Finally I got a 45 convertible

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Cump

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So despite this market frenzy, I noticed SAA clones were readily available at reasonable prices, so I sold my LC9S and its extras for about what I put into it, and turned the money (plus a rounding error) into this EMF US Marshall II by Pietta with extra 45 acp cylinder.

I've had some Cimarron P Jr's and Birdshead Vaqueros -- which I took and gave on trade (neither feeling quite like a SAA). But this is my first very own SAA clone. I can stop borrowing my brother's Uberti. Hopefully can shoot it tomorrow. (Pics include the fluted 45 colt and unfluted 45 acp cylinder.)

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Nice looking revolver! I use my 45acp cylinder way more often than the 45 Colt.

I am expecting to do the same since i reload a lot for 1911s. But I do have 45 colt dies, brass and some 250 grainers. Probably will occassionally load some bp to keep it authentic.

I don't see a defect on the gun, which is always a relief when ordering online. I expect it will shoot good too.
 
Nice looking piece. That meant to be carried with an empty chamber? If not what prevents the FP from sitting on the primer?
 
Cump

A handsome looking single action! The color case hardening looks great with the blued finish and walnut grip.
 
Nice looking piece. That meant to be carried with an empty chamber? If not what prevents the FP from sitting on the primer?

Hammer down, the firing pin rests on the primer. Quarter-cock pulls the pin back, but I wouldn't consider that safe for carry.

This will be a steel shooter so I will be loading five. I guess if all hell broke loose and it was my last gun left, I'd load six, carry at 4 o'clock with a thong over the hammer, and walk to the right and rear of my loved ones.
 
Lol. Just wondering. As some have already said....Very nice color case hardening. Bet it puts a smile on your face every time you pull the trigger. Pretty hot on the Wasatch Front right now! Stay cool!
 
Lol. Just wondering. As some have already said....Very nice color case hardening. Bet it puts a smile on your face every time you pull the trigger. Pretty hot on the Wasatch Front right now! Stay cool!

That's the truth. Maybe that will motivate me to get up early and shoot before it heats up. Still need to load some ...
 
Hammer down, the firing pin rests on the primer. Quarter-cock pulls the pin back, but I wouldn't consider that safe for carry.

Howdy

Absolutely only carry it with an empty chamber under the hammer.

These are the parts inside a Colt. I expect the parts inside the EMF Marshal are not much different. The upper arrow is pointing to the 'safety cock' notch on the hammer. The lower arrow is pointing to the tip of the trigger that fits into the notch. Notice how thin the tip is. Long experience has proven that it does not take too much of a blow to the hammer spur to break the tip of the trigger off, or break off the over hanging lip on the 'safety cock' notch on the hammer. Dropping the revolver onto a hard surface from waist high will do it. Or allowing the stirrup of a saddle to fall onto a holstered Colt before mounting the saddle. In either of these cases, the force imparted to the hammer is enough to drive the firing pin into a primer and set it off. If you are shooting at the range, it is one thing, but I even heard of a man years ago who was found dead at a range after an old Three Screw Ruger Blackhawk accidentally discharged, killing him.

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Like John Wayne used to say, if you think you are going to need six, then load all six. Otherwise just load five and lower the hammer on an empty chamber.

The best way to do it is to load one, skip one, load four more, bring the hammer to full cock and then gently lower it. If you do it right, the hammer will be down on the empty chamber.



Regarding 45 ACP cylinders, gotta tell you, here is my 45 Colt/45ACP Blackhawk that I bought brand-spanky new in 1975. I have put thousands of rounds through the 45 Colt cylinder, both factory and handloads. Probably put less than a box of 45 ACP through the other cylinder in all that time. Just not interested in shooting 45 ACP out of a single action revolver.

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Howdy

Absolutely only carry it with an empty chamber under the hammer.

These are the parts inside a Colt. I expect the parts inside the EMF Marshal are not much different. The upper arrow is pointing to the 'safety cock' notch on the hammer. The lower arrow is pointing to the tip of the trigger that fits into the notch. Notice how thin the tip is. Long experience has proven that it does not take too much of a blow to the hammer spur to break the tip of the trigger off, or break off the over hanging lip on the 'safety cock' notch on the hammer. Dropping the revolver onto a hard surface from waist high will do it. Or allowing the stirrup of a saddle to fall onto a holstered Colt before mounting the saddle. In either of these cases, the force imparted to the hammer is enough to drive the firing pin into a primer and set it off. If you are shooting at the range, it is one thing, but I even heard of a man years ago who was found dead at a range after an old Three Screw Ruger Blackhawk accidentally discharged, killing him.

