Casting 454 casull.

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Casull

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Im thinking about casting and re loading 454 casull bullets. Can anyone advise me on BHN and pressures for this round. Id like to eventually make a hot round that turns heads. But i know a hot casull round is a HOT round so i need to get this right. How hot can i make it with cast lead bullets that i would be able to make myself. I have all the equipment i need plus rotometals superhard pure antimony and tin plus gas checks. Basically can i cast a bullet strong enough to safely handle 45,000 plus or do i just buy jacketed bullets?
 
If you use a gas check and a high tin content and powder coat you should be able to run them pretty hot. As always with cast though, quality of alloy is key, and making sure the hardness meets the velocity requirements. But with higher pressure you need a hard and still elastic alloy, so high tin content instead of just antimony for hardness. I am still a beginner in the world of casting, but I have run some 44 mag pb boolits pretty hard powdercoated.
 
A gas checked bullet will make it easier. There’s no reason to try and run full strength 454 Casull loads 4 days after asking about loading your first 45 Colt loads. Loading up something in the 1,200 to 1,400 FPS range will be much easier to get to work.
 
Hodgdon has data for a 335 GR. CPB LFN GC bullet. About 22 bhn + heat treated? Like > https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1010706565 20200202_111616.jpg lol, what a bad example.

Rotometals - The Brinell Hardness of this Linotype alloy is about 22.

Some special lube from http://lbtmolds.com/Home/tabid/5805/Default.aspx Read info on the website, may help.

And more http://www.beartoothbullets.com/index.htm

Just trying to point you in the right direction. My BIG GUN is a 44 mag.:D Good Luck.



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A gas checked bullet will make it easier. There’s no reason to try and run full strength 454 Casull loads 4 days after asking about loading your first 45 Colt loads. Loading up something in the 1,200 to 1,400 FPS range will be much easier to get to work.
If i want to learn something i will
 
I've never loaded for the .454, but have loaded for m y big Smith & Wesson .500. I have over 50 years of reloading under my belt as well as casting boolits* for almost that long.

First let me set it straight about adding more tin is going to make the boolit harder. It'll raise the hardness a little bit, but not as much as linotype will. A side note, you cannot just put linotype into pure lead, it won't mix and create a solution.2.5 % to 3 % of tin is all that's needed. 3% tin and 5% antimony will make what's called a hardball boolit.

I've been powder coating most of the boolits I cast. It's simply amazing how it eliminates all leading. If it were me trying do this, I would Only do it with a hard boolit that's been powder coated, to prevent leading AND to prevent the boolit from deforming because of the gas pressure.

I'll tell a short story about 2 9mm boolits I shot while testing my first attempts at powder coating. The two boolits were a 9mm TC 124 G cast with my normal lead alloy that's about 14 brinell . AND a RN 124 that was cast using pure lead. I had along on that range trip a couple of bullet testers, used to catch bullets and boolits to see how they expand. First were targets set up at 25 yards. The RN pure targets, of 5 rounds, only 3 hit the whole target nowhere the bullseye. The TC boolits made a nice group around the bullseye, with a couple in the black. That's expected from my my Cz 75, from a benchrest. I shot one of each into the expansion tester. At home I recovered the boolits.

The pure RN's were hardly recognizable as a boolit. They were so deformed by the high pressure that they just weren't a clean projectile. The TC's looked like they had just fallen from the mold, except for the powder coat and the rifling marks. Says a lot for having a hard enough alloy for the boolit. And no leading for the soft RN's. I made sure that last rounds through the pistol were the soft RN's.

* The founder of the website for the cast boolit forum came up with the spelling for bullets. It's become a way to distinguish a cast projectile from those "J" words as a jacketed bullet is referred to the forums. @http://castboolits,gunloads.co/forum.php

I have pics I took of the range trip as well as the boolits I recovered. If anyone is interested I will post those with way too much comments by me. Yuc yuc!
 
I've never loaded for the .454, but have loaded for m y big Smith & Wesson .500. I have over 50 years of reloading under my belt as well as casting boolits* for almost that long.

First let me set it straight about adding more tin is going to make the boolit harder. It'll raise the hardness a little bit, but not as much as linotype will. A side note, you cannot just put linotype into pure lead, it won't mix and create a solution.2.5 % to 3 % of tin is all that's needed. 3% tin and 5% antimony will make what's called a hardball boolit.

I've been powder coating most of the boolits I cast. It's simply amazing how it eliminates all leading. If it were me trying do this, I would Only do it with a hard boolit that's been powder coated, to prevent leading AND to prevent the boolit from deforming because of the gas pressure.

