Finally got an M1 Garand

Take a look at this thread. The whole forum will have great info as well: http://forums.thecmp.org/showthread.php?t=84882

IMR 4895 is the classic powder for the Garand. You can certainly use commercial brass and the ammo you load will be just fine to shoot in your bolt action .30-06. Another option is to buy an adjustable gas plug (I have the Schuster adjustable gas plug) and then you can shoot any commercial .30-06 ammo.

john fisher said:

Can I use regular commercial 30-06 brass like Remington and Winchester, and what loads can you recommend to me for the M1 Garand. Once I finally make ammo for the M1 Garand, can I use that same ammo for my other bolt action 30-06?

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Yes, yes, and yes.

The brass is the same. Start low, work up.

I usually suggest Master Po's recipes, but I think link rot has erased it from the interwebs. Hornady's manual has an M1 chapter, as do many others. I suggest starting there, and loading ammo with appropriate powder just powerful enough to function the gun; there's no need to push the old girl that hard.

And yes, M1 ammo is safe in any bolt gun; maybe it won't be the fastest you could get.

The weak link on a Garand is the port pressure that drives the OP rod. Too high a port pressure and you run the risk of bending the OP rod. (Note, the OP rod does have bends in it by design). To repair the OP rod, you have to have the appropriate fixture or find a new one.

There is a range of powders that work well with the Garand. IMR 4895 and H4895 are smack in the middle. Varget is another good one. I forget off hand the fastest and the slowest as the three I mentioned work fine for me. Note, H4895 and IMR4895 are not the same. Powder charges will be different for the same velocity.

The Schuster plug or the McCann plug, if I remember correctly, allow you to use current factory ammunition. They bleed off a bit of the pressure. Each accomplishes this task a bit differently and each has their advantages and disadvantages.

Some recommend a maximum bullet weight of 180 grains. Again, this is to minimize the chance of bending the OP rod.

Above posts have mentioned sources for reloading information and ammunition suggestions. Greek HXP is good surplus ammunition for the Garand. It is what CMP was selling a number of years ago but I'm not sure what, if any, they have on hand these days. It is a good source of brass to reload and you get to "unload" it in the process.

The CMP forum is about the best place to get information on the care and feeding of a Garand.

Enjoy your new rifle.

Congrats on your M1 Garand. There are several good books out there. I have a few. One of the best for technical information, ownership and shop manual is Jerry Kuhnhausen's "The U.S. .30 Caliber Gas Operated Service Rifles. His book will answer many of your questions.

john fisher said:

Finally got around to getting a couple M1 Garands. I have read that you should not use commercial 30-06 ammo and that you should either buy M1 garand specific ammo or start handloading. I almost have everything I need to start handloading but I need some advice. I have looked around and it seems that all of the M1 Garand surplus ammo is gone, and I can't find any surplus brass either. Can I use regular commercial 30-06 brass like Remington and Winchester, and what loads can you recommend to me for the M1 Garand. Once I finally make ammo for the M1 Garand, can I use that same ammo for my other bolt action 30-06?

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Congrats on the rifle. I really enjoy mine. I actually took up loading when I got my M1. I've loaded 44-46Gr of IMR4895 with Remington's 150gr FMJ-BT bullet and it seems to work well.

Message me if you want. I have a hundred LC brass once fired you can have. I’ll even swage the primer pockets for you. Glad to hear you got the rifle you wanted. How about some pictures? Tell us more about it.

Hornady's 10 edition powder manual will give you detailed recipes for loads, but another book is also very good, is The Complete M1 Garand by Jim Thompson which looks into history, parts, types, exploded views, maintenance and loads. I find shooting a Garand has a recoil like a BB gun. lol Lots of fun. Reloading is around 50 cents a piece. Be sure to experiment with different bullets, Hornady SST, Speer SP, Sierra HP and Nosler Partition all work as good or better than FMJ. Bullet seating is another area you can play with. I have a Danish Garand and have found bullets seated between 3.230 to 3.257 shoot the best, but your gun may vary. Congrats and have fun.

