Mossberg 500 Slug Problems

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Judas530

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Also posted this in a Local forum but really want your opinions before I waste more gas and ammo trying to fix my issue.

Im getting ready for deer season and am having serious accuracy issues. I have a Mossberg 500 20 gauge with 24" rifled slug barrel with Williams WGRS sights. Back sight was changed from buckhorn blade to Ghost ring. I'm shooting Federal Premium Trophy Copper Sabot Slugs which are $17 for 5 shells so mistakes are getting costly.

Im trying to sight this in like I would a rifle and its shooting a foot high at 25 yards. I thought I would need to install a higher front sight but Im wondering if I'm just holding the gun wrong and the recoil is thowing my shot.

Im shooting from the bench at 25 yards. Front bag only and shotgun forearm is resting on bag. Im not holding the forearm when taking the shot, its just resting on the bag. This is causing the forearm to kick open the chamber during the shot so recoil is definetly having some effect but Im not sure if this would cause enough muzzle rise to throw the shot upwards of 12" at 25 yards.

Is controlling that front forearm with supporting hand necessary on a slug gun? On a rifle its unnecessary as I usually support the stock with front bag only and get good groups but Im wondering if my technique is the issue or whether I really do need to chop the old front sight off and install a taller sight. Have any of you ever dealt with this issue with slugs?
 
First, hold the forearm. On guns with more recoil, this is necessary, even at the bench. Be sure the shotgun's butt is in the pocket, the area of the shoulder inward from the joint and outward from bare collarbone. The butt should be resting on meat, and meat only. Sit up as straight as you can at the bench, best way to do this is lower the seat usually. If you cannot do this, sight the shotgun in from either the kneeling supported or sitting position.
Another factor with slug-barreled shotguns is consistent tightness of the magazine cap/barrel nut. If it is loose, or overtightened, it will change POI, just as on the action screws of a bolt action rifle.
If the front sight is leftover from the buckhorns, you will probably have to replace it with a different one.
My personal recommendation is to sell the ironsighted rifled barrel and get a cantilever mount rifled barrel, and put a 1-4 variable or a fixed 2.5x scope on it. Or, if the receiver of your 500 is drilled and tapped, mount a scope on it.
 
entropy said:
First, hold the forearm. On guns with more recoil, this is necessary, even at the bench. Be sure the shotgun's butt is in the pocket, the area of the shoulder inward from the joint and outward from bare collarbone. The butt should be resting on meat, and meat only. Sit up as straight as you can at the bench, best way to do this is lower the seat usually. If you cannot do this, sight the shotgun in from either the kneeling supported or sitting position.
Another factor with slug-barreled shotguns is consistent tightness of the magazine cap/barrel nut. If it is loose, or overtightened, it will change POI, just as on the action screws of a bolt action rifle.
If the front sight is leftover from the buckhorns, you will probably have to replace it with a different one.
My personal recommendation is to sell the ironsighted rifled barrel and get a cantilever mount rifled barrel, and put a 1-4 variable or a fixed 2.5x scope on it. Or, if the receiver of your 500 is drilled and tapped, mount a scope on it.
Click to expand...

I hunt in heavy brush in CA river bottoms. Shots can be close and fast in jungle like overgrowth. I dont want to resort to optics unless I have no other choice.

Ive used an iron sighted smooth bore slug barrel on an 870 before with success but I sold that that gun years ago and am starting fresh with this Mossi and laws dont allow buckshot here so Im stuck using copper sabot slugs. I'll try losening my mag cap a bit next time out and see if that helps.
 
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I’d go for a taller, square post, and keep the mag cap repeatedly tight. I assume you are using a proper sight picture with your new sights. I only ask because I met somebody once who thought he was supposed to split the aperture with the post, lol.
I know you don’t want optics, but a red dot sight is perfect for what you are doing. Compact decent quality ones are pretty affordable these days.
$17/5rds...dang, that’s steep. Don’t see why you would need that for close in shots in brush. Cheap foster slugs through smooth bores have done that job fine for generations.
 
amd6547 said:
I’d go for a taller, square post, and keep the mag cap repeatedly tight. I assume you are using a proper sight picture with your new sights. I only ask because I met somebody once who thought he was supposed to split the aperture with the post, lol.
I know you don’t want optics, but a red dot sight is perfect for what you are doing. Compact decent quality ones are pretty affordable these days.
$17/5rds...dang, that’s steep. Don’t see why you would need that for close in shots in brush. Cheap foster slugs through smooth bores have done that job fine for generations.
Click to expand...

Ya, Im using the correct sight picture. I have a Williams peep on my 94 Winchester 30-30 and its deadly accurate. The Ghost ring is further from my eye but uses the same sight picture. Front sight in center of ring not spliting it in half. Eye automatically centers front post in middle.

I would much rather have used foster slugs as I have a bunch left over in storage and they are dirt cheap.

California Law doesn't allow hunting with non lead ammo anymore. A few of the areas I hunt are shotgun with slug only so that leaves DDuplecks rounds which arent really available locally or Copper Sabot Slugs. I miss my old Foster slugs.

Ill use a red dot if I have too but Id rather just stick with irons. One less thing to worry about breaking when banging around in the brush.
 
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Not every slug barrel will shoot every brand of slugs well. A buddy and I years ago each bought a cantilever slug barrel for Remington 11-87's. Mine would shoot Rem copper solids great, 4" groups at 100 yards. His 16" groups. He went to a different brand, shrunk his group to about 5", mine opened up to the 14-16" when I shot his other brand of slugs. Not the only time I've heard of this type of phenomenon. I know they're expensive, but you might try another brand.
 
