plastic ammo pollution?

Thought about that recently while hiking / scouting a big section of public land woods. Came back with 2 old 12 ga. hulls in my pocket that I came across. I pick up stuff like that if I can but would hate to see more of it; or could more folks learn that they should pick up their empties if possible? Perhaps that should be taught in things like hunter safety or other related courses. Or do they already cover environmental issues like that ? Ranges can be cleaned occasionally when needed if folks don't clean up after themselves but out in the field everyone should learn to be a bit more responsible.

By and large, nature reacts to hard plastics about the same way that it does to rock and dirt - unless it floats.
Colorful, floating objects can cause distress or death to aquatic animals and sea birds.
It is very unlikely that high-velocity shell casings will float.
Even current shot shells are unlikely to float very long, if at all.
Once they sink they become the base and cover for the plants and small animals that are at the bottom of the aquatic food chain.
I don't have a problem with that. Do you?

If you are concerned about how ugly these discarded shells are then pick them up and dispose of them properly.

I do.

-By the way, the copper oxide that comes from brass is toxic to plants and wildlife.

Plastic and steel are not.

Which is worse, plastic or steel? Neither is going to go away for a very long time when left laying. You literally walk on steel cases instead of soil on both sides of the concrete slab along the firing line at my gun club. Shotguns aren’t supposed to be shot on the rifle range but people do it regularly. The plastic shotgun shells are eventually picked up and deposited in the trash barrels but the steel hulls continue to accumulate.

When I went on a prairie dog shoot in northwestern Nebraska the ranch owner asked that we pick up our brass. He said that he has gotten flat tires on his tractor from brass cases left on the ground when they were spraying and fertilizing the pasture.

Maybe they'll go back to paper shot shells, only with steel bases. Steel does eventually corrode into oblivion (at least in my area, based on all the vehicles I've worked on today)

Like as not, unless there is a serious turn in the materials science technology, probably the only people who will universally change to composite cases will be the military, where there is a significant weight savings issue, and not intention of reusing spent cases.

Now, just because the military does something, it is not automatic (NPI) that all production will convert over. Not unless there are considerable cost savings in the switch.

Enameled steel cases area "thing" because they meet military specs and are cheap for use in milsurp arms. Nobody is reloading those. The reloading industry is not a small thing, either, it's likely that the brass/gilding metal case industry will be around for a long time.

And the hunting round industry is pretty big biz, too.

Even if the military adopts a composite (polymer walled, gilding metal base) case for the 6.8, the ammo companies will not start making those cases for all the ammo lines right afterwards.

mainecoon said:

If the world switches to plastic ammo from brass, will that mean more plastic junk on ranges and in the woods? ...

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Ayup, unfortunately people are pigs.

GBExpat said:

Ayup, unfortunately people are pigs.

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Shhhh...don't give them ideas about an anti-pollution angle to limit firearms use.

doubleh said:

Which is worse, plastic or steel? Neither is going to go away for a very long time when left laying. You literally walk on steel cases instead of soil on both sides of the concrete slab along the firing line at my gun club. Shotguns aren’t supposed to be shot on the rifle range but people do it regularly. The plastic shotgun shells are eventually picked up and deposited in the trash barrels but the steel hulls continue to accumulate.

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Steel cases on the ground here in North Texas have a limited life span. I doubt they last more than a year.

For me it’s not just the spent cases left behind by shooters in public shooting areas, it’s the broken glass, TVs, computer parts, torn up paper targets and other household detritus left behind by slob shooters.

A local paper did a story a couple years ago where the BLM people were complaining about the number of shot up road signs and information kiosks they have to replace every year because “trigger trash” (Their term) keep shooting them.

I try to make it a habit to bring back at least two trash bags full of other peoples mess every time I go out to shoot.... but it just keeps piling up .


Stay safe.

Random rules I like to observe and have taught others including my two sons.

Don't step on anything you can step over.

Don't step over anything you can step around.

Leave gates as you found them.

Police your trash.

Use a lidded ashtray..

Never cross a fence holding a long gun.

I'm sure I've forgot a few. For me, the lidded ashtray is obsolete. And on policing trash, with present types of ammo,, my long term average is about 80% give or take, depending on ground cover, etc.

Shotgun hulls are closer to 100% unless they go into the water and you can't be a fanatic about it.

Do as good as you can and call it your best for today..

Terry, 230RN

Cannibul said:

Steel cases on the ground here in North Texas have a limited life span. I doubt they last more than a year.

