Remington does it again... Bankruptcy No 2.

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Moving south did very little positive for Remington, if anything the expense of buying the Huntsville facility and the loss of personnel by moving various disparate operations (R&D, manufacturing, accessories) from several different locations to Huntsville did far more damage to Remington then it benefited the company.
 
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New article on Remington, the 2nd bankruptcy is official, the case is Remington Outdoor Company Inc., 20-81688-11, U.S. Bankruptcy Court for the Northern District of Alabama.

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/remington-outdoor-returns-bankruptcy-chapter-033424046.html

Remington is try to blame falling gun sales... Maybe it was they chose to stop making the most sought after firearms (by killing DPMS and Bushmaster) right before a pandemic and social unrest and no one wants what they are making in this current market. Gun sale are certainly not falling, we have set several records guns sales in the past few months. Remington chose poorly and are reaping those rewards.
 
The headline I pasted below sums it up well. I don't want to see any manufacturer go under and hope they come out of this, but if you can't sell guns in this environment there's something wrong with your business model.

https://www.foxbusiness.com/lifestyle/remington-arms-bankruptcy-surging-gun-demand

Remington (with the closure of DPMS, Bushmaster, Tapco, Para etc) tried to go FUDD in a market that FUDD is on the decline despite the dramatic increase in overall gun sales. Bolt action rifles and pump shotgun are not selling the way AR's and handgun are. Remington stopped making AR's and other than copying 1911's can't seem to make a viable handgun. Not a good thing for a gun company in this current market.
 
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Remington (with the closure of DPMS, Bushmaster, Tapco, Para etc) tried to go FUDD in a market that FUDD is on the decline despite the dramatic increase in overall gun sales. Bolt action rifles and pump shotgun are not selling the way AR's and handgun are. Remington stopped making AR's and other than coping 1911 can't seem to make a viable handgun. Not a good thing for a gun company in this current market.


I still can't understand why they killed Para. The double stacks they built run quite well.
 
if you can't sell guns in this environment there's something wrong with your business model.
Pretty much so.
Remington (with the closure of DPMS, Bushmaster, Tapco, Para etc) tried to go FUDD in a market that FUDD is on the decline despite the dramatic increase in overall gun sales
Concur, but I'd have used the term 'field arms' as opposed to FUDD. Hunting is down and no longer drives the market, and gaming / self defense are the current market drivers. Doubling down on field arms at the expense of gaming and defensive arms is just stupid.
 
I still can't understand why they killed Para. The double stacks they built run quite well.

Never made sense to me. The should have branded all their 1911/2010 under the Para brand rather than kill Para and suck it under Remington. My Remington R1 Limted (double stack 40) has as many Para parts in it as it does Remington parts. They never completely used up the Para parts before giving up on the double stacks.

Pretty much so.
Concur, but I'd have used the term 'field arms' as opposed to FUDD. Hunting is down and no longer drives the market, and gaming / self defense are the current market drivers. Doubling down on field arms at the expense of gaming and defensive arms is just stupid.

I probably should have done similar. I use the FUDD term here to express my angst for Remington poorly thought out strategy and not to be disrespectful against hunters in general. I have been an hunter since I was 9 if not earlier and though I have shot a lot of competitive shooting I still love hunting. That said I have been hunting with an AR of one type or another almost exclusively since moving out of a slug only state ~5 years ago.
 
They must have special top management at Remington. Record firearm sales for years in a row. I can't even find Hi-points at my local gun store as everything is being bought up. And Remington is still broke. That takes talent. I really hope the Navajo can turn them around and make something people want.

Never made sense to me.
I have a Para 1911. Wonderfully accurate pistol. I planned on getting another until I saw they were bought by Big R. Wouldn't even touch them after reading that.
 
They must have special top management at Remington. Record firearm sales for years in a row. I can't even find Hi-points at my local gun store as everything is being bought up. And Remington is still broke. That takes talent. I really hope the Navajo can turn them around and make something people want.


I have a Para 1911. Wonderfully accurate pistol. I planned on getting another until I saw they were bought by Big R. Wouldn't even touch them after reading that.

