-300 rounds. Action spring life seems to be around 1,000 with this gun, but Wolff springs are cheap. Trusting any of them for carry is not something I'll do.

Personally, I have so many other excellent 45 caliber pistols that I just don't worry about my 1911's too much. I carry the others as I see fit and they work fine. SIG, Glock and S&W all work well for me with minimal fuss.
 
Its not that the 1911 isnt good enough for civilain SD, but LE departments have always been scared of single- action triggers for liability reasons.

Is there evidence that striker-fired actions have shown to be a lesser liability?

What I would like to see is how many unintentional discharges per man hour there have been with DA/SA, striker, and SA guns from some set of data or another, and it would be good if it were broken down to discharges during enforcement activities versus discharges during routine training, practice, cleaning etc. I have seen one such report by DoJ IG Glenn Fine for years 2000-2003. It didn't break it down by action, but I think all the agencies included were using DA/SA in those years. There must be some data somewhere.

The FBI has more than 10,000 Special Agents. I think NYPD has something like 38,000 uniformed officers. They're going to have some number of unintended discharges per person-year, and when they switched from DA to DA/SA to striker, did it change? There are agencies that authorize SA's like the 1911. Those are popular with my county's Sheriff's department, but their numbers are too small.
 
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Getting back to the subject:
If you shoot the G36 best go with it.
If you don't go with what you do.

It always amazes me how it's always about the indian not the arrow until someone chooses a 1911 or .380.
 
Getting back to the subject:
If you shoot the G36 best go with it.
If you don't go with what you do.

It always amazes me how it's always about the indian not the arrow until someone chooses a 1911 or .380.

Keep thinkin' about the new compacts that have come along of late, namely the Glock G48 and SIG P365 XL.

But they are a little this and a little that... incrementally better in some ways, but not a magnitude better, and in some ways not as good.

I think a G48 chambered in .40, with an 8-round OEM mag and maybe a 12-round Shield Arms steel mag, would be ideal.

...but as things are today, they will probably be shoveling dirt in my face long before .40 becomes the flavor-of-the-month again, and they start chambering the new pistols for it.

But then, who knows.


So the G36 is a compromise pistol.

But for SD/CCW, it brings the features I most value for that environment.


P.S.

My SA 1911-A1 "Mil-Spec" has been rock solid, just swapped in an 18.5# Wolff recoil spring and greased everything that slides.

Runs like industrial equipment.




GR
 
P.S.

My SA 1911-A1 "Mil-Spec" has been rock solid, just swapped in an 18.5# Wolff recoil spring and greased everything that slides.

Runs like industrial equipment.




GR
Glad yours is. Mine is going the other direction.

First, out of the blue, it started choking on SWC's, now it's choking on ball. After about 20 years, I was hoping Springfield might had got things figured out. Guess not.
 
Glad yours is. Mine is going the other direction.

First, out of the blue, it started choking on SWC's, now it's choking on ball. After about 20 years, I was hoping Springfield might had got things figured out. Guess not.

I'd contact AS and then send it back to the mother ship.

Run only 230 gr. ball and HP through mine.

Do you grease everything that slides?




GR
 
Keep thinkin' about the new compacts that have come along of late, namely the Glock G48 and SIG P365 XL.

But they are a little this and a little that... incrementally better in some ways, but not a magnitude better, and in some ways not as good.
GR

The 43x is also close in size to the 36 but with 10 rounds of 9mm. Little more grip length but considerably thinner.
G36: 6.97 long, 1.18 wide, 4.72 height, 2.95 trigger distance
G43x: 6.50 long, 1.10 wide, 5.04 height, 2.64 trigger distance.
 
I'd contact AS and then send it back to the mother ship.

Run only 230 gr. ball and HP through mine.

Do you grease everything that slides?



GR
For now, Ill fiddle with it and see if I cant get it figured out. If I cant, Id rather give it to someone who knows how to make them work, than send it back to Springfield. Been through this before with them in the somewhat distant past with a couple of things.

Mine seemed to work fine when I first got it, and then all of a sudden, it just started to dislike my 200-grain SWC loads, and now my 230-grain FMJ "ball" loads. All my other guns run fine on them, 1911's or otherwise.

I use oil for lube, and where things are supposed to be oiled.

This is one of the main reasons I quit considering the 1911's as a "serious" gun a couple of decades ago, as there always seems to be "something" you have to fiddle with or deal with, with them. Nothing seems to have changed.

The Springfield was the second 1911 clone Ive bought in the past year or so, and both have been problematic. I think Ive got the High Standard figured out, and it seems to be running OK now, but it, like the Springfield, are basically delegated range toys. I wouldnt trust them for anything serious.
 
