Philosophy of extra magazines

I primarily view the extra mag for my concealed carry gun as being part of an administrative reload post-event.

Lots of literature and opinion from experts on the best practice.
Make your own decision. Based on your abilities, lifestyle, and S/D needs.

.455_Hunter said:

I primarily view the extra mag for my concealed carry gun as being part of an administrative reload post-event.

Click to expand...

Valid reason that I'd not given sufficient thought to; the attacker(s) friends, relatives might show up before the police.

See Post #3 and call it good. There is no correct number.

GEM said:

So much of the same discussion. If you carry a semi auto on your belt, it take little effort to carry an extra mag on your other side. The one mugger, economically motivated modal attacker isn't what ALWAYS happens. A more intensive situation can happen, your gun can malfunction. If you engage in competition or training, you see malfunctions do occur.

I had a reliable G19 fail in a high end event, surprise.

The statistical argument is silly as if you really go by that, you need NO ammo as more DGUs are deterrent.

We will do this again.

Click to expand...

Is that so bad? Rehashing the same questions and points are human nature.

All your points (as well those of others) are well made and provide valuable perspective, regardless if you’ve said them before a month or a year ago.

But new members come along, and regulars don’t follow every discussion, so repeated questions, data points, and other info on an Internet gun forum is clearly par for the course. And sometimes, old info is presented in a new way that helps folks “get it’ where they may have missed it earlier.

This board would be a ghost town if nothing was repeated and members only searched for stuff already discussed.

I had a similar discussion with an active duty O-6 last week. He asked us to review a leadership video. After watching it, I told him it was a spin off from the Hershey Blanchard Situational Leadership model from the 90’s. He remarked it was interesting that this information was 30 years old and resurfacing. I laughed and told him there were no leadership lessons being taught today that could not be found in the Bible. That kinda floored him.
https://www.leadershipgeeks.com/bible-verses-about-leadership/

Reinforcing good information is a positive thing to me.

Just my $0.02. YMMV

I've always felt at least 1 reload is necessary whether it is a spare mag or a speedloader/stripper clip, the only time I've ever used either one is while practicing at our range but in my younger years I was taught to be prepared.

Craig_VA said:

In more than one video and classroom talk, John Correia has made two points on this topic:
1. He has never seen, in tens of thousands of videos, a non-LEO self defense situation a defender need to reload during the exchange.

Click to expand...

Yah, this one gets quoted a lot for some reason. I, however, have seen situations where non-LEOs (okay, so most of them were in fact criminals involved in criminal activity) experienced malfunctions with the pistol they were using, and probably wished for more rounds on tap, and would have been able to clear the malfunction had they had a spare mag (and presumably, some training and practice)... and one bad-guy on bad-guy shooting where Bad Guy #1 took 40 shots (from a Glock 19 -- how many times did he have to reload, students?) to kill Bad Guy #2 sitting in his car at an AM/PM Mini-Mart.

As is often noted, it's not the odds, it's the stakes. I carry two spare mags if I'm packing a single-stack, at least one spare if I've got on a double-stack. I care little these days what others do.

Everything else that needs to be said about this issue has been said pretty well by others.

Honestly, I'd carry two spare mags if I had a good way to do it. The only really comfortable I've found to carry spares is the Safariland 123 Horizontal Mag Pouch, and there's no way I could get two of 'em on the available space on my belt (especially considering that anywhere from 9-3 o'clock is either occupied or inaccessible when you're seated, and very uncomfortable while driving). I need to lose a bit more weight before vertical mag carry will be feasible for me.

rdmercer said:

WSo why is the 8+1 argument even an issue when comparing the two platforms? To me it is easier to conceal the thin 1911 Commander style 45 with an mag in the pocket than it is to carry a the fatter G19 with a spare 15 rnd in the pocket.

Click to expand...

OK, let's deal with amount of ammunition as this is what a lot of people think when this subject comes up.

I don't care what one carries or what the capacity of the chosen firearm is. Having an extra magazine for at least a single reload just makes sense for a few reasons. First, of course, there's the issue of extra ammunition. Then there's the issue of potential mechanical problems with your firearm which may be resolved by a change of magazine. Probably a few other things people can come up with.