Same experience for my dad and I with Hastings barrels. I had a 20" for my 870, he had a 24" for his 1100. His 24" shot Winchester's sabots very accurately, (He anchored a doe at 225 yards that someone else had gutshot.) but his groups with Hornady or Remington looked like buckshot. My 20" liked Honady, so that's what I used. Longest I ever got a deer with that barrel was 50 yards, but it was accurate past 100.
 
If your getting decent groups and the WGRS is maxed to give full downward elevation then the only option is a taller front sight.

Did you try it with the factory irons? It’s possible the Williams is not compatible with the front sight post and needs to be changed.
 
earlthegoat2 said:
If your getting decent groups and the WGRS is maxed to give full downward elevation then the only option is a taller front sight.

Did you try it with the factory irons? It’s possible the Williams is not compatible with the front sight post and needs to be changed.
Click to expand...

Ya I used it with the factory Williams buckhorn Blade first (barrel ships with these WGRS sights from factory) and never got it on the paper at 50 yards so I changed the buckhorn blade out for a Ghost ring and backed up to 25 yards and got it on paper but its shooting a foot high after maxing the sight out.
 
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Wait......The WGRS is mounted on the barrel? No wonder you're having problems-WGRS stands for Williams Guide Receiver Sight. It's llike trying to shoot a Mojo sight on a Mosin-you'll need a higher front sight.
 
Brenneke has a tin slug you might try if your gun doesn't like the sabots you mention after you try the tips in the comments above. It's called the TKO slug. I haven't tried it since we can use lead in TX.
 
entropy said:
Wait......The WGRS is mounted on the barrel? No wonder you're having problems-WGRS stands for Williams Guide Receiver Sight. It's llike trying to shoot a Mojo sight on a Mosin-you'll need a higher front sight.
Click to expand...

That is what I was trying to figure out too. I’m still not sure of the actual configuration so I cannot lend anymore help in the matter.

A picture will help a lot here I think. I did go to the Williams catalog and there did not seem to be a WGRS sight that was specifically labeled for a Mossberg 500.
 
Judas530 said:
. . . forearm is resting on bag. Im not holding the forearm when taking the shot, its just resting on the bag.
Click to expand...
I would advise that you don't bother shooting at all unless your going to hold the gun while doing so.

Stand up, rest on a pole, shooting sticks, or something like a field expedient rest, and hold the gun with both hands. Make a group with cheap slugs, then switch to your high-price DPRC copper slugs.
 
This rear sight............goes on the receiver where it's drilled and tapped?
If so yes, you are supposed to run a taller front sight. Usually the sights sold as a set.
 
Guns are part of a system. That system incorporates a shooter.
The shooter's input is reflected in the sight setting.
Slug guns have big recoil but slow projectiles.
Hence they typically have shorter barrels- for less time of flight in the barrel...........which gets less shooter input.
You must be very consistent in form/grip when shooting slugs.
Many people getting popped end up w a flinch, and or change grip pressure as shooting goes.
Have seen the lead sleds and sight vises. Sorry, but if you're gonna hunt w a slug gun, you're gonna have to take your licks.

IMHO you need front and rear bags and to shoot from a fairly upright bench position. This should better replicate hunting shots, as you will move (in recoil) in a similar fashion.

I get good groups from slug guns, and I run a light grip on the forend (like shooting a varmint rifle).
Consequently I take a beating. Impacts on range correspond to those afield.

Slug guns are effective, and fun in their own way. I think they're pretty much a young man's game anymore :)
I've switched to more polite (to my head/neck/shoulder) deer killers.
 
If you are wanting quick shot ability, then my suggestion is a RDS, screw the iron sights.
You may need a cheek pad to get the field stock to fit right, but those are cheap.

The reddot? I dunno if a Sig Romeo 5 will hold up or not. Know guys running them on lesser recoil stuff.
They are micro, and I prefer those closer to the eye (rifle set up). Dislike them out a ways.

Another option, that might sit lower, is a Burris Fastfire reflex sight.
Those may have more mounting options.
 
Can't speak for your situation but my 590 bead sight hits pretty high with slugs. For torso hits out to 50-60 yards I hold on the beltline or the bottom of the torso steel.
 
Most of my slugging was with a 4x scope.
But i shoot both eyes open on everything and my dominant eye is very dominant.

However, a 1 or 1.5x power on a scopes low w end w a proper stock.....makes movers up close pretty darn easy
 
Kevinq6 said:
Brenneke has a tin slug you might try if your gun doesn't like the sabots you mention after you try the tips in the comments above. It's called the TKO slug. I haven't tried it since we can use lead in TX.
Click to expand...
Unfortunately that ammunition is only available in 12ga. The OP's gun is a 20ga.
 
It has not received super heavy use but the FastFire III on my turkey gun has worked well. It’s on a gas semi though so recoil from a pump I’d imagine causes more wear and tear on a red dot.
 
amd6547 said:
I’d go for a taller, square post, and keep the mag cap repeatedly tight. I assume you are using a proper sight picture with your new sights. I only ask because I met somebody once who thought he was supposed to split the aperture with the post, lol.
I know you don’t want optics, but a red dot sight is perfect for what you are doing. Compact decent quality ones are pretty affordable these days.
$17/5rds...dang, that’s steep. Don’t see why you would need that for close in shots in brush. Cheap foster slugs through smooth bores have done that job fine for generations.
Click to expand...
Because he is in CA and lead for hunting is banned
 
So, your comment about cheap Foster slug has no bearing on this thread..............at least as far as the OP is concerned......
 
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