J frame 357 versus 38+p

I've had some big kickers, included 500 S&W and 454 and none of them hurt my hand but a lightweight S&W 340 left my hand throbbing for about 2 days after about 4-5 cylinders of 357 Mag. It would be slightly better with the 360 but still, not fun to shoot. They carry well and the option to shoot 357 is there, but it's not high on my list of things to do in my free time.

[email protected] said:

That is surprising as the cylinder on a 357 has to be longer as the cartridge is longer. Also the .38 barrel is 1.78 and on other j frame .357 revolvers the barrel length is 2.25 inches

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According to Lyman 49th:
.38 special overall length - 1.550
.357 mag. overall length - 1.590
.38 special case length - 1.155
.357 mag. case length - 1.290

The op was asking about the M&P 340.

I have a 340pd with a Titanium cylinder. Don't have the slightly heavier M&P.

I plan to carry my 340pd with low end 357 mag loads like Speer short barrel 135 gr Good Dots.

Also carry an LCR 357 with the Gold Dot ammo.

Not a big problem to shoot a cylinder or two of 357.

I've never shot an M&P 340, but hear it's easier on the shooter than the pd version. It's half way between the 340pd and the LCR in weight.

I think the M&P 340 would be just fine for limited use with 357 mag defense ammo.

WisBorn said:

I would like to thank everyone for their comments, views, and experiences on this post.
Looks like I will stick with the S&W442 and continue to carry my Taurus 415 41mag when out west.
As mentioned above I really like the sights on the m&p340 & the ability to carry magnum loads when needed. When you look at the recoil I think I'll carry the extra weight of my 41mag or 686+.

Thank you all again and safe shooting!!!

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Sounds like a plan.
Only thing I'd add is with the 38 and a good hard cast 158 load you're not exactly unarmed in the woods.

WisBorn said:

I'm thinking about buying a M&P 340 but having a hard time with the cost compared to 442.

Is the more powerful round worth the price? I would carry the 357 in areas with bears and cats and 38s as my primary carry.

Looking for some help!

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if you're in the realm of bears and big cats carry something larger than a J frame. in the woods/afield why carry a J frame .357 when you could carry an L frame .357?

JERRY said:

if you're in the realm of bears and big cats carry something larger than a J frame. in the woods/afield why carry a J frame .357 when you could carry an L frame .357?

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I wouldn't really lump.a Mt Lion in with a Black Bear.

A .38 Wadcutter out of a J-Frame would likely be sufficient for a Mt Lion. They are thin skinned, lightly boned and about the same weight as a normal not overweight human.

Most black bears are relatively small but not all. The largest black bear on record had a dressed weight of over 900 lb which gives a live weight estimate of 1100 lb.

I think an S&W M69 2.75" Combat Magnum (or better yet the 4.25") is about the
smallest thing I would consider as bear medicine for a 500 lb Bear and if I lived where they truly come large and ornery it would be a Ruger Alaskan in .480 Ruger (It's a bit much for me in .454 Casull).

94045 said:

I wouldn't really lump.a Mt Lion in with a Black Bear.

A .38 Wadcutter out of a J-Frame would likely be sufficient for a Mt Lion. They are thin skinned, lightly boned and about the same weight as a normal not overweight human.

Most black bears are relatively small but not all. The largest black bear on record had a dressed weight of over 900 lb which gives a live weight estimate of 1100 lb.

I think an S&W M69 2.75" Combat Magnum (or better yet the 4.25") is about the
smallest thing I would consider as bear medicine for a 500 lb Bear and if I lived where they truly come large and ornery it would be a Ruger Alaskan in .480 Ruger (It's a bit much for me in .454 Casull).

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he mentioned bears and cats.

mavracer said:

Sounds like a plan.
Only thing I'd add is with the 38 and a good hard cast 158 load you're not exactly unarmed in the woods.

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This. 150-180gr .357" diam pills at 850fps+ penetrate very well.

JERRY said:

if you're in the realm of bears and big cats carry something larger than a J frame. in the woods/afield why carry a J frame .357 when you could carry an L frame .357?

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If you PLAN or SEEK to meet up with a large black bear or mtn lion, a rifle or 12ga shotgun with Brenneke slugs is the right answer, all else is noise.

But if no dangerous critter encounter is sought--and general precautions are taken to avoid an encounter--a handgun is a reasonable compromise and an L-frame is a good answer.

I love my 4" L-frame, as it has a heavenly trigger and eats up hot .357mag loads with ease and little subjective recoil. But many times I find myself toting an airweight J-frame stoked with hard cast wadcutters in the woods. Sometimes I don't want the weight, sometimes I am on non-hunt-related travel and taking TWO guns (L-frame and J-frame) is one PITA/luggage check-in too far. [Airweight J-frame, 17 rounds (5+2x speed strips), pocket holster, and belt holster is my minimalist travel "arsenal".]

I slapped a set of Crimson Trace grips on my J-frame and practice iron and laser sighted shooting out past 25 yards. Not nearly as easy to shoot as my L-frame or other service pistol, but a quick first shot is do-able and mtn lion or black bear defense while actively trying to avoid them likely will occur at less than 25 yards.

I also have shot that airweight in IDPA. Yes, I won my division (I was the only one shooting BUG, so..., but otherwise had the worst score. Still, I learned a lot and plan more J-frame IDPA this summer while I let my kids shoot my 1911s.

