New 6mm Advanced Rifle Cartridge

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While this cartridge is obviously designed to fit in an ar15 platform, it will be fun to play with in a nice bolt gun. Not to pontificate on what it does before we have it, but to see what the real numbers come out to sans marketing. I am actually pretty excited about the saami standardization, will give us some solid design info to work from.
 
I’m looking forward to a day when a true mini-length action is an industry standard. Remington may not still be around by then, but I’d love to see more than just the CZ and Howa in that space.

For Midwesterners, a half pound lighter rifle which gets its work fully done in a 20” tube to deliver a 100-115grn bullet at 2700-2900fps would be quite productive in deer and coyote fields.
 
An AR15 in 24 cal shooting an 87-95 gr. hunting bullet at a min of 2856 fps muzzle would be interesting to me. 18" barrel.
 
mshootnit said:
An AR15 in 24 cal shooting an 87-95 gr. hunting bullet at a min of 2856 fps muzzle would be interesting to me. 18" barrel.
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6x45? I really like this cartridge in an AR for some reason. I have no real need, but I like the idea.
 
ECVMatt said:
6x45? I really like this cartridge in an AR for some reason. I have no real need, but I like the idea.
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It’s a super simple neck up and run. The case is too long for heavies, but it’s a hoot with 55-85grn pills. For 0-500yrds coyote hunting, it has a little more drop, but the 85/87’s anchor coyotes a bit better than 223. A rare instance where trading some speed and SD for bullet mass works in your favor. It doesn’t get velocities anywhere close to what the larger 6-6.8’s and 6 Grendels can deliver, but for 0-500, it’s a blast. I really wanted to try an Ackley shoulder version.
 
Varminterror said:
It’s a super simple neck up and run. The case is too long for heavies, but it’s a hoot with 55-85grn pills. For 0-500yrds coyote hunting, it has a little more drop, but the 85/87’s anchor coyotes a bit better than 223. A rare instance where trading some speed and SD for bullet mass works in your favor. It doesn’t get velocities anywhere close to what the larger 6-6.8’s and 6 Grendels can deliver, but for 0-500, it’s a blast. I really wanted to try an Ackley shoulder version.
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I met a guy who had one and said the difference wasn't enough to make a difference.

It's a pretty cool looking cartridge
20160904_110218.jpg
 
mshootnit said:
Just for you then: Greg Rodriguez
https://www.shootingtimes.com/editorial/ammunition_st_proposal_200808/100271
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Yep I have read that one many times while I was pondering the 6x45. I came to the same conclusion as the author that is just wasn't quite there...which of course led me to the 6x47!

Just kidding. Since I mostly shoot bolt actions I am fine with the .243 and the 6mm Remington. However I am thankful not only for new cartridges like the 6mm Advanced Rifle, but the fact that we can still barrel for the 6x45 and 6x47. These are good times that we are living in.
 
I'm a pretty sizeable gun nut, reloader, and I'm not set on any particular cartridge in this class. So I'm hopefully giving the outsiders view to the OP.

Personally, all of these types of cartridges are like trying to haul lumber on a moped. Yes you can do it and come up with all sorts of ways to wrestle performance out of a puny package. People do it with everything and there's nothing wrong with it.

That said, I look at every single one of these cartridges with what they are trying to do, then I look at an AR-10 in 260 Remington. I just can't justify any of these cartridges vs just getting a AR-10/260 Remington and calling it a day.

So what do I think? It will make for another entry in "Cartridges of the World" and not much else. The average shooter just is not going to care. Anyone that does care isn't bothered by wildcats in the first place.
 
The cartridge is definitely aimed at a subset of shooters who both A) shoot long range and B) like doing it with an AR-15. I wouldn't expect it to appeal to all shooters, just like any other cartridge. In addition to bolt guns, I like to shoot AR-15s at our local range out to 600, 700, 800 and even 1,020 yards. The 6mm ARC would give a significant step up in performance over my main .223 Wylde with a very similar package, so it's interesting to me.

If you're not interested in the smaller, sleeker, cheaper, lighter AR-15, the the AR-10 certainly offers an alternative. I will say, there's no reason to buy an AR-10 in .260 today, with the far superior Creedmoor options abounding.
 
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Crosshair said:
That said, I look at every single one of these cartridges with what they are trying to do, then I look at an AR-10 in 260 Remington. I just can't justify any of these cartridges vs just getting a AR-10/260 Remington and calling it a day.
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Accomplishing the same tasks in the field, in a 2lb lighter rifle that cost ~$300 less, with ~25% less powder and a ~10¢ cheaper bullet, and ~30% less recoil...

Pretty easy math for me.

If a guy gave me a 260 AR-10 for free, I’d sell it. I spent earned money to build a 243 LBC AR-15 (and a 6 creed LFAR, for what it’s worth, because I get a 10¢ cheaper bullet, less recoil, and less drop and drift at range). No speculation, I’ve built and owned 260 Rem LFAR’s, and they don’t keep my interest.
 
Different people can like whatever they want.
Here is a very nice 6.5 though. Probably the only 6.5 I would buy.
 