I'll tell a short story about 2 9mm boolits I shot while testing my first attempts at powder coating. The two boolits were a 9mm TC 124 G cast with my normal lead alloy that's about 14 brinell . AND a RN 124 that was cast using pure lead. I had along on that range trip a couple of bullet testers, used to catch bullets and boolits to see how they expand. First were targets set up at 25 yards. The RN pure targets, of 5 rounds, only 3 hit the whole target nowhere the bullseye. The TC boolits made a nice group around the bullseye, with a couple in the black. That's expected from my my Cz 75, from a benchrest. I shot one of each into the expansion tester. At home I recovered the boolits.

The pure RN's were hardly recognizable as a boolit. They were so deformed by the high pressure that they just weren't a clean projectile. The TC's looked like they had just fallen from the mold, except for the powder coat and the rifling marks. Says a lot for having a hard enough alloy for the boolit. And no leading for the soft RN's. I made sure that last rounds through the pistol were the soft RN's.

* The founder of the website for the cast boolit forum came up with the spelling for bullets. It's become a way to distinguish a cast projectile from those "J" words as a jacketed bullet is referred to the forums. @http://castboolits,gunloads.co/forum.php

I have pics I took of the range trip as well as the boolits I recovered. If anyone is interested I will post those with way too much comments by me. Yuc yuc!
Id like some pics.
 
I just looked, what I have been using ( https://oregontrailbullets.com/xcart/?target=product&product_id=116#product-details-tab-reviews - seems you need to scroll up on the link for the product, 360 grain .452 bullet ) is 15 brinell - so not extremely hard. Like I said , I'm far from an expert but I get no leading and great accuracy from these driven between 1300-1400 fps with h110. Casting is it's own art form and there are many ways to skin that cat it seems.
Good info, 1300-1400 fps casull BHN 15
 
Good info, 1300-1400 fps casull BHN 15
I've pushed them faster but gained really nothing but recoil and accuracy suffered. I recently got a 10" barreled 454 that I haven't had a chance to chronograph this specific load in . I've been working up a load with the swift A frame in that gun but will try the heavy cast bullet too when I get a chance.
 
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I Googled to see what the maximum bhn (hardness) may be for oven heat treated cast bullets. Looks like 32 bhn? https://www.castbulletassoc.org/forum/thread/4838-heat-treating-bullets-to-increase-bhn/

I have seen other tests that show the hardness is not just surface harding, but thru to the center.

The General Consensus is a bullet that is to hard will lead the bore. I run a test with pure linotype & oven heat treated in 45 acp & 44 mag. Target loads to maximum. No leading. Bullets can not be to hard, if of the correct diameter. Imo.

But, if a (defective) barrel has a tight spot in the barrel, a soft alloy will let the bullet obturate to fill the bore, after its been sized down a tiny amount.

Hard alloys keep cast bullets from skidding and/or slumping at high pressures.

All in my new book, "Mysteries of Cast Bullets" :evil: Coming soon. :rofl: NOT.
 
Then your best bet is to do as Texas10mm suggested and read the free online book by Glen Fryxell and Robert Applegate (there's also a link on the page to download a PDF copy of the whole book).

'Cause some of the things being posted here are just flat wrong and will only confuse you.
Ill do that, thank you. I wasn't trying to be rude to anyone i just don't agree with being told to put my training wheels back on
 
I Googled to see what the maximum bhn (hardness) may be for oven heat treated cast bullets. Looks like 32 bhn? https://www.castbulletassoc.org/forum/thread/4838-heat-treating-bullets-to-increase-bhn/

I have seen other tests that show the hardness is not just surface harding, but thru to the center.

The General Consensus is a bullet that is to hard will lead the bore. I run a test with pure linotype & oven heat treated in 45 acp & 44 mag. Target loads to maximum. No leading. Bullets can not be to hard, if of the correct diameter. Imo.

But, if a (defective) barrel has a tight spot in the barrel, a soft alloy will let the bullet obturate to fill the bore, after its been sized down a tiny amount.

Hard alloys keep cast bullets from skidding and/or slumping at high pressures.

All in my new book, "Mysteries of Cast Bullets" :evil: Coming soon. :rofl: NOT.
Thank you for the input good info. Ill keep an eye out for the book im interested
 
Is that something i can do or should i take it in to a gun shop?
 
Most accurate way is with pin guages, but slugging is usually good enough.

What make is your .454?
 
Is that something i can do or should i take it in to a gun shop?
It is something you can do at home. I like to use buckshot most of the time but your diameter is to big I think. You may he able to find a ball from a black powder gun that is big enough.
 
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