Navajo Nation has withdraw all interest into Remington. They finally did enough research to realize that it was a bad investment.

I have two Remington 1911/2011 and they have been fine guns for the price. Despite all of Remington's short coming they made a decent 1911 for the price.
 
Remington hasn't been good or put out anything worthwhile for 30 years. Other then their ammunition.
As horrible as Remington management has been over the past decade or two I would have to disagree with you on the worth while of some of their products even if they ultimately killed them due to QC and support issues. In the past 20 years Remington has done some good things technically the have made a difference.

The Versa Max and the V3 have been two fairly impressive semi-auto shotguns.

Remember the DPMS GII was designed by Remington's R&D group and is probably one of the better if not the best of the small frame 308 sized AR.

Remington made the ACR what it is today when Magpul couldn't. Yes Remington failed to support it properly but they took a cool concept from Magpul and made it a (nearly) viable platform. It certainly would not be were it is now by Magpul alone.

The RACS (Remington Accessory Chassis System) for both the PSR, CSR, and M2010 were way ahead of their time and for years where the bench mark against all other chassis guns were measured. You can still see the influences of those chassis on the current market of chassis guns.

How many new cartridges has Remington helped bring to the market in the past 20 years: 300 AAC Blackout, 450 Bushmaster, 30 RAR (even if they did not support it again but I like it), 6.8 SPC, no doubt others.

I have probably missed a few things but these are the ones I thought of off the top of my head.
 
Never made sense to me. The should have branded all their 1911/2010 under the Para brand rather than kill Para and suck it under Remington.


The logic behind it is that the greater name value is Remington and that is all the corporate raiders care about.


Profit issue aside, if Remingtons sales haven't substantially increased recently it would seem that the upper management and or the Boad of Directors are incompetent.
 
They must have special top management at Remington. Record firearm sales for years in a row. I can't even find Hi-points at my local gun store as everything is being bought up. And Remington is still broke. That takes talent. I really hope the Navajo can turn them around and make something people want.

The Navajo deal is dead.

Record firearms sales is a bit of a misnomer. Sales leading up to the 2016 election were high. But then Trump got elected and the panic died in one night.

The remainder of 2016 and then 2017 were pretty slow. There was a glut in the market due to many companies over production before the 2016 election. 2018 and 2019 weren't much better. Remember, even the early months of this year there were all kinds of stuff on sale for extremely low prices. You could get a basic functional AR rifle for $300.

Then the Covid hit, followed by the rise of the militant left. Those two combined started another panic. Add to that that this is an election year and it gets really silly again.
 
Someone will buy them. I highly doubt the go off into that goodnight. If anything, another gunmaker will grab them up, just for the name.
 
Someone will buy them. I highly doubt the go off into that goodnight. If anything, another gunmaker will grab them up, just for the name.

But as of right now you inherited the Sand-hook lawsuit and the 700 trigger lawsuits and a few other less lawsuits if you buy them. The chapter 11 bankruptcy from 2018 and the chapter 11 bankruptcy filed earlier this week will not remove that very costly baggage from anyone thinking about buying Remington. It would take a chapter 13 bankruptcy to remove that mill stone from Remington's neck and that would also completely destroy the company except for the name as it would require full liquidation of all assets.
 
But as of right now you inherited the Sand-hook lawsuit and the 700 trigger lawsuits and a few other less lawsuits if you buy them. The chapter 11 bankruptcy from 2018 and the chapter 11 bankruptcy filed earlier this week will not remove that very costly baggage from anyone thinking about buying Remington. It would take a chapter 13 bankruptcy to remove that mill stone from Remington's neck and that would also completely destroy the company except for the name as it would require full liquidation of all assets.
The sandyhook lawsuit is BS..but we all know that. I have little doubt that once its appeal goes forward, the judge with common sense will see the PLCA(or what the abbreviation is) act applies.

The trigger suits? Not that big a anchor really
 
The sandyhook lawsuit is BS..but we all know that. I have little doubt that once its appeal goes forward, the judge with common sense will see the PLCA(or what the abbreviation is) act applies.