The Hornady 9th and apparently 10 Editions provide service rifle loadings. Safe load data for the M1 Garand may be found here. Years ago there was a site called Master Po's which had some good data but it was flaky as to the site loading. While I can't find Master Po apparently someone took the time to reprint the NRA load data and comments.

Recommended .30 caliber M1 loadings from the NRA

147 - 155 grain FMJ or HPBT bullets

IMR 3031 - 48.0 grains
IMR 4895 - 49.0 grains
IMR 4064 - 50.0 grains
W748 - 48.0 grains
AA2460 - 49.0 grains
AA2520 - 51.0 grains
AA2495 - 50.5 grains
H4895 - 49.0 grains
BLC-2 - 49.0 grains
H335 - 49.0 grains
RL-12 - 48.0 grains

165/168 grain FMJ, HP or SP bullets

IMR 4895 - 47.0 grains
IMR 4094 - 48.0 grains
AA2520 - 47.5 grains
AA2495 - 47.0 grains
H4895 - 47.5 grains
BLC-2 - 49.0 grains
H335 - 47.0 grains
RL-12 - 44.5 grains

173/175 grain FMJ or HPBT bullets

IMR 4895 - 46.0 grains
IMR 4064 - 47.0 grains
AA2460 - 46.0 grains
AA2495 - 46.0 grains
H4895 - 47.0 grains
BLC-2 - 48.0 grains

180 grain FMJ, SP or HPBT bullets

IMR 4895 - 43.0 grains
AA2460 - 46.5 grains
AA2495 - 45.5 grains
H4895 - 44.0 grains
BLC-2 - 47.5 grains
RL-12 - 41.5 grains



Master Po's comments

These loads only duplicate military spec. velocities for the given bullet weight, using commercial cases and powders. If you are using military cases, drop all charges by 2 grains.

If you are looking for accuracy, drop all charges by 1 grain and work up .2 grains at a time.

Master Po's Ancient M1 load secret

This is my personal M1 load I use in my CMP M1. It will shoot better than Master Po can. I worked this load up, as you should for your own rifle.

Remington .30/06 cases, flash holes deburred and weighed within 1 grain.
Federal GM210M Primers (Master Po has heard the horror stories of Federal match primers in the M1/M1A rifles. If you're squeamish or new to reloading, use Winchester Large Rifle)
47.0 grains IMR 4064
Sierra 175 grain MatchKing
Overall length 3.340 inches

This load, in my M1, duplicates almost perfectly the M72 match load specification with a very low standard deviation. Groups off the bench run 1 - 1.5 inches with the original 1945 barrel on the rifle. Of course, Grasshopper YMMV.

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Brass? Just about any good condition 30-06 Springfield brass should be fine when sized and trimmed properly. There are suggestions that if you find and use GI brass you should start with lower loads by about a grain so your call on that tid bit. I never found it to be true but something to consider.

There is also commercial loaded ammunition out there labeled Garand Safe, Seller Bellot #2954 just as an example. Other manufacturers make it as well so when it's available you may want to grab some.

Oh yeah, and as mentioned the Schuster Plug or similar is a good investment.

Ron

Reloadron said:

The Hornady 9th and apparently 10 Editions provide service rifle loadings. Safe load data for the M1 Garand may be found here. Years ago there was a site called Master Po's which had some good data but it was flaky as to the site loading. While I can't find Master Po apparently someone took the time to reprint the NRA load data and comments.



Brass? Just about any good condition 30-06 Springfield brass should be fine when sized and trimmed properly. There are suggestions that if you find and use GI brass you should start with lower loads by about a grain so your call on that tid bit. I never found it to be true but something to consider.

There is also commercial loaded ammunition out there labeled Garand Safe, Seller Bellot #2954 just as an example. Other manufacturers make it as well so when it's available you may want to grab some.

Oh yeah, and as mentioned the Schuster Plug or similar is a good investment.

Ron

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Stay away from the Master Po's 150-155 W/ 49.0 of H-335. WAY TOO HOT! Blew primers with that load in 1953 L C brass. 46.0 Grains was fine. Found this out in the early 1990's.

