Most often "caliber war" is more accurately "clothes war"

JTQ said:

They do, but they're in the general size range. For instance, if I was choosing a Beretta PX4 full size, the .45 Auto version is bigger than the 9mm and .40 S&W versions, but all three caliber's of full size PX4's are duty size guns. While hand size may be an issue for those with smaller hands and the .45 Auto version, all three calibers would require basically the same clothing concealment considerations.

On the other hand, if you are comparing a PX4 Subcompact in 9mm (it's not available in .45 Auto) to a PX4 .45 that is only available in full size (not in Compact or Subcompact versions), that is a clothing issue because they are different sized guns, but are designed for different uses.

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Yeah.... I see what youre saying and youre right.

It really doesn't make much difference until you get down into the small .25s and .32s frames.

bikerdoc said:

Being old (72) some what disabled, and retired, and having a p/t job in a gun store my wardrobe is basically, sneakers, jeans, untucked shirt, and Hoodie if it is chilly.
full size 1911 or CZ is no problem.
In summer when it is hot here a 380 in cargo shorts fits my needs.
Wife purse caries a 357 snub year round.
As my good friend Mr T said, "pity the fool, that wants to screw with those 2 crazy old people"

He really didn't say that but it sure is cool to say he did.

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Of the 2-3 LGS I have frequented, all the people working there open carried ‘something’....

But for me, the below in no particular order..they have to satisfy all of them.
-concealability(depends on clothes/weather)
-reliability-must be 100%
-FTS-Fun To Shoot...ain’t gonna carry anything that hurts my hand to shoot it.
But yup, when clothes dictate...either a Glock 42 or Glock 48...

@FFGColorado
I own 18 handguns, none are Glocks, wish I could shoot them, but the grip angle is is not doc friendly.
Too bad cause cause, like you, the 42,43,48 and the 26 are great carry gun and popular with the other geezers I work with.

What you wear or can wear has a great deal of influence on what you carry.
I live in a warm climate (hot and humid in the summer). This impacts my carry choice.
I like pocket carry and a light weight handgun. S&W 442 & LCP2.
When hiking in cooler temperatures this changes my choice to include OWB S&W 686+ 3" & Taurus 415 41mag. I may also need to defend myself against wildlife.
While living in Wisconsin and Illinois the climate allowed heavier clothing and more layers. I would add IWB XDM 45acp compact.

So the cartridge choice is more based on handgun size that fits our clothing.

I think it's more than that, mostly convenience in general. Which, I don't care why anyone chooses what they choose. However, there are folks that make compromises but do their best to convince themselves and others that they're not compromises at all. I know when I strap on my Ruger LC9 that I'm making compromises for concealability. Some people can't admit that.

Yes and no. For me the #1 factor is how it shoots, and small, light guns (that fit in the clothes I tend to wear) don't shoot heavy calibers as well as I prefer.

So, sure, yeah I guess instead of a Glock 19 I'd probably prefer a Glock 21 but apart from hoodies and heavy button up shirts that doesn't work ideally. I get awful hot easy, so I prefer to carry and shoot something I can conceal all year round instead of swapping winter/summer.

The other big factor for me is weight. I would probably still carry my VBob in .45 if my back hadn't decided that 43 oz loaded is too much to daily carry if I don't want lots of back pain.

Caliber wars when honestly discussed, which is rare, come down to 3 things.

Diameter of wound = bigger is better
Speed of projectile = faster is better
Speed/accuracy of follow up shots = faster/more accurate is better


Caliber was are all about the priority of those three things.

Frame size of the person is a factor, so are the cloths in choosing a weapon for CCW. A hoody, for example, in the summer in the sunbelt is odd and uncomfortable. It is not always practical to layer up to hide a CCW weapon. And, not everybody has a large body with sumptuous folds and generous lumps and flaps to tuck things into. A fellow with 240 pounds on him might have ample real-estate on his waist and the drape of his/her shirt or top over the belly might easily cover IWB or OWB carry of a large pistol/revolver. But we little people, at 5-11 and 160 pounds, 30 inch waist, there is no place for me to carry a large pistol in warm season attire that it would not be printing through my shirt or look obvious and out of place. So yes, for me, the clothing and my frame size affect the frame size of the weapon I can carry concealed, especially in the summer.

When in cycling or running/workout attire, I can often use a fanny type pack. I sort of like the fanny pack for those uses as I can swing the pack to my hip and have my hand on my LCR .357 without brandishing the weapon and if need be fire it from inside the pack (or pocket). But to carry in warm season street cloths, shorts, jeans, t-shirts, whatever, I need to size down to my S&W Body Guard .380. If on my motorcycle then I have a tank bag to keep the weapon in and off the bike a summer mesh (armored) jacket so I can generally accommodate my Glock19.

DeepSouth said:

Caliber wars when honestly discussed, which is rare, come down to 3 things.

Diameter of wound = bigger is better
Speed of projectile = faster is better
Speed/accuracy of follow up shots = faster/more accurate is better


Caliber was are all about the priority of those three things.

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Well said.

Clothing doesn't have to dictate the choice of cartridge.

Just a pair of examples (that most of you know about) of giving up capacity and shootability to have a large bore cartridge in a small package.