OP, I found myself in the same situation years ago. I like the 45 ACP cartridge, and wanted to carry something pretty small. At least smaller than my 1911 or a Glock 21 (which I found to be too big for my large hands--go figure). This was in pre-30sf days. I wanted Glock reliability and Glock perfection, so I bought a Glock 36.

For about three years I carried that G36 every day in a Versamax II and I shot it a lot in practice, classes, and in IDPA (I know, not an optimal gun for that game, but I wanted the experience).

In the middle of this, I wanted to compare my performance with the G36 to the 1911 so I took them to the range and shot back-to-back-to-back IDPA classifiers with each one. I was a tiny bit more accurate with the 1911, but the scores were functionally equivalent. I still have the scores.

Over those three years, the G36 broke four times. Go-to-the-workbench-to-install-new-parts-to-solve-the-problem broken. Your-gun-doesn't-work-get-a-backup-for-the-rest-of-the-stages broken. I couldn't tolerate that performance in a carry gun, so I sold it, the holster, and eight mags (with disclosure) after the last repair.

Just a sample of one, I know. But it was enough for me. YM most certainly MV.

For the last eight years, I've carried an XD compact in 45 ACP. Flawless performance. I've run the heck out of it and several other XD/XDm pistols. I really like my latest, an XDm 5.25 competition model in 9mm. I've heard trainers with lots of experience say that Glocks don't fail in their classes and that XDs are junk. Or McRibbs. Or whatever. I don't deny their perspectives. But I trust what MY experience has been more.
 
The 45 and 1911 are both as good as ever, better actually, but that isn't saying much. Both the 1911 and 45 ACP's legendary status is more hyperbole than fact. The 9mm round has always been the equal of 45 and given the option of buying a 9mm that holds 15 rounds in the same size/weight gun, or a 7-10 round 9mm in a gun 1/2 the size/weight of a 1911 or G36 I'll choose the 9mm every time.

There are many good reasons for choosing a handgun in 9mm. But 9mm is a less powerful round than the 357 Sig, 40 S&W 45acp or the 10mm (to reference a few common semi rounds). So in that regard the 9mm is not "the equal of the 45" or the other rounds I mentioned.

Generally when folks say that "the 9mm is the equal of the 45" they are not talking about power or terminal performance. They are speaking of the ability to defend yourself, which is another matter.

There is a very good set of reasons that the 9mm is the most popular defensive handgun round on the planet. But that it is as potent than other rounds is not one of them.
 
There are many good reasons for choosing a handgun in 9mm. But 9mm is a less powerful round than the 357 Sig, 40 S&W 45acp or the 10mm (to reference a few common semi rounds). So in that regard the 9mm is not "the equal of the 45" or the other rounds I mentioned.

Generally when folks say that "the 9mm is the equal of the 45" they are not talking about power or terminal performance. They are speaking of the ability to defend yourself, which is another matter.

There is a very good set of reasons that the 9mm is the most popular defensive handgun round on the planet. But that it is as potent than other rounds is not one of them.

Arguing about the potency of defensive handgun calibers is like two short guys fighting about which is taller - in the end, both dudes are short.
 
Over those three years, the G36 broke four times. Go-to-the-workbench-to-install-new-parts-to-solve-the-problem broken. Your-gun-doesn't-work-get-a-backup-for-the-rest-of-the-stages broken. I couldn't tolerate that performance in a carry gun, so I sold it, the holster, and eight mags (with disclosure) after the last repair.

We just gotta know what broke on that 36. Please.
 
Arguing about the potency of defensive handgun calibers is like two short guys fighting about which is taller - in the end, both dudes are short.

True but then they argue about who looks the best and that’s when the real trouble starts!:D
 
We just gotta know what broke on that 36. Please.

Fair question.

The first failure was during an IDPA shoot. Trigger went dead. Tried a type I malfunction clearance. No dice. Trigger moved around funny inside the trigger guard. Found that one of the pins holding the trigger group in place had sheared. Because it was my carry gun, I wanted a Glock armorer to examine and fix it. He was unable to diagnose the cause of the failure, and simply replaced the pin with an OEM part.

The second was in practice, IIRC. Same failure. Armorer used a "stronger pin" this time. Ditto for third failure.

After the third pin failure and while considering what to do for a replacement gun, the recoil spring guide rod assembly shattered, disabling the slide. Again in practice.

I still have no idea what could have caused the pin failures. At this point, it doesn't really matter. And recoil spring assemblies are consumables. But a stoppage is a stoppage.

I noticed that lots of other IDPA and polite society shooters were using the then-relatively-new XD, without malfunctions. But that's another story.
 
Thanks for that feedback, luzyfuerza.

Makes me think the lighter slide of the 36 (my assumption) may be beating the hell out of the gun. Just conjecture on my part if Glock 30s aren't having the same failure.
 
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