Need a good load for a friend's Garand

Here are a couple sources. CMP forum is personal data but compare with any load manual that uses the same components. The other is from "Handloader Magazine".

http://forums.thecmp.org/showthread...a 150,charge weight is what pushes the op rod.

https://www.handloadermagazine.com/m1-garand-handloads.

I use H4895 or Varget in my Garand. With these powders, about any load safe for 30-06 is safe in the Garand. Stick with 150-165 grain bullets for duplicating M2 loads.

FYI, Port pressure is the achilles heal of the Garand. If the powder is too slow, the port pressure will be too high and you will risk damaging the Op Rod. The newer slower powders that are used in 30-06 hunting loads generate too much port pressure which is the reason you can get pressure relief devices for the gas cylinder (Schuster and McCann).

Older Hornady 150 FMJ data listed the recommended overall length at 3.260-3.262" which puts the cannelure out in front of the case mouth. Later manuals list oal at 3.185" which places the cannelure at the case mouth if you want to crimp. I've loaded them at both lengths with no noticeable difference in accuracy or feeding. I use LC, RP, and Win brass with RP 9 1/2 primers. I'd recommend not loading below 46 grains of IMR 4895 and not going higher than 48 grains. My load is 47.5 grs. of IMR4895 and shoots well in 3 M1's.

47 grains of either H or IMR4895 under a 150-168 grain bullet loaded as long as will fit in the magazine and feed properly (usually about 3.25”) will almost always be a good load in a Garand. IME. I ignore cannelure and don’t crimp.

What 1K said... I’ve been loading 47grn IMR4895 under a 150 for almost 30 years, and 46grn under a 168grn just recently.

I have an 8 lb, unopened jug of M2.
Ya got any SPPs?

For my M1 Garand I load a 150gr FMJ bullet over a charge of 46.4gr H4895 with an OAL of 3.185" .

For target work I use a 168gr match bullet over 46.4gr H4895 with an OAL of 3.240" .

I use a Win WLR primer with both but a CCI primer will work just as well. You can use IMR4895 instead of H4895 if that's all you have.

M1key said:

I have a lot of 150gn Hornady FMJ-BT bullets

and H414, IMR 4895, Varget, IMR 4831, etc powders

None of my manuals have data equivalent to M2 ball.

Suggestions from owners?

M

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One suggestion is to positively not use H414. It's too slow and could damage the op rod.

The 9th edition of the Hornady manual has loads for the M1 Garand including for 150 to 155 grain bullets. Of the powders you have here are suggested loads.

Varget: 42.3 grains start and 46.2 grains maximum.

Loads are also given for H335, Accurate 2495, Accurate 2520, Vihtavuori N-135 and H4895 but you didn't say you had those.

M1key said:

I have a lot of 150gn Hornady FMJ-BT bullets

and H414, IMR 4895, Varget, IMR 4831, etc powders

None of my manuals have data equivalent to M2 ball.

Suggestions from owners?

M

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Zero reason to stick to "M2 ball" loads. Unless you are just busting cans and rocks and recreational shooting. Most accuracy will come from 168/175gr match bullets.

Pick a powder between 3031 and varget/H380 and any bullet weight from 110-220 and have at it.

414 is definitely too slow for the rifle.

The hornady garand data is junk...throw it in the trash...Hodgdons is much better....

I have loaded a few buckets full of 30-06 for my Garand with IMR 4895, some IMR 4064, and a little W 748. An excellent source of Garand load data is Hornady's manual, "M1 Garand" data section. A lot of my loads were 150 gr A-Max with 43.2 gr - 46.4 gr H4895...

When I first got my Garand I was searching for data and a couple texts I found on owning/care/reloading for the M1 pointed me here. I reduced these loads by about 2 .0 grains as they seemed a bit on the heavy side. I got some very accurate loads. http://web.archive.org/web/20000620055732/home.att.net/~Masterpo/M1load.htm

mdi said:

I have loaded a few buckets full of 30-06 for my Garand with IMR 44895, some IMR 4064, and a little W 748. An excellent source of Garand load data is Hornady's manual, "M1 Garand" data section. A lot of my loads were 150 gr A-Max with 43.2 gr - 46.4 gr H4895...

