Supply & Demand question.

Maybe lots of people are stocked with primers. Powder isn't that hard to get.

It is also possible that everyone is simply buying everything.

I with the pretty much people buying everything they can get. That is what I am doing. I have some primers. I have found all primers but regular small pistol for sale. No problem, I load the mag primers in .357 anyway. I have bought more bullets than I normally would have. I ordered 1000 .357 cases and do not need that many. But...I was going to have to wait a month to get any amount and they will probably never be cheaper for me. I have been waiting 8 weeks now for and order of bullets from Bayou. Now is the time I need to reload since we go to Fl for 3 or 4 months right after Christmas. Having too much of one component and to little of another is a way of life for me. I am trying to fix that. Heck, I cannot even get a new powder measure or the dies I want right now.

I believe the opposite. With a demand out stripping the supply, prices go up. With reloading components, that price increase is across the board, including brass and bullets. And with the panic buying we're seeing some buyers go way overboard, and pay 2, 3 or 4 times the "normal" prices. I saw a brick of small pistol primers sell for $175.00. Crazy?, yep, but he needed primers and was willing to pay...

mdi said:

I saw a brick of small pistol primers sell for $175.00. Crazy?, yep, but he needed primers and was willing to pay...

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This one always gets me...the "need" part.

I don't "need" ammo, as much as it bums me out to do it, I just stop my recreational shooting during times like this. This is the first panic where I've been a reloader and thankfully, I'm pretty well stocked up. With that said, if this drought goes on for a very long time, I'll just do what I have done in the past and stop shooting. Sucks, sure, but I don't "need" primers at 4-6 times retail price.

Another thing that always gets me...who has the $$ to drop on these outrageously priced supplies? If they had the $$ 7 months ago, plenty could be had at reasonable prices. If they didn't $30 for a case of primers then, how do they have $150+ for one now?

I'm just rambling...take it for what its worth.

Blame the panicking mindless hoarders.
When did wash your hands and stay out of crowds become hoard toilet paper and ammo?

Typetwelve said:

This one always gets me...the "need" part.

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Some people don't understand the concept of stocking components. Not necessarily 'hoarding' them, but buying enough to last you for a while, and even preventing something as simple as going to the store and seeing they don't have the .750 SuperBlaster bullets you made the trip for... things like that. Supply goes up and down even without the modifier of the crazy time we are in now.

As far as people blowing money on a $150 brick of primers... that is truly supply and demand, or maybe the shortage generating a 'need'... real or imagined. Or someone thinking they can buy them and turn around and make money off them. I've seen a pretty extreme example of that just this morning...

I shoot frequently. My sons often join me. I have known this for a very long time. I reload everything I shoot except .22 rimfire. When reloading supplies are plentiful and reasonably priced, I buy as much as I can afford. I buy enough so that I can help out friends. That is part of my planning. This is called planning ahead. It is not hoarding. The only people calling this hoarding are those that don't understand the concept of planning for your future needs and helping friends.

bikerdoc said:

Blame the panicking mindless hoarders.

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Yep! ^^^

Components and equipment are out there, and for reasonable prices if one is patient and looks often. In the last few months I have purchased 185gr coated swc ( $11 per hundred ), a Lyman Brass Smith powder measure ( $45 on sale with free shipping ), and a used but like new Lyman single stage Victory press from a guy I know locally ( $140 including a small and large primer feed tube, blast shield, and primer push rod ). I was even able to get some brass ( 38spcl, 357mag, and 480 Ruger ) for decent prices and 500 bullets for the .480 for about $90 ( 370gr bullets ain't cheap, lol! ).

Charlie98 said:

As far as people blowing money on a $150 brick of primers... that is truly supply and demand

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Yep again! ^^^

I paid $38 and $36 for bricks of primers in late 2018, simply because I was nearly out and they were all I could find. I wouldn't pay $100 or more per brick unless that was the current retail price, and even then I would have to think very long and hard about it.

So short supply and high demand = prices going up. When supply catches up to demand, or demand drops to current supply levels, then prices will stabilize. What those prices will be or when they stabilize is anybody's guess, just got to keep looking for deals and be ready when they pop up.

chris

kerreckt said:

I shoot frequently. My sons often join me. I have known this for a very long time. I reload everything I shoot except .22 rimfire. When reloading supplies are plentiful and reasonably priced, I buy as much as I can afford. I buy enough so that I can help out friends. That is part of my planning. This is called planning ahead. It is not hoarding. The only people calling this hoarding are those that don't understand the concept of planning for your future needs and helping friends.

