Historical Non-.45 Colt SAA's

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On the other hand, Ranger George Lloyd jammed his Winchester .44 with a .45 cartridge in a battle with Comanches. He unscrewed the sideplate with the point of his knife, cleared the jam, and returned to the fight. He reportedly got a .44-40 revolver when he got back to town.
 
I was under the assumption that Billy the Kid was a carrier of the Colt Thunderer DA, I believe in my 1964 version of Sixguns by Keith calls the Kid the first DA revolver warrior, paraphrasing a bit there but you catch me drift.

Later accounts give Billy The Kid a Colt SAA. As to the promoter, I believe Luke Short was the one who made the "Birdhead Colt" sort of famous. He killed the town marshal in Ft. Worth, I believe.

Bob Wright
 
Later accounts give Billy The Kid a Colt SAA. As to the promoter, I believe Luke Short was the one who made the "Birdhead Colt" sort of famous. He killed the town marshal in Ft. Worth, I believe.

Bob Wright

Luke Short's name has come up a lot in numerous non fiction accounts that I've read over the years. Some of them claimed he was in several battles with Indians, though not all. Most to all associate him at times with Bat Masterson, Wyatt Earp et al., his years working in and then being part owner of the Long Branch in Dodge City and later troubles there. A pretty colorful character.
 
Luke Short's name has come up a lot in numerous non fiction accounts that I've read over the years. Some of them claimed he was in several battles with Indians, though not all. Most to all associate him at times with Bat Masterson, Wyatt Earp et al., his years working in and then being part owner of the Long Branch in Dodge City and later troubles there. A pretty colorful character.

As a matter of interest, one of the owners of the Long Branch was one Mrs. Wyatt Earp.

Bob Wright
 
As a matter of interest, one of the owners of the Long Branch was one Mrs. Wyatt Earp.

Bob Wright

Bob,

I'm kind of a student of the Earp's story and I've never seen any reference to that. Can you tell me where you read it or heard it? Inquiring minds what to know! (smile)

Dave
 
As a matter of interest, one of the owners of the Long Branch was one Mrs. Wyatt Earp.

Bob Wright

That I didn't know, thanks. Was it Mattie ( Common Law ) ? I knew Charlie Bassett and Chalk Beeson did at times. On a side note if you've never been try to visit Dodge City. Downtown & Old Front Street is pretty neat, admittedly a little touristy but still neat. Boot Hill Casino features numerous 1870's - 1880's original pictures of lawmen that served there, businessmen,, buffalo hunters, etc. that surround the walls that have been enlarged as well as reading info, hides, memorabilia.
 
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It says the Luke Short met both Wyatt Earp and Bat Masterson in Tombstone. Short also owned the White Elephant Saloon in Ft Worth Tx. I have been there before. Its in the old Stockyards area and is worth your time to visit if you are in the area. And he is buried in Ft Worth.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luke_Short

If you have read any of the Mike Venturino articles over the years then you know he preferred the 44WCF round in the Colt single action. I don't know why he preferred it except maybe because he own many original Winchester rifles in the caliber. In one of his stories he said he came to Tx for a deer cull hunt. He used a Winchester 73 in 44-40 for the hunt and killed 5 deer IIRC. He said every shot was a pass through and didn't see the need for more power. His longest shots were around 100 yards.
 
Didn't John Henry "Doc" Holiday carry a Thunderer?

I drove through Glenwood Canyon last year, but had no time to stop and visit his grave. Glenwood Canyon would be one hell of a place to live your final days. The place is beautiful.

I love being from KS where so much Cowboy history took place. I carried a SAA 'replica' during my little vacation out in western KS this year. Interarms Virginia Dragoon in 44 mag. Thought about going to Dodge, but it seemed too touristy, especially having seen many original cowtown bars in my travels. Including the Silver Dollar Saloon in Leadville, CO, where Mr. Holiday frequently visited during his stint in town.

I too recall the birdshead grip being a favorite of Luke Short.
 