Varminterror said:
Accomplishing the same tasks in the field, in a 2lb lighter rifle that cost ~$300 less, with ~25% less powder and a ~10¢ cheaper bullet, and ~30% less recoil...

Pretty easy math for me.
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Agreed. I'm a big 6mm fan, have owned a LFAR, and find this to be a good combination that doesn't require all the weight and inefficiencies.
 
Huge 6.5 Grendel fan here (I run a forum dedicated to it), and I think this new 6mmARC is fantastic. Can't wait until Hornady makes an official public announcement about it.

Shooters are gonna want the 6mmARC for the same reasons we love the Grendel: Excellent hunting round in the AR15 platform and lot of fun to shoot. The Grendel case is the largest case head diameter one can stuff within the constraints of a standard AR15 magazine and magazine well and still have a true double stack for maximum capacity.

SAAMI spec sheet says 6mmARC fires a 108gr @ 2700 fps, no doubt from the standard 24" test barrel, at the same pressure as Grendel: 52,000 psi. If bolt issues were going to crash and burn the 6.5 Grendel project, they would have done so sometime in the past 16 years. Grendel is only growing and growing. Neither will bolt issues be a problem for the 6mmARC.

The Grendel case and those beautiful 6mm bullets — and a legion of wildcatters who caught the vision early — have been waiting for a factory cartridge for a long time, and it can't come soon enough!
 
I’m on the fence this week to order another 243LBC barrel or wait it out for 6mm ARC to become available. Both use the same bullets, powder, and parent brass - at least until Hornady ARC brass becomes widely available - but I’d have to buy a new set of dies to load ARC, since the 6.5 Grendel Type S Bushing dies I’m using for 243 LBC would be too long and have the wrong body taper. Changing would only mean losing 50-100fps in the Cons column, but the only tally in the Pros column would be matching headstamp with the barrel. Neither are terribly motivating. Eventually, I suppose I’ll convert over, but I don’t really want to burn out this 243LBC barrel without a replacement on hand.
 
VT, if you're gonna convert over eventually, I'd wait and see what happens. If Hornady actually releases it, then good — you're not throwing good money after bad. If not, then get your 243LBC replacement barrel. Unless time is of the essence?

Because the 6mmARC was designed to seat long 6mms just down to the neck/shoulder — according to one theory of accuracy — we'll see whether the "built-in" accuracy makes up for the slightly shorter powder column and reduced velocity.
 
Varminterror said:
I’m on the fence this week to order another 243LBC barrel or wait it out for 6mm ARC to become available. Both use the same bullets, powder, and parent brass - at least until Hornady ARC brass becomes widely available - but I’d have to buy a new set of dies to load ARC, since the 6.5 Grendel Type S Bushing dies I’m using for 243 LBC would be too long and have the wrong body taper. Changing would only mean losing 50-100fps in the Cons column, but the only tally in the Pros column would be matching headstamp with the barrel. Neither are terribly motivating. Eventually, I suppose I’ll convert over, but I don’t really want to burn out this 243LBC barrel without a replacement on hand.
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Buy a 6ARC and tell us how it shoots, please :D
 
@South Prairie Jim , @SixFive , & @MarshallDodge - well... it’s a difference of 14 thousandths from something I already have. It’s not a comparison of a 6.5x55 mid-Length Mauser vs. a 6.5 creed, but it’s literally the same case, but one pushed back 14 thousandths and trimmed an extra 30. For all intents, it’ll be the same round. As I said above, same mags, bolt, brass, bullets, powder, and primers - just a tiny pinch more squish done on one. The conundrum, however, is timing.

I called a few barrel makers the week after I saw the announcement, they don’t have reamers yet in hand (but could custom order them, it seems), and Hornady isn’t selling the dies yet. So when I burn out my current 243 LBC around Sept/Oct, I could need to order a new barrel by the end of next month to have it here before the old one is toast. I would guess, with our current global climate, I should be counted foolish to think I’d be able to get an ARC chambered barrel as a standard offering by Sept/Oct.

So waiting maybe 4 months before I order a barrel, 9-10 mos for delivery, might mean I go without a 6 Grendel for 4-5 months. But ordering the 243 LBC now, although it keeps me fed in those interim months, would last me through another year and a half or so, putting me over a year without convincing myself to buy the new standardized round before I’d have a relevant excuse to buy it.

Then again... if it fits the 110 A-tips into a 2.3” AR mag, the ARC could be even more enticing...
 
If you just went ahead and got the 243LBC you'd have the use of it for a year and a half while watching how the whole 6mmARC project shakes out. Probably the best plan if you don't have a burning need for factory 6mmARC ammo.

I wish other bullet makers would list their dimensions like Berger does, but I doubt Hornady's 110 A-Tip ogive is any longer than Berger's 6mm 105 Hybrid nose length of 0.701, and that one will fit perfectly in the 6mmARC.

ETA: This Shooting Times ARTICLE says: "Ideal A-Tip cartridge pairings are, according to Hornady, 6mm BR, 6mm Dasher, and 6mm Creedmoor cartridges for the 110-grainer." The 6mmARC's 2.260 – 1.490 = 0.770 of bullet nose exposure is less than the others listed, which allow 0.880 of bullet nose exposure within the cartridge's overall length.
 
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