New Sig P365 in .380. Why??

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Mosin77 said:
I agree .380s don’t sell as well, usually. But that’s typically because most gun buyers are men, and most men are easily fixated on the perceived lethality of their chosen caliber.
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There is the myth and there is the very different reality. For the most recent five years for which information is available (2015-2019), ATF manufacturing reports show more pistols were made in .380 than the total of pistols in all calibers larger than 9mm. In three of those five years, more pistols were made in .380 than the total of revolvers in all calibers (including .22). And who noticed that more .380 pistols were made than 9mm pistols in 2010?
 
gc70 said:
There is the myth and there is the very different reality. For the most recent five years for which information is available (2015-2019), ATF manufacturing reports show more pistols were made in .380 than the total of pistols in all calibers larger than 9mm. In three of those five years, more pistols were made in .380 than the total of revolvers in all calibers (including .22). And who noticed that more .380 pistols were made than 9mm pistols in 2010?
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I think the distinction here is probably “guns for which multiple calibers are offered.”

Everyone praises an LCP for what it is: an amazing feat of engineering that gives you a payload of 7 .380acp rounds in a package roughly the size of your cellphone. In that context nobody is too inclined to pooh-pooh the 380 and they sell like hotcakes to just about everyone. Along with all the other quite small CCW type guns aiming for the same idea.

But the .380 does get more than its fair share of dubious, sidelong glances when it’s offered in the same gun as a 9mm or 45. Almost everyone, seemingly, would choose more power and snappier recoil. And I completely agree that I don’t find the 9mm P365 *bad* in the recoil department. In fact, it’s remarkably good. I’d rather shoot a P365 than a full sized SP2022 or Glock 17. Must be the way it fits my hand? Which makes me even more excited for how it might perform in .380. With the right load to achieve good penetration and expansion, it could, very possibly, be a better self defense gun than the 9mm. But at the cost of pushing the limits of what .380 is capable of, and therefore being one of those “bucks a shot” type guns. You pay for performance I guess!
 
mjsdwash said:
Its not me, its biology. Some people have arthritis. I carry a Keltec P11, which kicks much harder. .380 is not a wimpy cal, no matter how brainwashed the internet consuming public wants it to be. A lighter caliber for a given weight, and lock time will always be more accurate in a stressful time. Hearing damage from a .380 will be somewhat less than 9mm.
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I had to downsize from .45 ACP to 9mm because arthritis in my wrists made it difficult to shoot more than a handful of rounds without sharp discomfort (which obviously affects accuracy).
Even then, it can be uncomfortable shooting my compact Kahr CW9.
Getting old can suck.
 
Okay...first I didn't read all the posts in this thread from my last. So if I repeat something don't tell me "xyz said that".

I've carried a 380 since 1974. I've been a police firearms instructor since 1976.

I used to be enthralled with magic bullets. For the past 20 years I've carried fmj in my 380. Super reliability. Great (not excessive) penetration.

I sold my Beretta 84 as it was the same size as my S&W 6906. Sorry I did.

A 380 in a 9mm size pistol makes sense IMO.
 
Paul7 said:
See link in post #44
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Shows nothing in terms of comparing .380 and 9mm.

Paul7 said:
Bunk, it tells us a .380 in this instance was completely effective in stopping a crime, and by a 71 year old against two armed thugs.
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"In this instance" is the operative phrase. No reasonable person would draw any conclusions about effectiveness from viewing one or a few incidents.
 
Paul7 said:
Bunk, it tells us a .380 in this instance was completely effective in stopping a crime, and by a 71 year old against two armed thugs.
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All it really says is that a handgun fired at criminals stopped the crime - made them run away. The handgun could have been any caliber - there's no indication that the thugs stopped to measure the caliber and only after that did they flee.
 
Paul7 said:
See link in post #44.



Bunk, it tells us a .380 in this instance was completely effective in stopping a crime, and by a 71 year old against two armed thugs.
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Again, he failed to stop the threat... and just merely chased it away.

None of his hits had any stopping effect.

He was extremely lucky he had a cap-gun... and they were cowardly vermin.


​

He should be dead.




GR
 
fxvr5 said:
All it really says is that a handgun fired at criminals stopped the crime - made them run away. The handgun could have been any caliber - there's no indication that the thugs stopped to measure the caliber and only after that did they flee.
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Which is my point, they may be criminals, but they aren't stupid, and aren't going to stop and analyze which caliber bullet is whizzing by their head. Isn't stopping the crime the whole point? Kill someone and you've got a potential life-changing legal problem on your hands.
 
Kleanbore said:
Shows nothing in terms of comparing .380 and 9mm.
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It sure does, are you incapable of reading a simple chart?

.380 ACP

# of people shot - 85
# of hits - 150
% of hits that were fatal - 29%
Average number of rounds until incapacitation - 1.76
% of people who were not incapacitated - 16%
One-shot-stop % - 44%
Accuracy (head and torso hits) - 76%
% actually incapacitated by one shot (torso or head hit) - 62%

9mm Luger

# of people shot - 456
# of hits - 1121
% of hits that were fatal - 24%
Average number of rounds until incapacitation - 2.45
% of people who were not incapacitated - 13%
One-shot-stop % - 34%
Accuracy (head and torso hits) - 74%
% actually incapacitated by one shot (torso or head hit) - 47%

So tell me why 9mm is vastly superior to .380?

"In this instance" is the operative phrase. No reasonable person would draw any conclusions about effectiveness from viewing one or a few incidents.
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Huh? In the real world that counts as evidence.
 
Paul7 said:
Which is my point, they may be criminals, but they aren't stupid, and aren't going to stop and analyze which caliber bullet is whizzing by their head. Isn't stopping the crime the whole point? Kill someone and you've got a potential life-changing legal problem on your hands.
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I agree with your point, but I don’t care if the bad guy dies... that was his choice.
 
Paul7 said:
Which is my point, they may be criminals, but they aren't stupid, and aren't going to stop and analyze which caliber bullet is whizzing by their head. Isn't stopping the crime the whole point? Kill someone and you've got a potential life-changing legal problem on your hands.
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Being killed by armed assailants - is also a life-changing event.

Keep your cap-gun.

Good luck.




GR
 
Garandimal said:
Your funeral - will prevent that.
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Except you haven't shown any evidence that a .380 will result in my funeral.

This is a stopping round...





​

GR
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Wow, you really think three rounds center mass from a .380 (about the same power as a .38 Special) wouldn't have stopped that crime? Do you even know what caliber she was using?
 
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