While the amount of ammunition one has IS important, it's not as important as simply having ammunition in the first place. More MAY be better, but there are important tradeoffs to be considered in which capacity is only one factor. Size, weight, capacity, grip, concealability, personal likes/dislikes, and more are all factors which require some sort of balance for each individual. Make your choice and deal with it.

I have several handguns. I choose to carry my full size Colt 1991A1, which has a 7 round magazine capacity and gives me a total of 15 rounds with my spare magazine. If I carried my Beretta 92FS, then a spare magazine would give me 31 rounds total. However, I cannot as easily carry my Beretta concealed like I can my Colt. (And I don't like the safety on the Beretta in a concealed carry.) This is my choice, which seems to best suit me, and I've made adjustments accordingly. I do not feel the need to carry 3 or 4 spare magazines in order to meet/exceed the carry ammunition a single spare would give me for my Beretta. (Which would affect concealability a bit if I tried.)

So don't be hung up on amount of ammunition as the primary concern at all times...because it isn't always, even for people who fool themselves into thinking it's so.


NOW...about that spare "mag in the pocket" thing you mentioned. I really don't advise this for a couple reasons.

One is that most people who do so are simply pocketing a spare magazine with no protection. This means the magazine is subject to contamination with lint, dirt, and whatever else may end up in your pocket with your magazine. Not good. Also, not carrying a spare magazine in a pouch designed for it may result in that top round being "displaced" a bit, which at the least may interfere with reloading efforts.

The second reason is if you choose to pocket carry a spare magazine and DO use a pouch of some kind, then there's the issue of the extra bit of "fumbling around" trying to extract the magazine from an unsecured pouch.


MINIMUM NUMBER PER GUN:

I put this in here even though the OP centers around carry and I want to discuss the actual minimum number of magazines I have for each firearm.

I have a different philosophy when it comes to the minimum number of magazines I will obtain for each of my firearms in general. The reason is purely out of convenience: namely, I like to spend more time shooting at the range and less time loading magazines between shooting events. Plus I dislike partial boxes of ammunition while loading. My 1991A1, mentioned above, has a 7 round magazine. I have a minimum of 7 magazines for it, because I can load one full box of ammunition (49, plus one round in the chamber) when I set up for range shooting. My M&P-15 has four 30 round magazines, because the ammo boxes come with 20 rounds each and four magazines is six full boxes of ammunition.

The idea behind high capacity magazines is you spend less time reloading if you get into a high round gunfight.

High capacity magazines are for those planning to miss a lot. --Bruce Nelson

Mechanical things break, ****e happens. I believe in the old saying "Two is One, One is None". Doesn't matter the round count, an extra mag is a must, things just go wrong in life, especially when you need them the most.

Kevin Rohrer said:

High capacity magazines are for those planning to miss a lot. --Bruce Nelson

Click to expand...

That's why I use standard capacity magazines in my AR and my sidearms.

The thing people seem to gloss over a bit is the difficulty of conducting the reload with various platforms. The slowest is obviously the revolver, at the slowest end, individual rounds, at the fastest (but still comparatively slow) moon clips. The difficulty of conducting these movements under life or death stress is of course going to be high as well. A single stack gun (of whatever caliber), is going to be faster than a revolver, and require less dexterity to load. However all things being equal indexing a single stage mag is less sure under life or death stress than a double stack mag (the magwell is smaller). A double staack has the advantage in requiring less (but still enough to fail) dexterity to reload than the other platforms. I was a full time instructor for my agency (large metro agency), and watched plenty of cops screw up reloads on a full size service pistol with a double stack mag and just simple time pressure. I also watched retired cops shoot their LEOSA quals with wheels guns and have slick reloads.

In short more rounds in the gun mean less need to reload. A double stack is easier to reload than other platforms. What you will train the most with, is what you be the most proficient with regardless of the other factors.

GEM said:

We will do this again.

Click to expand...

There will always be those new to this--and this specific question. So, it will be revisited.
There will be those for whom the question had not yet gelled, too. So, it will be revisited.

We each come to where we are by different routes, each of those paths are as unique as we are.