The trigger suits? Not that big a anchor really

Evidence seems to point too the contrary. Cerberus tried to sell Remington et al since as far back as 2012 shortly after the Sandy Hook shooting and was never able to find a buyer. After the 2018 Bankruptcy JP Morgan Chase and Franklin Templeton have been trying to sell the company. Remington has spent millions and millions of dollars defending itself against these lawsuit, BS or not. The new owner would have to continue to defend itself against these lawsuits. Its a factor as they look at whether they can make a profitable company out of Remington and so far no one is willing to try, even the Navajo Nations took a pass.
 
The faulty trigger/safety issue that they flatly denied for decades and just paid out settlements instead of fixing the problem right away was a major disaster for them. Idiots. They cheapened everything they produced and stopped building the only guns that would sell these days. They built the 770 POS and others that competed against their own model 700. Poor business decisions one after another....poor customer service. They just plain suck.
 
The faulty trigger/safety issue that they flatly denied for decades and just paid out settlements instead of fixing the problem right away was a major disaster for them. Idiots. They cheapened everything they produced and stopped building the only guns that would sell these days. They built the 770 POS and others that competed against their own model 700. Poor business decisions one after another....poor customer service. They just plain suck.

I agree with most of it except the trigger issue. The original Walker trigger was awesome and is for all intent and purposes still in use/production under another name. There was nothing wrong with it. No one has ever been able to reliably and repeatable cause that fire control to fail. At some point they had to cut their losses and settle out of court simply for costs. The X-mark pro trigger issue was simply a manufacturing issue (poorly applied thread locker) not a design issue and was contained to a relatively small number of fire controls. Most people don't even realize there were two different Remington trigger issue. The media in general lump them together and I would bet don't even realize there is two different triggers.
 
I agree with most of it except the trigger issue. The original Walker trigger was awesome and is for all intent and purposes still in use/production under another name. There was nothing wrong with it. No one has ever been able to reliably and repeatable cause that fire control to fail. At some point they had to cut their losses and settle out of court simply for costs. The X-mark pro trigger issue was simply a manufacturing issue (poorly applied thread locker) not a design issue and was contained to a relatively small number of fire controls. Most people don't even realize there were two different Remington trigger issue. The media in general lump them together and I would bet don't even realize there is two different triggers.
I had to unintentional discharges with a model 700. One closing the bolt and another taking the rifle off safety. The trigger was clean and was never tampered with. I replaced it with a Timney. There definitely WAS something wrong with my particular 700 trigger. I have a 1962 Model 700 ADL and a model 660 carbine, they both have timney trigger/safeties in them. You'll never convince anyone who's had a unplanned discharge with a Remington that they're anything other than an accident waiting to happen. Edited to add....Remington has one of the poorest customer relations/service in the firearms industry. I have first hand knowledge of that.
 
That 870 rough chamber thing was a bigger deal than people make it out to be. At the very least they could have acknowledged it, even if they didn't want to fix it. It would have gone a long way. Two recalls for triggers, and trying to sell high finish bolt guns with cheap plastic parts. These we're big issues with their Fudd lineup they were banking on, and had no interest in fixing.
 
I had to unintentional discharges with a model 700. One closing the bolt and another taking the rifle off safety. The trigger was clean and was never tampered with. I replaced it with a Timney. There definitely WAS something wrong with my particular 700 trigger. I have a 1962 Model 700 ADL and a model 660 carbine, they both have timney trigger/safeties in them. You'll never convince anyone who's had a unplanned discharge with a Remington that they're anything other than an accident waiting to happen. Edited to add....Remington has one of the poorest customer relations/service in the firearms industry. I have first hand knowledge of that.

I have witness a Timney 700 two stage trigger discharge on bolt close. Not mine but witness it.

Can't argue with you on the customer service.
 
I think a large part of it is people buying these companies and then pretty much running them into the ground for their own profit. Odd comparison, but that is what happened to Toys R' Us who was doing pretty well but had been saddled with huge debt by others. People buy the companies, run them up on debt, give themselves huge bonuses from said debt and then pitch them in the trash can. I think that is part of Remington's issues, not all of it but it didn't help!
 
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