That's a good point. The Master Po stuff is some very old load data and load data I never tried so like anything online unless I have tried it I can't attest to it. Thanks for pointing that out. I will add my 30-06 go to powders for Garand loads are IMR4895, H4895 and also a fondness of AA2495.

Thanks for pointing out again your experience with H335, good stuff ro be aware of.

Ron

I've found a charge of 47 grains IMR 4064 under 150-155 grain bullets with military brass to be fairly mild shooting and accurate for me. It is in the "hot" .300 Savage range, and makes a fine and accurate deer load for your M1 or other 30-06 rifles. You may have function issues with other semi-autos, but will be fine in bolt, slide, lever, singles.

If you feel the need to sling 168s, drop the charge to 46 gr. This is "the" load for match shooting with the Garand.

You'll hear a lot about 4895 for the Garand, for good reason, it is an original military spec powder used to load M2 ball. Also remember, McDonalds is known for hamburgers, but theirs aren't necessarily the best around.

Avoid Bl-C2 in the M1 or in 30-06 in general. I think something changed in the charachteristics of the powder since data was developed. I got hangfires and a really weird (bad!) condition using Hornady data with this powder in 30-06. I believe I had the mythical flashover detonation event occur in real life. I bent an op-rod and case showed extreme pressure signs. Some loads were torn down to confirm powder charge, and reloaded to test further. Replicated the condition in a bolt action remotely triggered. Conditions were unusual...severe cold at or below 0F and a low loading density but within Hornady data range (46 gr). Enough to cause me to avoid this powder in large cases and pass the caution along here each time Garand loads come up.

Buy Scott Duff's book. It's sort of a bible for the Garand. https://www.amazon.com/M1-Garand-Ow...GTCBK44CKM5&psc=1&refRID=MP0S5PHTWGTCBK44CKM5

Kuleck and McKee's is a good guide also. https://www.amazon.com/M1-Garand-Co...+assembly+guide&qid=1600654490&s=books&sr=1-1

I worked up loads for my M1 using H4895, and settled on a charge of 44.5gn with a 148gn fmj bullet, giving 2580fps. Nice light load, I'm not going for max velocity or accuracy, just something to cycle the gun reliably on the few days of the year I take it out to shoot.

john fisher said:

Been a little busy but this is my new Springfield made in October of 1942. Muzzle reading of 1 and throat reading of 1. This one did not come with one of those new CMP stocks and I am glad it didn't.

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Mine has a new CMP stock and like you, would’ve preferred it not.

I'll echo the warnings about too hot a load in the Garand so watch out. Playing with my new chronograph, I found my loads of 46.0 grains of IMR 4895 under a 150 grain Hornady #3031 bullet gave me the same results (FPS, power factor, ft/lbs) as some Lake City '69 mil-surp ammo. Good enough for me!

That is a mild load as LC 69 is one of the weakest loads out there. Technically it's substandard and doesn't meet the required velocities.

Hornady garand data is also on the weak side presumably based of late 60s M2 ball all if which is mediocre and the lower end of the requirements or not meeting them.

My accuracy loads are all above Hornady max data and yet 100% garand safe.

I tell all new loaders to throw the Hornady garand data away.. get regular 30.06 data and use the CORRECT powders for the garand which are any from 3031 to varget/H380. Pick a bullet weight between 110-220 and enjoy.

It's really that easy to load for the garand.

Actually, I just got done running about 400 rounds through my Garand over the weekend... mostly test loads.

My standard load forever has been 47grn IMR4895 under any 150'ish grn bullet... easy shooting that doesn't beat the rifle. 168grn BTHP's get 46grn IMR4895.

I tested 44.5grn H335 as an alternate, with 150grn bullets, and while it was accurate, the primers were mashed pretty flat. I'll probably drop down to 44grn and try it again. I also tried 47grn IMR4064 with reasonable results. I'm trying to drop IMR4895 from the bench... the M1 is the only load I use it with anymore, but it's proving to be the best powder for the M1, all things considered... I never have pressure issues with it, it's reliable in the gun, and produces good accuracy.