Downsizer - single shot
View attachment 977824

Double Tap - double shot https://www.gunblast.com/DoubleTap.htm
View attachment 977826

Not all hoodie wears are criminals but the majority of criminals wear hoodies.
I avoid them like the plague but that said, I carry what will get the job done depending on where I am heading. If it prints, such is life.

340PD said:

Not all hoodie wears are criminals but the majority of criminals wear hoodies.
I avoid them like the plague but that said, I carry what will get the job done depending on where I am heading. If it prints, such is life.

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Lol, maybe in the city. Out here a hoodie with a vest is pretty much standard late fall/early winter/early spring uniform. That and a battered old carhardt jacket is all ya see in the feed store.

Surprise.

Not everyone on this forum in the phase of life where they get to dictate clothing choices and travel destinations.

Yes- Pretty easy to carry what ever gun you want when retired and your daily routine consists of Walmart, LGS and the range.

Not so easy when you work in a professional business casual environment, have appointments with the kids pediatrician, going to a nice restaurant with the wife.

.455_Hunter said:

Surprise.

Not everyone on this forum in the phase of life where they get to dictate clothing choices and travel destinations.

Yes- Pretty easy to carry what ever gun you want when retired and your daily routine consists of Walmart, LGS and the range.

Not so easy when you work in a professional business casual environment, have appointments with the kids pediatrician, going to a nice restaurant with the wife.

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Sure it is, single clip tuckable holster for work, leave it in the car at the appointment, and back on tucked in under a nice shirt for dinner.

If the clip is an issue, get the j hook, or put one of them belt cell phone holsters on that spot on your belt. Easy peasy.

Did it for years before I became Mr Dad, and will do so again in a few years when I start working again.

JR24 said:

Sure it is, single clip tuckable holster for work, leave it in the car at the appointment, and back on tucked in under a nice shirt for dinner.

If the clip is an issue, get the j hook, or put one of them belt cell phone holsters on that spot on your belt. Easy peasy.

Did it for years before I became Mr Dad, and will do so again in a few years when I start working again.

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If that works for you- great. Such a system does not work for me.

.455_Hunter said:

If that works for you- great. Such a system does not work for me.

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Fair enough.

.455_Hunter said:

If that works for you- great. Such a system does not work for me.

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I guess for the sake of this discussion, the obvious question is, why? Concealment? Comfort?

Have you attempted it? I know I was dubious about tuckable holsters until I tried them and determined that with a bit of blousing (which I do anyway for comfort) it's easier to conceal under a tucked dress shirt with a proper holster. I've fooled my wife a number of times after church when wearing a slim fitting shirt and she's shocked to see my pistol as I'm changing.

Comfort, of course can be an issue, but often times comfort comes from trying for a while and not just giving up after a day.

Of course all this I'm sure you know, but in terms of this thread I'm wondering if its just your clothing choices and therefore part of this whole thread.

Clothes can certainly play into it. Different jobs and lifestyles, not to mention different places in life -the young 20something who needs to dress fashionably to impress the ladies vs the older gent who really doesn’t need to impress anyone and will dress exactly how he prefers, for instance- can certainly affect the choice of CCW piece or method. There’s also the influence of controllability, economics, etc. before you get to the good old argument about how much, really and truly, does the size of the hole actually matter.

.455_Hunter said:

Surprise.

Not everyone on this forum in the phase of life where they get to dictate clothing choices and travel destinations.

Yes- Pretty easy to carry what ever gun you want when retired and your daily routine consists of Walmart, LGS and the range.

Not so easy when you work in a professional business casual environment, have appointments with the kids pediatrician, going to a nice restaurant with the wife.

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I can, and have carried a commander 1911 in every one of the situations you describe although in today's environment when out with my wife it is a Sig M11a1. Lot's of bad people out at night.

I just want one of those lavender bags, as shown ion the OP’s video clip, for my Remington TAC-14 or micro-carbine. (The latter is more of a thought exercise, at this point in time.) Nobody would think that I have a firearm, in there. (Texas law is quite long-gun-friendly, to the degree that I believe that it still makes sense to have a minimum-sized/collapsible/foldable long gun, for the places that licensed carry of handguns is not allowed, but “firearms” are not prohibited.)

I have reached the age at which I really don’t care whether folks approve of my clothing or “accessories.”

CDW4ME said:

I live in FL, wear shorts and shirt, Glock 23 + spare mag everyday including 2 mile dog walks and 5 mile casual bicycle rides.

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Some people have the real estate to tuck a large weapon away or wear baggy clothing, many do not. I do not have any dad jeans and those cargo shorts with the strings on them are not my style. Where you go for a 2 mile dog walk, I may go for a 12 mile run. Where you go for a 5 mile casual bicycle ride I may do 50 hard and fast. The clothing optimal for your needs is not the same as is optimal for my needs and for my regular clothing I do not like baggy and oversized clothing. Everyone is different and that is why we have choices thankfully, but for me, carrying a large pistol would be a difficult proposition. But we are an open carry state and when I do need or want a large weapon, I may just open carry it.

Given that a Shield 45 is nearly identical in size to a Shield 9, and the 1911 can be had in several cartridges, I don't buy that clothing has anything to do with caliber wars.