.44 Magnum Recoil

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"320grn bullet over a max load of H110" should be enough to go off of, shouldn't it ? I am no reloader, I admit.
I immediately knew what you were talking about, however, I'm familiar with that set up and have used it quite a bit. A person, even a reloader, who doesn't do much with 44, might not understand your implication. For example, if some said such and such powder with a 9mm 115 grn bullet, I might not know if that is a hot load or light load...especially without a velocity given.
 
What was your grip like? If you're not a handgun hunter who needs to practice fast follow-up shots for dangerous game, there's nothing but downside in trying to death-grip a wheelgun chambered in .44 Mag. or a .454 Casull and keep the gun as flat as possible. There's just absolutely no need for it. (Not saying that's what you were doing, but that's a surefire way to find the shooting experience unpleasant.) I keep my elbows, wrists, and hands fairly loose and let those beasts jump around and dissipate their recoil energy in controlled fashion. Not much fun otherwise.

This seems counter productive to me. If one is carrying a big bore (44 mag and up) revolver, it is most likely for dangerous game. Or perhaps hunting. In either case, you need to be able to have a follow up shot. If you're just at the range shooting paper, a 44 magnum probably isn't the right tool anyway. Drop down to a 44 sp or 38 spl.
 
SBH 7.5 with full house 240 gr sp and H110 for a 50 round session is just plain enjoyable. I personally believe that Bisley grips help in the recoil area by pushing back and not rolling back like standard grips. Just my personal opinion.
 
I have a 71/2" Redhawk! When I first got it , full house loads were stingingly sharp and the trigger guard pounded my long finger knuckled bad. Put on a pair of Pachmayr grips and never looked back. Full house loads of 300 grs LBT gc over max 2400 are stout but no knuckle busting and the recoil is not sharp.
A good pair of grip can change everything.
I can shoot all the max loads I want now but why would I. 80% of my shooting is the same bullet over 5.5 grs of WST and I shoot the hot ones just to keep in touch with them, every time I shoot ! I have crono'd the loads, 780 fps with the WST and 1350 fps with the 2400. Just so you know about the recoil I am talking about !
Weird fact I learned is that the same load in my 24" Marlin gives the same velocity for the WST but a little over 1700 fps for the 2400 load. I expected an increase for the 2400 load and the WST load. But with the same velocity for the WST load, that was a suprise:confused:
 
This seems counter productive to me. If one is carrying a big bore (44 mag and up) revolver, it is most likely for dangerous game. Or perhaps hunting. In either case, you need to be able to have a follow up shot. If you're just at the range shooting paper, a 44 magnum probably isn't the right tool anyway. Drop down to a 44 sp or 38 spl.

I'm not really sure why you think your point applies to my post. I clearly phrased my comment as applying to those who are not handgun hunters, and neither the OP nor I mentioned anything at all about carrying a big-bore revolver. Yes, if you're hunting dangerous game with a handgun, you need to train for fast, accurate follow-up shots, quite obviously. As for what's appropriate for the range, you're free to have your own preferences, but it's a little odd that you feel the need to generalize them into a rule for everyone else. For some of us, one of the "right tools" for the range is simply something that's a lot of fun to shoot, and, for a smaller subset of us, that category includes heavy-recoiling rounds from big-bore revolvers.
 
I don't enjoy "pushing the gun". To me, it's like driving 100 miles and hour in a sub compact car vs a Ferrari...one is dangerous, the other is made for it.

I owned a S&W 629 4" in 44 mag...I never like the thing. I didn't find it comfortable to shoot with any load save 44 special. The thing managed to smack the living daylights out of my inner thumb joint...it was never fun. I traded it for a 7.5" Super Redhawk and that changed the game. I've taken hand loads in that thing to listed extremes and while it stings doing that...I don't feel I'm pushing a sub compact to go 100 mph. With that said, my "house" load of a 240g SJSP over 9g of Unique is very tolerable for long shooting sessions.

I now have an 8" 460 and like someone mentioned earlier, that turns down the volume on a 44 mag real quick. I've shot an 8" 500 and three rounds in it made it crystal clear that I do not want that level of punishment. Even with the 460, the "flinch factor" is really high. I'm only good for about 20 rounds through it before my accuracy goes to poo.

Either way, it's all about 2 things; power vs weight and load type. 44 magnum is super versatile when you reload, you can accomplish darn near anything you want with it.
 
Here are some random thoughts based on decades of .44 Mag use.

Felt recoil with the 4” S&W and Redhawk is going to be greater than that with the 10” Super Redhawk, with the S&W having the most pronounced recoil. These are very different platforms and felt recoil from each will differ (maybe significantly) depending upon the individual.

Grips will make a big difference in comfort and recoil management. Individual shooters compatibility with different platforms effect felt recoil to varying degrees (some significant).

