Ruger Fixed vs Adjustable sights

35 Whelen said:

I've been told that many times and on paper it makes sense. But although I can only guess, I think it has something to do with the weight of the revolver and how it affects recoil. If it were simply a matter of the time a given bullet spends in a barrel, then there would be a huge difference in POI's of my .38 loads vs. .357 loads in the same revolver, but there isn't. But the .357 is quite a bit heavier than the .45 Colt, therefore the muzzle rises significantly less.
Again, just a hypothesis.

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You are correct. The weight of the gun also affects how much the barrel rises during recoil. Thats the purpose of full length lugs under barrels like seen on a 686 or a GP-100. More barrel weight. Less barrel rise. Look at a fixed sight 32 long or 22lr and the barrel tangent is less because there is almost no barrel rise. Ross Seyfried made that point when he tested a Ruger Single Six Bisley in 32 mag with the drift adjustable rear sight. He stated even with its non adjustable elevation rear sight and different bullet weights there was almost no difference in POI between the bullet weights because of the very low recoil of the round.

Ratshooter said:

The different points of impact between the bullet weights is caused from the amount of time a bullet spends in the barrel after being fired. When you shoot a heavy bullet the velocity will be lower and that gives the barrel more time to recoil upwards before the bullet leaves the barrel. The bullet will strike higher on the target. A lighter bullet at faster velocity will leave the barrel sooner before the barrel rises as much from recoil and will strike lower on the target.

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I have heard that theory for years and I don't buy it.

The difference in time a 'fast bullet' vs a 'slow bullet' spends in the barrel of a revolver is insignificant. The simple fact is, a heavy bullet simply causes the muzzle to rise more in recoil before the bullet exits than a light bullet does. Nothing to do with how long the bullet is in the barrel, it is totally a function of how much recoil is generated.

I have both an older Vaquero and a couple of Blackhawk revolvers. The Vaquero shoots pretty much to point of aim at around 50' with most factory 250 gr. or 255. gr. .45 Colt ammo. Only problem is occasional glare coming off the stainless front sight. A little Sharpie black marker does the trick.

Though definitely not as traditional looking as sights on the Vaquero, I do appreciate the better sight picture the Blackhawk sights offer. And while some may think the front sight appears to be "cosmetically challenged" I prefer to think of it as being more like "industrial strength"; perfectly suited for the guns they're mounted on!

One of the best investments I've made for my SA shooting was a 40 lpi checkering file. Applied to the backside of front sights, followed by the judicious application of cold blue, eliminates glare.









35W

35 Whelen said:

One of the best investments I've made for my SA shooting was a 40 lpi checkering file. Applied to the backside of front sights, followed by the judicious application of cold blue, eliminates glare.

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35W

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Yep. I have done the same.

35 Whelen said:

One of the best investments I've made for my SA shooting was a 40 lpi checkering file. Applied to the backside of front sights, followed by the judicious application of cold blue, eliminates glare.

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That looks great. Now I have a new tool to buy.

Driftwood Johnson said:

I have heard that theory for years and I don't buy it.

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You may not agree with it but others do. Read post numbers 8 and 9.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/archive/index.php/t-221082.html

From poster "oneokie".

In general, lighter boolits have less dwell time than heavy boolits. A higher velocity load will have less dwell time than a standard velocity load. How fast or how slow the powder burns isn't the determining factor, it's how fast the boolit is driven out the muzzle which determines the amount of dwell time.

Correct answer.

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But no matter, its common knowlegde that a heavier bullet will strike higher on a target than a lighter bullet.

And by the way, I don't use the childish term "Boolit".

I've owned several Blackhawks over the years. Ugly may be a little harsh, but I could never warm up to them. The cylinder and frame size are all out of proportion to the grip and barrel. And I never liked the aluminum frame with steel barrel and cylinder. The all steel versions I liked better. I never shot one very well either. I've always shot a DA revolver in SA mode much better than the Blackhawk. Lots of theories why, but that is another thread.