WisBorn said:

I'm thinking about buying a M&P 340 but having a hard time with the cost compared to 442.

Is the more powerful round worth the price? I would carry the 357 in areas with bears and cats and 38s as my primary carry.

Looking for some help!

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I went thru the same dilemma when I purchased my Ruger SP101 2-1/4" snub. I decided on the .357 even though I had little or no intention of ever shooting full load .357's thru it.

The fact is, if you have the .357, you have that option. If you don't have the .357 you don't. Simple as that.

I carry an LCR357 as my EDC..I carry it loaded with ARX 77 gr .38 Spcl for the light recoil. There is a .357 version of that round with an 86 gr. that I've been thinking of stepping up to. Again, because I have the .357 it's an option for me.

You can read everyone's response on here and digest the info to your heart's content. However, if you will just go to a range somewhere and fire some .357 Mag. ammo out of a J-frame you'll never know what will work for you.

JERRY said:

he mentioned bears and cats.

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???

Did I assume to much?
I assumed BlackBears and Mt Lions but if he lives in the South Western USA an extremely low percentage chance that it could be a Jaguar which would suggest a stronger handgun..

I was just pointing out that Mt Lions require roughly the same armament as a human so the fact that they are in the area wouldn't really have a lot of effect on caliber choice. Bears on the other hand (even Black Bears) require a considerable upgrade.

Tiny little comment. We’re here in dfw. Visiting family in east Texas we saw a mt lion walking on the shoulder of a 2 lane state highway. It was as big as any big cat I’ve ever seen at a zoo or circus. I mean GINORMOUS! Lol. If you picked him up by the front quarters easy taller that 6’3 man. I’d want something with POP! Lol

If you need a 357 because of large animals then definitely get a 357. Shooting it from any j frame is not fun, so you will probably not fire 357s in it often enough to break the gun. That’s one way to think about it.

If you are going to use a .357 Mag as a Bear Gun get at least an SP101 3" and use 158 gr XTP. It will be much more controllable for follow-up shots than a lightweight J-Frame plus it will expand and gives 22" Penetration (Don't expect to actually see that much in a Bear)..

...and pray he isn't over 300 lb and bleeds out before he does to much permanent damage.

That's my opinion.

cfullgraf said:

Before S&W began making the J-frame guns capable of firing 357 Magnum, the frames were shorter since the 38 Special cartridge is shorter. Afterwards, S&W stretched the frame to fit 357 Magnum ammunition and all J-frames are made that way regardless of cartridge thjey are chambered in.

On the left is a Model 642 built around 1998 after S&W started building 357 Magnum J-frame guns. The gun on the right is a Model 60 built around 1984. The plastic strips show the Model 60's cylinder is shorter than the Model 642 even though they are both chambered for 38 Special.

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However, the overall length still looks to be the same.

I scored a 340PD for $600 at Cabelas six or seven years ago. I never had the balls to shoot .357 in it because .38 +P was plenty of kick to make controlling my flinch a challenge. But it was so light. I ended up giving it to my quite-petite daughter to carry. Because it was so light and because she's my daughter. I doubt she'll ever shoot magnums in it either, though my son-in-law tried it and doesn't seem interested in trying it again...

I had a steel .357 J-frame of some number or other that had apparently been "improved" to have around a 1 1/2 pound single-action trigger. Shooting .357 in that was punishing and I couldn't use something with a trigger like that except at the range, so it went away to my LGS in trade for a new 638, which I really love. That is the one with the shrouded hammer so you can still fire single-action if you want. Best of both worlds, and it is .38-only, so I don't have to reflect on my lack of courage each time I load it.

I know I'm a little late to the thread but wanted to put in a word for the less-popular 638. This has been a very interesting thread. Thanks, all.

shoebox1.1 said:

Tiny little comment. We’re here in dfw. Visiting family in east Texas we saw a mt lion walking on the shoulder of a 2 lane state highway. It was as big as any big cat I’ve ever seen at a zoo or circus. I mean GINORMOUS! Lol. If you picked him up by the front quarters easy taller that 6’3 man. I’d want something with POP! Lol

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Where'bouts in E Texas?

It was highway 19 south inbetween anthens and Palestine closer to Palestine. Big ol cat!!!!

shoebox1.1 said:

It was highway 19 south inbetween anthens and Palestine closer to Palestine. Big ol cat!!!!

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Hunted around there. Saw gators in the water, but no large predators on land. That area, while not urban, does seem a mite too populated for cougar. Shows you what I know.

WisBorn said:

I'm thinking about buying a M&P 340 but having a hard time with the cost compared to 442.

Is the more powerful round worth the price? I would carry the 357 in areas with bears and cats and 38s as my primary carry.

Looking for some help!

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I had a 442, prefer the 340 because it does double duty. Is the price worth it? IDK, I have a feeling they charge more because they don't build as many.

[email protected] said:

How do you intend on carrying it? If you ever intend to pocket carry it go to the 642. The extra length (about ,75 inch) of the 357 magnum makes it problematic

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Nah. I pocket carry the 340 all the time, no problem.

george29 said:

Nah. I pocket carry the 340 all the time, no problem.

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I'll bet all that hair slicks up the trigger.