In his book, Six years with the Texas Rangers, 1875 to 1881, James B. Gillett tells of a Ranger in a gun fight who inadvertently loaded a .45 Colt cartridge into an 1873 Winchester. He had to unscrew the side plates to clear the resulting jam -- under fire!

If I had an experience like that, I'd never carry .45 Colt cartridges and an 1873 Winchester at the same time.
 
On the other hand, Ranger George Lloyd jammed his Winchester .44 with a .45 cartridge in a battle with Comanches. He unscrewed the sideplate with the point of his knife, cleared the jam, and returned to the fight. He reportedly got a .44-40 revolver when he got back to town.

Howdy

I have been shooting 45 Colt in my pistols and 44-40 in my rifles since day one in CAS. I have never owned a rifle chambered for 45 Colt and don't care to, as it is not a historically correct chambering for a rifle. Oh, I won a Rossi Model 1892 replica years ago chambered for 45 Colt in a raffle, but I sold it before firing a shot out of it, using the money for a down payment on my Henry.

When I first started out I was using an antique Winchester Model 1892, chambered for 44-40. I was using some Ruger Vaqueros chambered for 45 Colt, simply because that was the easiest chambering to find. Over the years I graduated to my 2nd Gen Colts, chambered for 45 Colt, and my Uberti 1860 Henry replica chambered for 44-40.

All my 44-40 ammo has a black Sharpie stripe across the ace head, and goes in blue plastic boxes, all my 45 Colt ammo lacks the stripe and goes into black plastic boxes. When I go to the loading table I carry my ammo in a loading block I made up a long time ago. I always load my pistols before my rifle, so the 45 Colt ammo is inside my revolvers and won't get accidentally loaded into my rifle. This system has served me well for years, and I never made the mistake of loading a 45 Colt round into my rifle, because it will jam in the chamber and tie up the rifle. After all, I'm not in a real gunfight when I'm at the loading table, and I can take my time to make sure the correct ammo goes into each firearm.

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Except one day a few years ago at my club. I was giving a demonstration of Cowboy Action shooting, and I must have been blabbing and not paying attention because before I knew it I had loaded up my 44-40 Henry with 45 Colt ammo. It's easy to unload a Henry, there is no loading gate. You just pull the follower all the way to the front, swivel the false muzzle out of the way, and tilt the rifle so all the ammo slides out of the front of the magazine. Except I had already worked the lever. Sure enough, the 45 Colt round jammed partway into the chamber with the lever half closed. Unlike a Winchester Model 1873, which can be cleared by unscrewing one screw and removing the side plates, a Henry is different. The lever and lever screw have to be removed, the side plates have to be removed, the carrier lifter has to be removed, and the carrier has to be removed. No simple way to remove the side plates, they are dovetailed into the frame and have to be driven out with a hammer and a soft piece of wood.

So I had to drive home with my Henry with the lever stuck halfway closed and had to disassemble it at home to get the jammed 45 Colt round out.

I try to be extra vigilant these days, even more so than I used to be, so I don't put a 45 Colt into my 44-40 Henry.
 
A SASS friend got a .45 in his '73 44 WCF just as George Lloyd did.
Except that he had a screwdriver and no Commanch'.

ETA
He also once got it the other way 'round, a .44-40 in his .45 SAA.
Ptooey

Me?
.44-40 all the way, I even bought a .44-40 cylinder for the .44 Special sixgun.
 
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He also once got it the other way 'round, a .44-40 in his .45 SAA.
Ptooey

One time, years ago, after a SASS match I loaded five 44-40 cartridges into one of my 45 Colt pistols, aimed at a target, and fired.

Every shot hit the target. So much for a 44 caliber bullet rattling down the bore and not hitting anything. Of course the target was big and close, who knows, the bullet may even have tumbled on its way to the target because it probably did not engage the rifling very well.

But I did hit the target with all five shots.

Of course the cases were ruined, the case mouths belled out to fill the 45 Colt chambers.

But it was just an experiment for the fun of it.
 
Constable John Selman carried a Colt SAA in .41 Colt and on Aug 19, 1895 he used it to good effect to kill John Wesley Hardin in the Acme Saloon in ElPaso Texas
 
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