View attachment 933025




Like John Wayne used to say, if you think you are going to need six, then load all six. Otherwise just load five and lower the hammer on an empty chamber.

The best way to do it is to load one, skip one, load four more, bring the hammer to full cock and then gently lower it. If you do it right, the hammer will be down on the empty chamber.



Regarding 45 ACP cylinders, gotta tell you, here is my 45 Colt/45ACP Blackhawk that I bought brand-spanky new in 1975. I have put thousands of rounds through the 45 Colt cylinder, both factory and handloads. Probably put less than a box of 45 ACP through the other cylinder in all that time. Just not interested in shooting 45 ACP out of a single action revolver.

View attachment 933026

Thank you for the detailed picture and explanation. I will probably do a double-check now whenever tightening the girth, no matter what I'm carrying.

And you may be right. I can reload 45 colt as easily as 45 acp.

But I do like the idea of taking it out whenever I or a family member is shooting a 1911. Or maybe even 45 cal Glocks, for an ironic pairing.
 
Nice looking revolver.

As far as convertibles go, I've not really found them to be an advantage. I have a Single Six convertible and a 357 Mag/9x19 Blackhawk convertible. The alternate cylinder has virtually never been installed in the gun. The 22 Mag cylinder has maybe seen less than a box of 22 Mag ammunition. The 9x19 cylinder has never been installed in the revolver.

But, that is just me. Other folks may get more use from the alternate cylinder that I do.
 
I don't reload, so I use both of my Blackhawk convertible cylinders a lot. 9mm and 45acp are less expensive and easier to find than 357 and 45 Colt.

For me 9mm feels different than 38 special or 357 magnum, and its POI is different than either one.

For me 45acp feels about the same as 45 Colt, and their POI is very close.
 
Got to shoot it yesterday. Very fun! Shot some 45 acp, 45 schofield, and 45 colt, all reloaded with 200 grain cast bullets and unique. I don't have any lead 250s, so that trial will have to wait.

The targets I shot were at 7 yards on 6 inch targets at the beginning of the day, before I started sharing the pistol and targets. With each cylinder, I shot two on a separate target to make sure I'd be on paper before shooting three for the record. The 45 acp is the tightest group. The 45 colt is high and right. The last target 45 schofield.

I was able to move later targets to the center by adjusting trigger-finger placement.
 

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Regarding 45 ACP cylinders, gotta tell you, here is my 45 Colt/45ACP Blackhawk that I bought brand-spanky new in 1975. I have put thousands of rounds through the 45 Colt cylinder, both factory and handloads. Probably put less than a box of 45 ACP through the other cylinder in all that time. Just not interested in shooting 45 ACP out of a single action revolver.

Amen to that. I've owned a few .45 convertibles over the years and never used the .45 ACP cylinder.
Since I've always reloaded, why bother?
 
Amen to that. I've owned a few .45 convertibles over the years and never used the .45 ACP cylinder.
Since I've always reloaded, why bother?

From a certain point of view: simplicity. One box or batch of ammo for a 1911, SAA, and Glock 30.

And I have thousands of 45 acp cases, versus a few hundred of 45 colt.

The 45 acp cylinder will be for practicality, the 45 colt for purity ...
 
Sometimes I feel like Alfonso the Wise, "Had I been present at the Creation, I would have given a few hints for the better ordering of things."

One hint would have been to produce the M1917 revolvers in .45 Colt. They had to issue two kinds of pistol ammo, anyway (clipped for revolvers, unclipped for M1911s) so having two cartridges would have caused no added problems.
 
One hint would have been to produce the M1917 revolvers in .45 Colt. They had to issue two kinds of pistol ammo, anyway (clipped for revolvers, unclipped for M1911s) so having two cartridges would have caused no added problems.

Since it was used in WW1 this might have been a good idea.
Maybe they could have used up their surplus Cavalry BP Schofield ammunition from the 1880s. :D
 
I have .22 convertibles and haven't used a mag cylinder in over 20 years. A 45 convertible though I could see myself using the ACP cylinder. I was thinking about a Blackhawk Convertible for a while but will probably end up with a 44 Special flat top.
Hell who knows eventually I'm sure I'll have both.
 