I haven't owned one of the Rugers in years, but now that they have trimmer new modle Vaquero I'm tempted to try another. But right now I have other firearms projects I'm working on. But if I were buying one today it would be the new Vaquero. And likely the one with the Bisley grip.

Ok I’m a little confused by the heavier lighter bullet strike on a target. I assume we are talking about a bullet leaving a barrel that’s angled the same. I thought gravity acted on an object the same
regardless of weight. Bullet drop is a factor of time and not much else.

whughett said:

Ok I’m a little confused by the heavier lighter bullet strike on a target. I assume we are talking about a bullet leaving a barrel that’s angled the same. I thought gravity acted on an object the same
regardless of weight. Bullet drop is a factor of time and not much else.

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The amount of drop of different handgun bullets, even comparing say, something as ballistically lacking as a full wadcutter to a semi-wadcutter, even out to 50 yds. would need to be measured with a caliper as it a tenth of an inch or so.

As far as the "dwell" in the barrel goes, that doesn't make sense either. If the time a bullet dwelled in the barrel were truly a factor, then a 185 gr. .45 caliber bullet with a muzzle velocity of 800 fps would possess the same POI as a 300 gr. 45 caliber bullet as they would spend the same amount of time in the barrel. But anyone who's shot bullets with a wide weight range such as this knows the heavier bullet causes more muzzle rise, as Newton's Third Law would indicate.

Ratshooter said:

That looks great. Now I have a new tool to buy.

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Hang on to your pocketbook. These cost a bit more than your standard file!

35W

Big Sigh: Too many of these thread discussions go beyond me these days.

I though I had Point Blank Range down pat.

I can get 180gn, 240gn, and 300gn bullets into one hole at 10 yards measuring about 2", more like 6" at 25 yards thanks to the adjustable sights on my excellent Super Blackhawk. You can also get a no drill weigand mount and pop on a red dot if you want using the adjustible sight screw hole. I can't imagine fixed sights, so much worse!!!

If you want to hit what you're aiming for with lots of bullet weights and velocities you NEED adjustible sights. Fixed sight guns are just a lot harder to shoot. Besides a SAA I wouldn't want fixed sights.

sequins said:

I can get 180gn, 240gn, and 300gn bullets into one hole at 10 yards measuring about 2", more like 6" at 25 yards thanks to the adjustable sights on my excellent Super Blackhawk. You can also get a no drill weigand mount and pop on a red dot if you want using the adjustible sight screw hole. I can't imagine fixed sights, so much worse!!!

If you want to hit what you're aiming for with lots of bullet weights and velocities you NEED adjustible sights. Fixed sight guns are just a lot harder to shoot. Besides a SAA I wouldn't want fixed sights.

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So you're saying you shoot 6" groups at 25 yds. because the sights on your revolver are adjustable??

35W

35 Whelen said:

So you're saying you shoot 6" groups at 25 yds. because the sights on your revolver are adjustable??

35W

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Yep, that right. I can adjust to the load and get my group on the bullseye instead of somewhere near the bullseye. It's fine to shoot tight groups but it's better to shoot 'em tight at the point of aim. Those are rested groups as well I'm not an amazing shot or anything. A fixed sight pistol is not necessarily any worse on group size but where the group hits varies and trying to do Kentucky windage always opens my groups right up.

I am sure the reasons different bullet weights land in different places are a combination of what I posted and what Driftwood posted. I doubt you can point to one or the other and say thats is the sole reason for different points of impact.

As I posted in the first response if the OP wants to shoot different rounds through his gun (45 Colt/45ACP) then get the adjustable sighted gun. If he was going to stick to one caliber and one bullet weight a fixed sighted gun will do the trick.

jmr40 said:

I haven't owned one of the Rugers in years, but now that they have trimmer new modle Vaquero I'm tempted to try another. But right now I have other firearms projects I'm working on. But if I were buying one today it would be the new Vaquero. And likely the one with the Bisley grip.

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I've got a New Vaquero, and it's just great to handle and shoot. I had another but I gave it to my bil. They feel fantastic.