For me, the Redhawk and S&W with factory grips along with the Super Blackhawk (dragoon grip frame) are painful with heavy load, while the Super Redhawk is comfortable with the same loads.

I don’t find recoil of the relatively new S&W M69 (5 Shot L Frame .44 Mag) in either the 2 ¾” or 4 ¼” bbls objectionable. Felt recoil for me is less with the shorter barrel.

As velocity increases, so does recoil/muzzle whip and muzzle blast. In general, shorter barrels generate lower velocity, and therefore less recoil (vs longer barrels in the same gun). Reduced velocity offsets (somewhat) the lighter weight of the shorter barreled gun (although most folks probably won’t notice because of increased muzzle blast and lack of exposure).

Here’s an example of barrel length effect on muzzle velocity (and felt recoil):

Buffalo Bore, 305 LBT LFN HC rated 1,325 fps
Underwood, 305 LFNGC Plated (HiTech?) rated 1,325 fps
LabRadar muzzle velocity at 33 deg F


S&W M69 2.75" ===> BB 1,195 fps ===> Under 1,147fps
S&W M69 4.25" ===> BB 1,276 fps ===> Under 1,248 fps
Ruger SRH 7.5" ===> BB 1,395 fps ===> Under 1,315 fps

FWIW,

Paul
 
Factory Winchester 240 FP Whitebox recoil sharper then any of my reloads with 2400.
I found that as well with my 7½" Redhawk. It wears a Pachmayr Gripper, as I changed it right from the start. Even so those were downright unpleasant, not very accurate and pretty much useless. I also shot a lot of the Keith loads, (250 gr LSWC w/ 22.5 gr 2400?) which I found superb. Favorite factory load was PMC's 240 gr JHP. Don't know if they even still make that one, but it was hard hitting and accurate, and provided great brass. During reloading, I shot everything up to 305 gr loads, and destroyed a couple scopes, until I went with Burris, which has happily held up to anything and everything. My Redhawk has now sat idle for over 20 years, and is the only revolver I own. NONE of my .44 loads' recoil ever compared to my T/C Contender in .45-70 shooting a factory .300 grain Winchester or Remington, though.
 
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I've found this site here to be pretty solid:

http://www.shooterscalculator.com/recoil-calculator.php

The numbers generated by this site are pretty solid and once you factor in grip type, frame geometry, you get a pretty solid picture of felt recoil.

For example, my SRH is a chonky boy with a scope on top...weighing in at 4.45 lbs it does a very solid job of absorbing recoil. About the hardest hand smacking rounds I've made were 240g lead SWC cooking at just over 1600 fps. Those were notably hot rounds. Enough so that I didn't make them again. In my heavy SRH, the estimated recoil energy is 17.53 ft/lbs. In a 2.59 lb S&W 629 4", that same load would yield somewhere around 27 ft/lbs of energy. If you were insane enough to attempt a load like that in a 1.57 lb S&W 329PD...it would be closer to 47 ft/lbs of energy.

In comparison, my 8" 460 -w- red dot weighs in at 4.94 lbs. Pushing a 240g projectile at 2000 fps produces 33.28 ft/lbs of energy.
 
For me, the best measure of felt recoil is "recoil velocity" in the above linked calculator. Example is 12 oz S&W 360 .357 Mag (158 at 1,100) - about the most obnoxious gun I've ever shot. Recoil energy for 475 LB (420s at 1,300 fps) approx 2x that of M360 but recoil velocity of .357 approx 1.5x .475 LB - rather shoot the .475 any time.

FWIW,

Paul
 
I just picked up aTaurus Tracker 44mag 5 shot
4 inch ported barrel ... So I have been reading this thread..

I mostly purchased it to fire 44spl ... both standard and higher pressure.... Maybe a few 44mag loads .. no sledgehammers ;-)

Im gonna do some frame comparisons with it and my Model 12 & Security Six .... Taurus frame sizes are comparable to S&W .. but the Tracker frame is listed as a Compact Frame .. so im thinking between a K and L ... K.5 ;-0
 
For me, the best measure of felt recoil is "recoil velocity" in the above linked calculator. Example is 12 oz S&W 360 .357 Mag (158 at 1,100) - about the most obnoxious gun I've ever shot. Recoil energy for 475 LB (420s at 1,300 fps) approx 2x that of M360 but recoil velocity of .357 approx 1.5x .475 LB - rather shoot the .475 any time.

FWIW,

Paul

Light, snappy guns are something I really do not like. I know the .357 J-Frame is known to be the worst of the worst...and I've never shot one myself. I have shot 14.3oz 38 spcl and I know it's snappy as well.

It's been some time, but memory tells me the most miserable firearm I ever shot was a Kel Tec PF9 with some hot 9mm rounds. The thing literally hurt my hand for a few days after shooting it. Funny enough, my Charter Pitbull, another 9mm, really sucks as well. Smacks the snot out of my trigger finger. Every person who has shot it makes the same comment...smacks the bottom side of your trigger finger raw.
 
