A good example of one of the many reasons why I carry a firearm.

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Gixerman1000

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Most of us have been asked things like "why would you want to carry a firearm?", and no matter what your answer is, your then told things like "if your attacked, having a GUN will only inject more violence in to the situation" or my personal favorite "if your attacked call the police, it's their job to deal with criminals not yours!!!"
Well I think what happened a few days ago (in my home town) is a very good example of why I carry a firearm.
A young couple (a 20 year old man and an 18 year old woman) stopped by Libbie Terrace Park on Church Hill in Richmond Virginia to take in the view that overlooks the city, when four black males (ages 16 to 19, one possibly in possession of a handgun) confronted the couple just before 11 PM and viciously attacked them.

The young man was horribly beaten and robbed while the young woman (or should I say girl, at only 18) was beaten, robbed, and repeatedly raped for about an hour, the four men took turns raping her while the others kept look out and continued beating her boy friend. No one has been arrested for this crime as of yet.

I know in this case the victims were too young to have had a concealed handgun permit, but it could have happened to anyone of any age.

After something like this, I will say to anyone that doesn't believe that law abiding citizens should be allowed to carry a firearm for their personal protection and the protection of their family because it would “only inject more violence to the situation†or “that is what the police are for, so you don’t need a gunâ€, I would have to ask, how could this situation possibly be anymore violent, what if this were your son or daughter, how much must a person endure before you feel the person has a right to protect them selves, what good did it do this young woman to have someone with her, and where were the police to stop this?
 
AS a police officer

As a police officer most of the time I get there after the crime has been committed. Only you can defend youself and your loved ones NOW.
 
Today

More then ever one really needs to understand that he or she can only depend on their selves. This is why it's so important that we don't allow the anti-gun bunch to take away our right to own firearms and CCW. When the time comes you will know when you need your guns.;)
 
Being able to protect one's self also includes knowing where not to go and when not to go.

I wouldn't any more go to a park in Richmond long after dark than I would stop at an interstate rest stop in NC. Both places are known to be dangerous.
 
Gixerman, even if you have a CCW, I hope you will not hang around a park on Church Hill at 11:00 p.m. It's unfortunate that this is the case, but that's just not a wise thing to do.

Also, a minor point: what does the race of the attackers have to do with anything?

BTW, I lived in Richmond from 1980 to 1997.
 
Being able to protect one's self also includes knowing where not to go and when not to go.

While I agree that there are plenty of places that I would not go wandering around in the middle of the night (particularly unarmed). I think it's really a shame that you have to stop and think if going to a park for a moonlite walk is going to get you beaten and raped. Part of carrying a gun, is to change the state of things so these types of activities are safer for everyone, right?
 
Situation awareness is useful. I agree with the view that we ought to be able to walk about at night (as I often do in the summer, then the weather is cooler by night). I have the luxury of living in a decent neighborhood, but even here a neighbor got jumped by two guys last year. He'll be learning pistol with us this weekend.
The race doesn't much matter, except possibly making aiming harder at night. Black, white or Martian green, one or four shouldn't be able to survive even trying to commit battery or rape. Yet another argument for having a trained spouse and for large magazines, by the way.
 
Gixerman, even if you have a CCW, I hope you will not hang around a park on Church Hill at 11:00 p.m. It's unfortunate that this is the case, but that's just not a wise thing to do.


I have lived around Richmond for most of my life and for the most part I know it like the back of my hand, I have been to that park before at night with a few past girlfriends years ago but I have carried a firearm from the time I was 18 so I was armed, now that I am older and married I feel no need to go there but if I did my wife and I would be well armed (a little more so than normal).

The area is known to have high crime but it has many invisible lines of danger, one block you safe for the most part and the next block your not, in this case the victims were from a few counties over so I am not sure they were aware of the areas danger zones.

I do feel that I have a right to go where ever I want, but at the same time I try not to place my self in an area that has excessive risk.

This stuff can happen anywhere at any time, I am a little fuzzy on the details but a few years ago there were two black men riding around mall parking lots looking for women to rape, they did this in areas where you would think would be the safest place in the world and even did this in day light hours, these were places my family and I went to shop. Over all before they were arrested they had abducted and raped around ten women, in some cases even abducting there husbands or boyfriends that were powerless to stop them, all but one I think were found dead, she was very lucky to escape but not before she was repeatedly raped over the course of a few days.

I am very glad this post has succeeded with it’s intended goal, That goal was to help people think about their own personal safety and the value of at least having a chance to fight back.

Also, a minor point: what does the race of the attackers have to do with anything?