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There is a great deal of difference in the amount of rain and humidity in our two areas. This has been an extremely dry year here. The weather station 17 miles north of me has recorded 5.6” of rain for this year. Single digit humidity is quite common also. Steel rusting is a slow process around here.

Edited to add: This year has had it’s good points too. One of them is I’ve killed exactly one mosquito this year. Bugs of all types have been scarce this year. Another is I haven’t had to postpone many shooting sessions because of rain. On the down side I have had to pump a lot of water to keep my lawn and bushes alive.

doubleh said:

There is a great deal of difference in the amount of rain and humidity in our two areas. This has been an extremely dry year here. The weather station 17 miles north of me has recorded 5.6” of rain for this year. Single digit humidity is quite common also. Steel rusting is a slow process around here.

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I warned my son, who moved to Ohio, that he's been spoiled since he was born as far as gun cleaning and rust prevention goes here in Colorado.

Edited to add: This year has had it’s good points too. One of them is I’ve killed exactly one mosquito this year. Bugs of all types have been scarce this year.
....
.

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Noticed that this year, too. Almost no bugs of any kind. It's as if they're sheltering in place because of COVID19.

Terry, 230RN

Weather hereabouts current for when you click on it:

https://forecast.weather.gov/MapCli...105.1675&unit=0&lg=english&FcstType=graphical

Well, down here in extreme south Texas we're about to have yet another storm roll in. Used steel shells become unidentifiable in about eight months. Most hard plastics last about a year and granulate in about three.
The mosquitoes are big enough and thick enough after a good rain to plug your radiator in about fifty miles of driving. Sometimes they sound like a light rain as they hit your windshield.

Personally I wish we’d go back to waxed car board for shotgun hulls, steel casings for rifles and lead free ammo all around.

daniel craig said:

Personally I wish we’d go back to waxed car board for shotgun hulls, steel casings for rifles and lead free ammo all around.

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I'd pefer we stay with plastic shotgun hulls but I could live with waxed cardboard.
Steel "casings" were never widely used here, only for some foreign military ammo so we can't go back to them.
Lead free ammo is new, first widely used starting in the 1970's for waterfowl hunting. Some rifle and handgun ammo is lead free.
All are being used more and more but again we're not going back.

bearman49709 said:

I'd pefer we stay with plastic shotgun hulls but I could live with waxed cardboard.
Steel "casings" were never widely used here, only for some foreign military ammo so we can't go back to them.
Lead free ammo is new, first widely used starting in the 1970's for waterfowl hunting. Some rifle and handgun ammo is lead free.
All are being used more and more but again we're not going back.

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OK so I didn’t punctuate my sentence correctly when I said go back to I was just referring to cardboard shotgun shells. Obviously I know that steel casings were never really popular here nor was lead free ammo. I appreciate the correction. I shall endeavor to be a better grammarian in the future.

daniel craig said:

I shall endeavor to be a better grammarian in the future.

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All commas matter!
Let's digest the following sentence:
Let's eat grandma!






Let's eat, grandma!


Conspicuous comma colocation counters cannibalism.

Back to the topic of case materials - somewhere in the garage I have a couple of 5.56 cartridges made from plastic cases that my range NCOIC had from a sample pack a vendor sent him. Interestingly the unfired cases were clear, but would turn opaque on firing. I'll see if I can dig them up and snap a picture.

mstreddy said:

...

Back to the topic of case materials - somewhere in the garage I have a couple of 5.56 cartridges made from plastic cases that my range NCOIC had from a sample pack a vendor sent him. Interestingly the unfired cases were clear, but would turn opaque on firing. I'll see if I can dig them up and snap a picture.

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That's a new one on me I'd like to see the pix. Were these for the original pressure 5.56 NATOs, or for the insane 855s? I've seen clear shotgun cases, but that's a different level of intensity than the insane 855s.

Another thing I learned was what tombac was. Just never happened to come across the word before.

Terry, 230RN

When I hunt doves or ducks now, I bring along a bag to pick up my hulls. Its not that hard.

mainecoon said:

If centerfire goes this way would mean cheaper ammo, but a lot more crap to deal with.

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Maybe I'm missing something. Are you saying that there would be more crap to deal with because people would be shooting more since the ammo is cheaper?

FL-NC said:

When I hunt doves or ducks now, I bring along a bag to pick up my hulls. Its not that hard.

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You wouldn't think it would be too hard. Or at least make an effort even if you don't get them all. I don't get the guys that dump revolvers out on the ground. It wouldn't be anymore effort to dump them in a box to throw away if they're not keeping it.