I have an original model blackhawk in .44mag that I've never warmed up to. That thing jams the back of the trigger guard into my second finger knuckle something terrible. I can barely get through one cylinder full. .44 special isn't much better either. Something about my huge hands and the frame size of that gun don't go well together.
 
For me, the best measure of felt recoil is "recoil velocity" in the above linked calculator. Example is 12 oz S&W 360 .357 Mag (158 at 1,100) - about the most obnoxious gun I've ever shot. Recoil energy for 475 LB (420s at 1,300 fps) approx 2x that of M360 but recoil velocity of .357 approx 1.5x .475 LB - rather shoot the .475 any time.

FWIW,

Paul

I have an M&P 340 that has been relegated to .38spl wadcutters after the 3! .357s I fired from it. I have .44mags, .45 colts and a .454 casull, they are all pussycats in comparison.
In regards to OP's question, I'd like to know what grip the pistol in question had. The SRH should've just soaked up that recoil. My .44 Alaskan and 7.5" .454 are really easy shooters compared to my 5" 629.
 
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I have an original model blackhawk in .44mag that I've never warmed up to. That thing jams the back of the trigger guard into my second finger knuckle something terrible. I can barely get through one cylinder full. .44 special isn't much better either. Something about my huge hands and the frame size of that gun don't go well together.

I had the exact same problem. Get some Pachmayr grips for that thing and you can shoot as much as you want. NIGHT AND DAY difference.
 
I have an original model blackhawk in .44mag that I've never warmed up to. That thing jams the back of the trigger guard into my second finger knuckle something terrible. I can barely get through one cylinder full. .44 special isn't much better either. Something about my huge hands and the frame size of that gun don't go well together.

Have you tried curling your pinky under the grip?

I have very large hands, but my 7.5" 3-screw SBH is quite comfortable. I've been shooting SA revolvers since I was a teenager, and that's how I was taught to shoot them.
 
Yes, pinky under, as there is no room for it anywhere else! I also have an old vaquero in 45 colt which is absolutely comfortable to shoot. I'll have to look into those pachmayr grips. I know the vaquero grips are really fat at the bottom and that seems to help.

Thanks
 
For me the SRH is infinitely more comfortable with heavy loads than a 4" N-frame is with standard loads. Even my 355gr at 1350fps handloads. In the video of my water buffalo hunt, it looks like I'm shooting a PPC gun but it's a 300gr Grizzly Punch at 1450fps. People like to run them down for their looks but I love them!

SRH%2005.jpg

IMG_0075b.jpg
 
Buddies SRH had the factory rubber grip w/ wood insert panels.

That's strange, but recoil is entirely subjective. The first time I fired a .44 mag, long barreled Super Blackhawk, I was apprehensive until the trigger broke. After that I was hooked. I tend to load mild 240gr keiths for plinking, but enjoy the heavy, fast stuff as well. I cannot abide heavy recoiling rifles though. I stick with .243 and 6mm for the most part.
 
The bottom left in CraigC's picture is identical to my buddies, minus the scope and being blued.
 
@CraigC, the SRH w/ the checked target stocks... where did you find those ? I want a pair for a GP100 I'm eyeing.
 
I am not recoil sensitive. Lest you jump on me and say I'm just being macho, I'll tell you my experience.

My very first handgun when I was a youth was an old Colt New Service in .45 Colt. I later had this converted to .44 Special, and after reading a bunch for one Elmer Keith, started loading some heavy loads. The gun tore my hand up, the cylinder release gouging into my hand and creating a wound there. I made some home made oversize grips and this tamed the effect tremendously.

My next venture was with a 4 5/8" Ruger Blackhawk in .41 Magnum. This proved to be unpleasant to fire with the factory 220 gr. JSP loads. Switching to a Super Blackhawk grip frame solved my recoil problem.

When the .44 Magnum was introduced, and my funds built up to the challenge, I bought a Super Blackhawk. And, reading Jim Harvey, J.D. Jones and Keith, went to some potent handloads. The Dragoon style grip frame solved my problems in the recoil department.

Some years back my friends introduced me to the Thompson Contender, They started me on the .30-30, then through the .35 Remington, .338 Woodswalker, .444 Marlin and finally the .45-70. With the .45-70 the loads were made with 500 gr. cast bullets lubricated with Teflon tape. This was the hardest kicking gun I've ever fired but the recoil didn't bother me. What DID bother me was the Pachmyer grips on theses pistols. The rubber rubbed my hand raw until a blister formed on the web of my hand. Soured me on rubber grips, plus a couple more bad experiences with rubber grips so I never want to see or hear of them again.

My observation from this is the plow handle grip of the Single Action revolver works best for me with plain wood grips. This especially with the longer grip of the Super Blackhawk. I did have an Uberti that had a close match of the Colt 1860 grip that was mighty comfortable too.

Bob Wright
 
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