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Did not plan ahead of time to make sure they had enough.......no different than those who wait until the roads are closed to try and evacuate from a hurricane

Some of you may recall, back after Sandyhook (I believe) that the Obama Administration started rattling it's sabres again about an AWB, or other restrictions... the kickoff into what I call the Dark Ages... when you couldn't find an AR or a box of ammos. There was also a run on magazines of any sort, but particularly AR and other 'detachable box' magazines. There was a company called Cheaper Than Dirt (CTD) right here in Fort Worth that sold... and actually advertised... used USGI aluminum magazines for $99. This caused a huge uproar on another forum I frequent... I mean... they were going BONKERS over this 'price gouging.' I dismissed it as supply and demand. $99 AR magazines didn't bother me in the slightest... because I know I would never pay that much for one; I can't be 'gouged' if I don't participate.... plain and simple. I was held to some ridicule, of course, and particularly after I made the point that if they were selling magazines at .99 (ninety-nine cents) instead of $99, people would be lining up to 'gouge' CTD out of their magazines, and likely the first person in line would buy them ALL... 'gouging' anyone else from getting a good deal on a magazine, and very likely turning around and selling them to make a profit, later. So... in my mind... it's all in how you want to look at it.

Glad some folks are finally getting there is no such thing as gouging; it is simply supply and demand free market economics at work; and there aren't special categories either, even during hurricanes, wildfires or other disasters.

I've been a shooter and dedicated reloader for close to 40 years.
I have always stocked up when I had the cash reserve and the opportunity.
I'm sitting pretty good now.....
Might be a lesson for you young guys?

Last summer reloading supplies were at 4 year low as far as prices were concerned. Winchester even had a big rebate on primers, and most suppliers were running big sales. THAT was the time to buy, and buy BIG..... I bought 11k primers and jugs of powder, projectiles by the thousands. We old timers went through these droughts before, and soon realized that you " Make hay while the sun shines" Hopefully, next shortage you will be prepared.

AK Hunter said:

Shouldn't the price on projectiles drop because of the lack of the other components to build ammo?

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The price of projectiles not dropping is a pretty good indicator that supply is still short and demand is still long, regardless of other components' status. Supply and demand are still with us and going strong.

Just glanced at Target Sports USA. I bought Speer Gold Dots when they were $.40/round; not too long ago, they went up to $.80/round; now they are $1.50/round. To those waiting for things to drop down to pre-Covid/Election panic prices, good luck and do not hold your breath.

That said, I scored some 9mm at Academy for $13.99/box and a few bricks of Winchester .22 for $25/brick; that should help hold me over. They had 100-200 boxes of 200 round count 62gr .223 green tip for $95/box (so about $.50/round)

Why do people buy primers or powder they don't even know that they can use or not? Because that's all that's left to be purchased. If neither is there then they buy something else.

AK Hunter said:

No I know everyone is out of primers & a lot of places are selling out of powder.
But if everyone is out of these components why is the prices of brass & bullets staying so high? Shouldn't the price on projectiles drop because of the lack of the other components to build ammo?
How long will it take to drop, I have been holding off to buy cheap. LOL

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It’s like the Covid toilet paper and sanitizer dilemma. It will end. Because demand will drop when all the hoarders get their fill. Normally, I stock up for 1k rounds of a pistol caliber, and 500 rounds of a rifle caliber. Powder maybe times 2 or 3 for legitimate load work-ups. Now, I have way more powder than I need and some extra LP magnum primers. I am conservative. Most people aren’t. We live in a country of excess, and this is no different. This too will pass. Now you can buy as much toilet paper as you want, and gallons of sanitizer are $10 now. A lot of that is excess manufacturing, but demand went down.

Local guy I met at Sportsman’s want $100 for 150 small pistol primers. Which means he has half of a little box. He can go get “you know what’ed”. That’s just insane. When this is over, all the hoarders will be left holding the bag. Some newer/recent hoarders will be firesaleing because their wives will make them. The old school hoarders can wait another 7-10 years to make money. I’ve learned that time IS money. I have a Glock 20 and enough to make 2k rounds. All in need is a couple clips for protection. It’s winter. I can conceal carry anything under all these clothes. My Walther PPQ SC doesn’t need bullets right now. Marlins 1894 and 1k rounds of 44. I have enough .308 to shoot all winter. Shotgun has enough for home protection although shelves are full of shotgun ammo. For functionality, I’m set and I’ll just enjoy winter while everyone freaks out over which side of the coin gets to say “I rule America”.