Here is my old Italian clone, probably Uberti but not in hand at the moment. It came with the 45 long Colt cylinder. I bought an ACP cylinder after a couple of years, just because. Well, once I fitted it and took it shooting, I have never looked back. I am not even sure where the long Colt cylinder is!

Reloads up to 280 grain lswc can all equal standard long Colt ballistics. Mostly, I shoot 240 at about 900 fps.

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Kevin
 
I like the 45 Colt cartridge but my Ruger Blackhawk 45 convertible sees a lot of 45acp. At first it was because reloading components were cheaper, especially brass. Plenty of 45acp brass left at the range to scrounge (this was about 40 years ago), bullets used slightly less metal when casting, and a bit less powder. I was feeding a 45 auto anyway and this gun does really well with the 45acp rounds. The Colt cylinder goes in when I'm shooting heavier loads and/or for distance. I have a new model Vaquero I use for BP 45 Colt rounds which are a lot of fun.

I rarely changed out cylinders in any of my Single-Sixes but I'm now leaving the magnum cylinder in one of them. I recently inherited a lot of 22 mag ammo so I'm seeing what kind of accuracy I can get from a 6.5" Ruger using iron sights at 100 yards. It makes for extra fun at the range and my wife is happy I didn't have to buy another gun.

Jeff
 
One hint would have been to produce the M1917 revolvers in .45 Colt. They had to issue two kinds of pistol ammo, anyway (clipped for revolvers, unclipped for M1911s) so having two cartridges would have caused no added problems.

Since it was used in WW1 this might have been a good idea.
Maybe they could have used up their surplus Cavalry BP Schofield ammunition from the 1880s.

Howdy

The Smith and Wesson Model 1917 was chambered for 45ACP because it was a very convenient modification of the 44 Hand Ejector 2nd Model.

In 1914 S&W made the .455 Hand Ejector 1st Model, chambered for the British .455 Mark II cartridge. This was a retooled Triple Lock chambered for the British cartridge. The only modification needed was opening up the chambers and the bore for the .455 cartridge. 5,000 were shipped to Britain at the start of World War One. The British did not like the complicated 3rd latch of the Triple Lock, and were also concerned that mud could get into the recess in the barrel underlug, so a second version was made without the features of the Triple Lock, with just a simple under barrel latch. This model was produced from 1915 thorough 1917. Close to 70,000 of this model were manufactured, most being shipped to Britain and Canada.

I have one of these. Mine was shipped to Canada in 1916.

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It bears the Canadian Broad Arrow acceptance mark.

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At some point after WWI mine was modified with a new barrel and cylinder to fire the 44 Special cartridge, which was a common conversion of this model. Converting them to 45 Colt was also common.




The 1917 Model was a simple conversion from the original 44 (44 Special) Hand Ejector 2nd Model.

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All that had to be done was open up the chambers and bore from 44 to 45, and shorten the rear of cylinder so the revolver could be fired with moon clips. The cylinder was shortened by about .035, but the chambers were given a 90 degree transition to the chamber throat so the revolver could be fired without clips, with the cartridges head spacing on the case mouth. Approximately 163,600 were made between September 1917 and January 1919. Approximately 25,000 were made for the Brazilian Contract starting in 1937.

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45 Schofield ammunition was all loaded with Black Powder, and would probably not have worked out very well in the Model 1917. Besides, the larger rim diameter of the 45 Schofield ammunition would have meant modifying the ratchet teeth on the rear of the cylinder. Yes, I checked. the larger rims would not interfere with each other, but they would not clear the ratchet teeth.

The cylinder of the S&W Model 1917 is not long enough for 45 Colt ammunition. The cylinder on the one pictured above is 1.535 long. Current SAAMI spec for the 45 Colt cartridge shows a maximum length of 1.600. Allowing for a .060 thick rim, that means that 1.540 of the cartridge would need to be in the 1.535 long cylinder. I held up some of my round nosed flat point 45 Colt ammo with an Over All Length of 1.547 and allowing for the .060 thick rim, it would extend to within about .050 of the front of the cylinder.

45 Colt was a common after market conversion for the Triple Lock and the 44 HE 2nd Model, but it would not work in the Model 1917 with its shorter cylinder.
 
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