the .50 GI too underpowered for 300 grains?

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whm1974

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So I'm reading about the .50 GI which is suppose to be an upgrade from the .45 ACP without the punishing recoil of the .50 AE and .500 S&W Magnum...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.50_GI
Wikipedia gives a 300 grain bullet a mere 700 fps... I'm not sure why the developer has such a low velocity but wouldn't this custom cartridge perform much better going at at ~900 to ~1,000 fps? Which will still have less recoil then either the .50 AE or .500 Magnum?
 
I think the 50 AE doesn't have that bad of recoil with the gas system in the desert eagle. Far less than a 44 magnum already imo.
 
sequins said:
I think the 50 AE doesn't have that bad of recoil with the gas system in the desert eagle. Far less than a 44 magnum already imo.
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I've heard that from other people, but I have never owned or shot a Desert Eagle in .50 AE before or in any caliber.
 
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whm1974 said:
So I'm reading about the .50 GI which is suppose to be an upgrade from the .45 ACP without the punishing recoil of the .50 AE and .500 S&W Magnum...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.50_GI
Wikipedia gives a 300 grain bullet a mere 700 fps... I'm not sure why the developer has such a low velocity but wouldn't this custom cartridge perform much better going at at ~900 to ~1,000 fps? Which will still have less recoil then either the .50 AE or .500 Magnum?
Click to expand...
Well sure it would have higher energy at 1,000 fps, but you've got to be able to get that out of a case the length of the .45 Auto with a 300 grain bullet. It may not be possible at the pressure levels they wanted.

In addition, the .50 GI is filling the same role as the .45 Auto, anti-personnel and not the role of the .500 S&W Magnum which is a hunting round.
 
The GI is meant for use in a 1911, 300 grains at 1000 FPS would require pressure beyond what the 1911 was designed to handle. The Desert Eagle was designed to handle way more pressure than the 1911, hence its ability to take 50 AE type loads.
 
sabbfan said:
The GI is meant for use in a 1911, 300 grains at 1000 FPS would require pressure beyond what the 1911 was designed to handle. The Desert Eagle was designed to handle way more pressure than the 1911, hence its ability to take 50 AE type loads.
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OK ~850fps then... But even at 900 fps to 1,000 fps for a 300 grain bullet, the pressure will still be lower then the .50 AE which goes up to 1550 fps with the same weight.
 
whm1974 said:
OK ~850fps then... But even at 900 fps to 1,000 fps for a 300 grain bullet, the pressure will still be lower then the .50 AE which goes up to 1550 fps with the same weight.
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Have you ever seen the two rounds (.45 Auto vs .50 AE) pictured together? They are not close in case dimensions. Likewise, the 500 S&W Magnum is even longer than the .50 AE.

Conversely, the .50 GI has the same case length as the .45 Auto.
 
The big limit is going to be recoil. While pressure is a consideration, thousands of people have been shooting .45 Super in their stock ACP unsupported chambers, just as people have been shooting 9mm, at 37K in unsupported chamber. But putting 300gr at 1000, in a frame built around 200gr at 900, is going to stress the fatigue limits on some of the smaller surfaces. I looked at the slide recoil for a ball round, and it hits at about 12.6 lb. 300gr at 850 runs 21.5, and a 10mm, the kind which were known to tear up 1911's comes in at 18.4. So to get a 300gr at 850fps is going to exceed what the 10mm did easily. This is the recoil energy of the slide, not the firearms. I assume slide weight to be 1.2Lb, but I have not weighed a GI slide.
 
Well I'm not inclined to argue with those who actually know more then me. But I really don't see the point of the .50 GI when the .45 ACP 185 grain +P loading gives better performance then the .50 GI with a 300 grain bullet at only 700 fps...
 
whm1974 said:
Well I'm not inclined to argue with those who actually know more then me. But I really don't see the point of the .50 GI when the .45 ACP 185 grain +P loading gives better performance then the .50 GI with a 300 grain bullet at only 700 fps...
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I guess you need to define "performance".

Personally, I don't see a need for the .50 GI round, because I'm a .45 Auto fan, but there are characteristics a heavier bullet will provide over a lighter bullet with less sectional density.

On paper, a 185gr .45 Auto +P looks pretty good, but probably most 1911 (and probably .45 Auto shooters) shooters choose a standard pressure 230gr round.
 
whm1974 said:
I really don't see the point of the .50 GI
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Me either. I think it's for "look at my fiddy!" And not much else. Never shot one and likely never will, they haven't been well received . the case capacity makes it a novelty in my opinion. If I wanted something powerful with low ammo capacity I would just use a revolver, 50 gi isn't very powerful (compared to its 50 caliber brothers) . that being said, a 300 grain at 700 fps is nothing to sneeze at.
 
JTQ said:
I guess you need to define "performance".

Personally, I don't see a need for the .50 GI round, because I'm a .45 Auto fan, but there are characteristics a heavier bullet will provide over a lighter bullet with less sectional density.

On paper, a 185gr .45 Auto +P looks pretty good, but probably most 1911 (and probably .45 Auto shooters) shooters choose a standard pressure 230gr round.
Click to expand...
The last I shot firearms at a range which was the Olin owned range in East Alton, back in maybe 2006 to 2008, I owned a .45 ACP Hi-Point and I only fed it Winchester brand ammo and didn't owned long or shoot enough to buy reloading dies for that cartridge. If memory serves, I didn't notice any increased recoil over my 9mm Springfield Armory XD-9...
 
Obturation said:
Me either. I think it's for "look at my fiddy!" And not much else. Never shot one and likely never will, they haven't been well received . the case capacity makes it a novelty in my opinion. If I wanted something powerful with low ammo capacity I would just use a revolver, 50 gi isn't very powerful (compared to its 50 caliber brothers) . that being said, a 300 grain at 700 fps is nothing to sneeze at.
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Granted I wouldn't want to get hit with a 300 grain bullet traveling at 700 fps either... Given that very people even own a pistol in this caliber much less used this in actual combat. Data will be rare and hard to find.

I rather get a 10mm Auto, or even a .50 AE handgun instead...
 
The whole big bore thing for humans pretty much reaches it's sweet spot at .45, 230 grains and 850 fps. Any thing larger with more recoil slows splits between shots and starts affecting the accuracy . In the concealment or compact size range of a medium frame weapon. Yup, pretty much as big as we can go. Another pistol action format might work to get the projectile faster but not bigger as that old recoil still gets excessive much over sonic with 230 grains. I really like a Grizzly Win Mag ..45 . I had one with a custom holster. , It was accurate, reliable and powerful. A little large for concealment. But any load over about 1000 fps with 230 grain bullets slows combat accuracy and speed. As in competition.
 
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