The only reason I mentioned that they were black was because they were in this case. Why do you ask?
 
Gixerman, no big deal about the race of the attackers. It was just a detail that stood out as not being critical to the story.

It's very interesting what you say about the invisible lines of danger -- that could make for good thread of its own. I used to take a shortcut to downtown from my home in Chesterfield County. For a long time, I didn't realize that the shortcut took me through one or two blocks of a very bad area (one of the housing projects). My eyes finally snapped wide open one morning when there was a crime scene -- complete with a body --on the sidewalk along my route. I had been crossing one of those danger lines without even knowing it.
 
I know in this case the victims were too young to have had a concealed handgun permit, but it could have happened to anyone of any age.

We really, really need to eliminate the gun carry permission slip system, but in the meanwhile, lowering the minimum age to 18 really has to be done. Apart from a few states like Indiana, adults are being deprived of their rights. Those of you who screech and rail against open carry also need to remember that it's the only legal option for 18, 19, and 20-year-olds almost all of the time.
 
As Treylis mentioned, it was probably legal for these young people to open carry.
Possibly in Va but not in Fla.

At 18 to 20 our kids are too old to be told that they must be in at a certain time. They are adults and should be treted as such, with the same rights as any other citizen in America.

They are to young and stupid to know how to exercise their rights, but not to stupid to die defending mine.

Somehow this doesn't seem right to me.
 
Unisaw

Yea I too have been places that I had know idea that were bad areas until someone told me, the worse time was my first time to DC (with no firearm, due to DC laws), I asked this guy for directions and the first thing he said was "you are in a very bad place to be lost" he then told me not to stop for anyone and how to get back to the beltway.


Wildalaska

Yes I mentioned it again, but they were not suspects they were assailants. If you are insinuating something please don’t be politically correct just say it, or if you have something you want to ask me just ask. That is what forums are for.
 
CC age

In NH there is no age listed in the RSA. 18 is when most Deptments issue permits. Open carry is legal.
 
I think everyone has covered the self defense angle. There are howerver a few other reasons to have useful tools around.

A couple years ago, before I had my permit, I came accross a very sad scene that having a firearm could have helped solve. A duck trying to cross a busy road had been struck by a car. The poor thing did not die but had been very badly wounded. It's gut was ripped open and as it flopped around in agony it's intestines were falling out and sticking to the hot road surface. This poor duck died the hardest death I have ever seen a creature suffer through. None of us that had stopped to try and help had a firearm. I swear to God though if I had had one on me I would have, as gently as possible, moved that poor bird off the road and ended it's misery.

There are more reasons for a responsible prepared adult to have a firearm handy then to hold off the criminal hordes.
 
Aikibiker,
You have raised a very good topic for a thread.
Would you really have discharged a firearm to kill a duck?
What would the consequences be??
It would be bad enough to have a goodie two shoes bad mouthing you for simple stepping on it's head or wringing it's neck but to discharge any type of fire arm, I believe would set off a really big scandle over nothing.
Its sad to say we do not live in a world of reality and have to watch our every move for political correctness or face the concequences.

Vern
 
gunsmith

Thank you for welcoming me to the forum, My screen name does come from GSXR,

I ride a 2002 Suzuki GSXR1000 (Red,Black & Silver) and my wife rides a 1994 Suzuki RF600R (Red).

(Doh!!! I said black again, sorry not trying to offend anyone)

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In a case like that with the duck, sometimes you just have to do what it takes for the much needed end result.

A few weeks ago I passed a blue bird flopping around on the side of the road and I went back to se how bad it was hurt, it had been hit by a car, one of his legs were gone and one wing was about ripped off. So I stomped it one good time to put it out of it's misery. I hated to kill it in such a barbaric manor but it needed to be done and I was not going to draw my P7 and shoot a bird within city limits.

(My killing of the bird had nothing to do with the fact the bird was blue, just in case anyone found it interesting)
 
carrying a gun is only half the equation. shooting it into a bad guy's boiler room is the other. if you are not prepared to do both, then stay home after dark.
 
Regarding "injecting more violence into the situation" I like Jeff Cooper's statment. When asked if he thought violence begat more violence, he replied that he tried to ensure that anyone offering violence to another found himself on the receiving end of more violence than he could enjoy.
 
Those of you who screech and rail against open carry also need to remember that it's the only legal option for 18, 19, and 20-year-olds almost all of the time.

Lets get it legal for me to buy a pistol at a gun shop, and ammo at Wal-Mart first. Ammo is the worst when you're 18-20. Gotta stock up at gunshows, from the non-FFL's.
 
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