Also, it's good that we each re-examine the things we find to be fundamental, too. We humans get into ruts, and will blindly follow them out of habit, unless we stop and examine them. They can be perfectly adequate ruts, but, you can't know unless you look around.

Now, yes, there is the all-too-human absurdity in believing there is a one "best" way for everything, too. Which is redoubled for topics where our knowledge is scant or limited. So, it takes experience to know that "What is the best gun?" is much like "What is the best car?" And that such questions are like "What is the best house?"

Which is further complicated by the fact that we, with experience and knowledge, are stuck with only "It depends" for an answer. And some of "us" are uncomfortable giving a non-answer to a serious question. Which can give rise to fuddlore and the like.

So, there is importance in these questions, no matter how repetitive (if occasionally pointless). Opinions and experience change.

Zactly so. Carry is personal, but Mr. Murphy always gets a slot in the conversation...
Even tho' done ta death, it still applies...
Two is one, one is none...
Some of us just can't carry a double stack anything. It's remarkable what a slim person can carry if it's not wider than they are.

Eh I use to be pretty stuck on high capacity whenever choosing a firearm but I shoot revolvers best, that means I usually just go with whatever fits my mood. Therevis an advantage to a higher capacity lighter recoiling gun but that hardley changes the fact that you should shoot what you use best.

With semi autos I carry a spare mag in case of a malfunction though. I dont need 30-50 rounds on me, to each thier own though

Usually carry two if I can swing it in my outfit, one if I can't. Prefer on the belt but in the pocket (neomag, snagmag) if necessary.

Just balances the gun better with mags on the offside, plus an option for reload or malfunction is good too.

CDW4ME said:

The correct (official) magazine philosophy for a 1911 or a Glock 19/23/32 (holds at least 10 rounds)
Glock + one extra magazine in a mag pouch
1911 + two extra magazines in mag pouch, not a pocket, and two helps balance weight.
View attachment 975231

Click to expand...

Yep.

Sometimes I tossed a third in the pocket too, because it's just so easy to do that with 1911 mags. Tucking the gun on dress clothes I'd go with two in the back pocket, again because it's easy and conceals well, flat enough to sit on comfortably. Can't do that with double stack mags as easy though.

John Joseph said:

I walk my dog in my pants. How he gets in my pants, I have no idea.

Click to expand...

You owe an apology to Groucho Marx. It goes :
"One morning I shot an elephant in my pajamas....."

As a soon to retire (1990) officer/firearms instructor, newly appointed officers routinely asked why I continued to carry my model 19 as departmental issue had switched to semi autos. Policy gave us the choice as long as we could meet qualification standards. My response, “I won’t need to reload unless there are seven suspects.”

Just tell them when the 1911 came out, your other alternatives were 6 rounds in a circle...

My philosophy is to simply carry an extra mag.

And I train as such.

Waveski said:

You owe an apology to Groucho Marx. It goes :
"One morning I shot an elephant in my pajamas....."

Click to expand...

Artistic license, pal

Like almost every “What do you carry for SD and why” discussion we all get into, the primaries never change.

One should carry a reliable gun in an adequate caliber, load it with reliable and effective ammo for the chosen task, carry it in a comfortable and secure holster, and have sufficient spare ammo with you for at least one full reload or mag change.

Once one has chosen the above, I believe it is imperative to seek out training to help you become more proficient with your chosen firearm, more confident in your abilities, more knowledgeable in the laws and more comfortable with the many responsibilities that come with EDC of a firearm.

The specific details are up to us as individuals to fill in as we see fit and can afford.

Now there are times I carry a Glock 34 with 18 on board, other times I may have an LCP .380 with 7, so I am not one to ever say “Thou shalt not carry X” by any means... but I can say that after 30 years in LE I have never, ever interviewed an officer, deputy, homeowner or motorist who fired a gun in self defense and heard them say, “I wish I had less ammo on me” when it was all over.

Just my simple opinions added to the pile, they’re not worth anymore than anyone else’s.

Stay safe.

I think the main reason would be with one magazine in the gun the Glock will have 10-17 rounds…the 1911 6-8. Also I would bet that greater than 95% of gun owners that carry do not carry a spare magazine…so this goes back to either 17 rounds or 8. Yep everyone here carries a spare…