It was interesting... using identical charges of IMR4895 and IMR4064 under a 150grn Winchester FMJ bullet... I found they produced almost the exact same velocity (2660fps and 2650fps, respectively) but the IMR4064 load generated more pressure (based on the condition of the primer.) I have a friend with QuickLoad software, I'm going to have him run it through and see what it says. As much as I want to leave IMR4895 behind, it looks like it really is the best powder choice... meaning IMR, H, or AA's powders in that burn range.

Jeremy2171 said:

I tell all new loaders to throw the Hornady garand data away.. get regular 30.06 data and use the CORRECT powders for the garand which are any from 3031 to varget/H380. Pick a bullet weight between 110-220 and enjoy.

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I don't consider that very good advise. The Garand (service rifle) data is specifically for target ammos for the Garand, and is very good data for what it is intended for. If you want to hunt or get additional performance from the Garand, that's something completely different. Grabbing a 220grn bullet and stuffing it on top of a max charge of Varget or H380 will very likely break something, eventually. My advise is... if you want to use a bullet outside of the generic FMJ or BTHP bullets in the Garand, or particularly heavy bullets, start low and work up... with the understanding that keeping your loads on the lower side of pressures is better for the rifle. If you really want to use heavy bullets in the .30-06, I would say find a more suitable firearm.

There is a reason the data providers go through the trouble and expense to generate Service Rifle data... and that includes the M1, the M1a, and the AR platforms.

Jeremy2171 said:

My accuracy loads are all above Hornady max data and yet 100% garand safe.

I tell all new loaders to throw the Hornady garand data away.. get regular 30.06 data and use the CORRECT powders for the garand which are any from 3031 to varget/H380. Pick a bullet weight between 110-220 and enjoy.

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Why? Are you fluffing the market for replacement Op Rods?

There is no reason to abuse a Garand older than you by running heavy-for-action bullets.

@john fisher use the Hornady data, and unless you're shooting Hi Power competition, find the lightest charge weight that will reliably cycle the weapon. There's no need to run the old girl to the edge; the number of men still alive who can repair an Op Rod is shrinking every year.

Charlie98 said:

I don't consider that very good advise. The Garand (service rifle) data is specifically for target ammos for the Garand, and is very good data for what it is intended for. If you want to hunt or get additional performance from the Garand, that's something completely different. Grabbing a 220grn bullet and stuffing it on top of a max charge of Varget or H380 will very likely break something, eventually. My advise is... if you want to use a bullet outside of the generic FMJ or BTHP bullets in the Garand, or particularly heavy bullets, start low and work up... with the understanding that keeping your loads on the lower side of pressures is better for the rifle. If you really want to use heavy bullets in the .30-06, I would say find a more suitable firearm.

There is a reason the data providers go through the trouble and expense to generate Service Rifle data... and that includes the M1, the M1a, and the AR platforms.

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Hornady data is extremity anemic and you can't duplicate milsurp loads with it or hornadys own garand loads for that matter...so yeah if all you want to do is shoot rocks in your backyard with light charges use hornady data. If you have a worn gas system it may not cycle reliably however.

Hornady basically did nothing other than reduce already good garand loads by a few grains and called it "garand" loads.

Why are you grabbing max charges and loading them instead of working up? THAT is bad advice right there. There is also zero reason to not use 220s if you want. The garand can safely shoot heavy bullets all day long. In fact they cycle no differently than other garand safe ammo.

If your rifle is properly greased and you have a good oprod spring you can shoot pretty much anything you want.... See Thompsons book of the garand for confirmation on that.

edwardware said:

Why? Are you fluffing the market for replacement Op Rods?

There is no reason to abuse a Garand older than you by running heavy-for-action bullets.

@john fisher use the Hornady data, and unless you're shooting Hi Power competition, find the lightest charge weight that will reliably cycle the weapon. There's no need to run the old girl to the edge; the number of men still alive who can repair an Op Rod is shrinking every year.

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Why is there some crazy need for oprods? I haven't replaced one in 30 years of shooting garands.

If your oprod is moving at the same velocity with 220s as it is with 150s then you aren't "abusing" it.