38 Super the .44 special of semi's

Maybe I’m missing something or having a blonde moment. I have 38 Supers and 44 specials. I see no similarities whatsoever, performance wise. I reckon the author was referring to the following/owners of those two calibers?

Please elaborate since you are the one that read the article.

Some call it 38 Superb for good reason, I'm one of them. 9mm compares to the 38 Superb as 44 Special compares to the 44 Magnum, 38 Special compares to the 357 Magnum, and 40 S&W compares to the 10mm.

I’d say i disagree, but don’t know of a better example. Maybe.40 s&w and 10mm?

What are "niche cartridges best used in a classic firearm by handloaders," Alex?

To me, I love 44 magnum but wouldn't notice if 44 Special disappeared off the planet and I consider the very best 1911 in 9mm to be 38 Super.

Caliber worshipers abound, but I've noticed that 9 MM Parabellum cult members don't like to hear anything good about more capable calibers. Having a progressive press means one isn't held hostage by price, which is 90% of the 9 MM's appeal.

I was introduced to the 38 Super a few years ago, shooting a friend's SA which got me started looking for one. I finally found it's twin and reparkerized it. It's one of my favorites now, along with 10 MM and .45 ACP.

Part of the reasons for the low popularity of the 38 Super.

When the 38 Super was introduced at the end of the 1920's, it was the "magnum" cartridge of the day until the 357 Magnum was introduced in the mid-1930's.

Popularity of the 38 Super was poor due to the lackluster accuracy of the guns and the lack of military and law enforcement contracts.

The various hand gun games looked at the potential of the 38 Super and they figured out the poor accuracy was due to the round head spacing on the rim (actually, a semi-rim) and not the case mouth.

With the improved accuracy, the popularity of the round for competition purposes grew.

Unfortunately, the round has not gained much popularity with the general shooting public.

The 38 Super has a bit more potential than the 9x19 but unfortunately cannot be fitted to as small a frame gun as the 9x19.

brutus51 said:

Just read an article making this claim. Don't know if it's an accurate statement but having gotten into the Super last year, I'm sure liking it so much I now have two pistols in that caliber.

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What article? Written by who? Got a link?

They're goldilocks

mavracer said:

They're goldilocks

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That’s where I think the 38 Super and 44 Special cross paths.

They are both under appreciated. They both have cult followings. They both are cartridges hand loaders take good advantage of. Both cartridges are under represented in mass produced defensive handguns.

And they’re both just right.

The .38 auto and super were popular in mexico because not being a military caliber could legally be owned. For combat purposes I would go .357 sig. For reloading, guns games, and use in accurized pistols I would select the .38 super over the .357 sig since I think the .38 auto case is inherently more accurate than is the short bottle necked .357 sig. A lot of .38 super is downloaded from what it should be. It will chamber in .38 ACP that are not built to take .38 super pressure.

Wow. Back when I first got into reading about pistols extensively, 40 years ago, 38 Super had a reputation for poor accuracy. Not long after that, it became popular in certain types of shooting competition (IPSC? Does that still exist?), people put a lot of work into it, and reported accuracy went way up. I vaguely recall some writers speculating that older guns relied on the semi-rim for headspace, whereas newer ones headspaced on the case mouth, which was apparently better, but I have no idea if that made a real difference or not.

This does not matter at all now, of course, unless you get your hands on a gun more than 35 years or so old.

BTW, I have occasionally thought that a compact, DA, gate-loading rod-ejector gun in either 45 ACP (5-shot) or 38 Super (6-shot) might have made more sense than the Charter Arms Bulldog in 44 Special, but that is A) probably not true, and B) water long under the bridge. Nowadays you would make it in 9x23 or 10mm, but who wants a gate-loaded rod-ejector pocket gun? Too heavy, too bulky, and not enough shots.

PS - cfullgraf, I am sorry I did not read your post until too late. I could have saved myself the trouble of writing mine. Nevertheless, I am glad to see I am not talking through my hat.

Also, I agree with 460Shooter about what the writer brutus51 quotes meant. At least that's how I would interpret it, too.

Never thought of the 38 Super that way. Perhaps the comparison is made with the thought that they are both niche calibers now?

HisSoldier, I may be a 9MM Parabellum/Super 38 cult member I've owned quite a few guns in both calibers, some convertible between 38S and 9MM, and reloaded both for a very long time.

brutus51 said:

a .44 caliber for semi-autos.

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.429 DE. It is a .50 Action Express case necked down to .429, to accept the same diameter of bullets as .44 Magnum. It has a lot more energy than a standard .44 Magnum.
I'd get one, if I could.

44 Auto Mag was a rimless semi automatic pistol and cartridge.
I really like the potential of the 38 Super and its history. I see the problem as the 9 MM Luger does everything a self defense round needs to do within a compact package.
The 38 Super could be loaded to the pressure levels of a 9 MM +P. But the market is already filled with other cartridges that fill that void.
The demise of the 40 S&W, 357 SIG and slowing demand for .357 and 45 ACP show that the 9MM Luger is a efficient, relatively easy round to fire and fits the needs of the majority of users.

brutus51 said:

It's in the latest issue of Guns magazine John Taffin's handloading article on Lipstick bullets.
Quote "For the .38 Super — which to me with semi-automatics is what the .44 Special is to sixguns ".
Never owned a .44Special but have had several 44 magnums which I always hand load to 44 special velocities in magnum brass.
One of the most accurate I reload for.
Come to think of it kind of funny no one ever invented a .44 caliber for semi-autos.

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Since the details matter:

Guns April 2020, Acme Lipstick bullets part 1: sixguns.
Guns May 2020, Acme Lipstick bullets part 2: semi-automatics.

My 'latest' Guns is June 2020. It's not in there.

earplug said:

The 38 Super could be loaded to the pressure levels of a 9 MM +P.

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With N105 and a 124 grain bullet, my 38 Super loads hit 1450 FPS from a 5 inch 1911.

I dialed them back to 1400 FPS because why beat on my gun.

The 38 Super blows past 9mm +p with ease if loaded properly. The pressure may be similar but the case capacity allows for significant velocity gains.

It's about availability. You won't find much in the way of ammo for either caliber at your LGS. That may change, though. .38 Super seems to be growing in popularity.

Outlaw75 said:

It's about availability. You won't find much in the way of ammo for either caliber at your LGS. That may change, though. .38 Super seems to be growing in popularity.

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It’s very popular with gun gamers because you generate a lot of gas to utilize compensators. But of course, gun gamers mostly load their own.