Just sit tight man, and enjoy what you have. Heck go buy a shotgun, a shotgun press and learn how to reload shells. No one seems to be touching that supply.

Typetwelve said:

If they didn't $30 for a case of primers then, how do they have $150+ for one now?

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This one boggles my mind also. If shooting is so important to you that you’re willing to pay $.20 per primer why didn’t you stock up when you could buy ammo for cheaper than that???

I feel sorry for competition shooters who reload. They have to shoot regularly to keep their edge. They can only stock up so much.

jmorris said:

Why do people buy primers or powder they don't even know that they can use or not? Because that's all that's left to be purchased. If neither is there then they buy something else.

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What's funny about that statement... I'm still using powders that I picked up during the Dark Ages because I was running low on Unique... and was at the mercy of, in one case, what the guy was pulling out of the delivery box: TiteGroup, which I hate, but I still have 1+ # of it. Waste not, what not... it's going in 9mm's. Two other powders I used up... RedDot, which works well enough, and IMR4227, which I initially didn't like... until I used it in heavy .41MAG carbine loads. I did... in between Dark Ages I and II, pick up some 8#ers of things like Unique, IMR4227, and some others... but not TiteGroup.

I truly think much of this is due to the influx of new shooters. Im not dismissing the guys who are buying for the "in case" or guys buying to flip for a profit.

It all trickles down. New gun owners, we saw a huge influx, they buy ammo, ammo goes dry, new shooter looks into loading, buys reloading gear, it goes dry

I'm fond on THR members, but we aren't the only people in the country savvy enough to learn how to read a scale and use a set of calipers.

I'm still shooting powder and primers from the last panic...and I wasn't the original retail purchaser. I got them for very good deals over the last year and a half or so. You can't eat powder and primers, and they don't pay the mortgage. Some will over extend, and have serious buyers remorse later. In the last panic, I had to buy a few odds and ends at inflated retail prices, do a little horse trading...some niche components and 100 of a specific hunting bullet, but my bread and butter was secure. The THR hive mind has seen this coming since Feb or sooner. Personally I won't have to change my shooting schedule for at least a year given current inventory. Sadly, the lack of organized matches helped with that this year, sitting on significant inventory of match ammo yet. I'll likely be able to stock some here and there, and dip into my "random stuff" collection for plinking and to experiment with some new loads. Just ridin' the storm out here!

Right now it's working out in my favor. Traded 100 rounds of .38 Special for a $150 automotive repair this weekend!

Random 8 said:

I'm still shooting powder and primers from the last panic...and I wasn't the original retail purchaser. I got them for very good deals over the last year and a half or so. You can't eat powder and primers, and they don't pay the mortgage. Some will over extend, and have serious buyers remorse later. In the last panic, I had to buy a few odds and ends at inflated retail prices, do a little horse trading...some niche components and 100 of a specific hunting bullet, but my bread and butter was secure. The THR hive mind has seen this coming since Feb or sooner. Personally I won't have to change my shooting schedule for at least a year given current inventory. Sadly, the lack of organized matches helped with that this year, sitting on significant inventory of match ammo yet. I'll likely be able to stock some here and there, and dip into my "random stuff" collection for plinking and to experiment with some new loads. Just ridin' the storm out here!

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We all knew 2020 was an election year and like most people who have been through this before, I started stocking up in 2019. What none of us could have seen coming was COVID and then the civil unrest that followed.

I had one co-worker that bought their first handgun (9mm) and another that built their first AR this summer. When asked about parts and ammo, I basically told them the same, ride out the storm.

I guess I'll say this, unless you are either new to the game or financially didn't have the means to stock up when the gettin' was good, I cannot understand why anyone would be buying anything now at these prices.

First off 2020 has been something else!!
No beef with those of us that are buying a lot of stuff ahead as a hedge against price increases or supply disruptions. Those that I despise are the people that wait at the store and buy all the .22 ammo or primers that don't even own a firearm who are hoping to flip it for a profit. I hope those folks die with it or sell ot for pennies on a dollar when nobody will play their game. Personally I was taught to be better than that.