When I first got my Garand I was searching for data and a couple texts I found on owning/care/reloading for the M1 pointed me here. I reduced these loads by about 2 .0 grains as they seemed a bit on the heavy side. I got some very accurate loads. http://web.archive.org/web/20000620055732/home.att.net/~Masterpo/M1load.htm

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Its a horrible source. You CANNOT duplicate milsurp loads with it.

Jeremy2171 said:

Its a horrible source. You CANNOT duplicate milsurp loads with it.

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I wouldn’t say horrible but it is very conservative. Probably not a bad thing for most new Garand owners but actual military match loads for example were loaded hotter than hornady’s max.

1KPerDay said:

I wouldn’t say horrible but it is very conservative. Probably not a bad thing for most new Garand owners but actual military match loads for example were loaded hotter than hornady’s max.

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I'll stick with horrible... load data that won't even duplicate milsurp ammo is worthless.

Jeremy2171 said:

Its a horrible source. You CANNOT duplicate milsurp loads with it.

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What source are you talking about? The Hornady manual or the NRA/Master Po data? Everything I've ever read about Garand data is using a powder close to IMR4895 keeping the velocity around 2750 fps with a 147 gr. FMJ is the equivalent of military M2 ammo. I shot a bucket load of those "worthless" handloads...

mdi said:

What source are you talking about? The Hornady manual or the NRA/Master Po data? Everything I've ever read about Garand data is using a powder close to IMR4895 keeping the velocity around 2750 fps with a 147 gr. FMJ is the equivalent of military M2 ammo. I shot a bucket load of those "worthless" handloads...

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Hornady garand data is a horrible source. Unless you like training wheels.

Master Po, NRA, Clarkes, Hodgdon all have the right load info. Hornady has lawyers...


Here is what you need to know when loading for the garand...
Pick a powder between 3031 and varget/H380 and any bullet weight from 110-220 and have at it.

For the record lots of people talk about MV as an absolute and to not go more than 2700 or 2750fps etc.

at the Muzzle specs...
M1906- 2700fps
M1 Ball- ~2700fps
M2 Ball- 2805fps
M2 AP- 2775fps

If your chrony is at 12-15ft (most common) subtract ~10fps.

HOWEVER Milspec testing requires velocities to be measured at 78ft. So from muzzle to 78ft subtract ~50-60fps.

On top of that you have a +/- of 30fps.

So for those reloading to the "numbers" that is something for you to consider.

Don’t load anything faster than 3031 or slower than 4895. 4320 and 4064 are in that range. There are lots of other powders available nowdays that weren’t available in the M-1 days and any of them that fall into that burn speed range will do nicely. This leaves out the 4350s and ball powders in the 414 and 760 and slower burn speeds. Same thing holds true in the M-1A. One can get an adjustable gas block and close it off and shoot slow powder loads single shot without issue, but.........

Jeremy2171 said:

I'll stick with horrible... load data that won't even duplicate milsurp ammo is worthless.

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Jeremy2171 said:

Hornady garand data is a horrible source. Unless you like training wheels.

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There is nothing wrong with a load that cycles an M1 Garand action and provides reasonable accuracy. I take issue with your insistence that just because it does not duplicate MilSurp velocity, there is something wrong with it. Hornady data is a fine source of starting data... your desire to work it up is up to you.

Pivot Dr said:

Don’t load anything faster than 3031 or slower than 4895. 4320 and 4064 are in that range.

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Not true, either. Both IMR4320 and IMR 4064 are slower than IMR 4895. IMR4064 is a reasonable powder for heaver (168-175grn) bullets in the Garand, it's true, but it's slower than IMR4895.

My main ammunition for my M1 Garands, and I have several, is with 150 grain bullets and H4895. It matches the M2 velocity well. I can substitute IMR4895 at a slightly different powder charge with the same good results.

Charlie98 said:

There is nothing wrong with a load that cycles an M1 Garand action and provides reasonable accuracy. I take issue with your insistence that just because it does not duplicate MilSurp velocity, there is something wrong with it. Hornady data is a fine source of starting data... your desire to work it up is up to you.



Not true, either. Both IMR4320 and IMR 4064 are slower than IMR 4895. IMR4064 is a reasonable powder for heaver (168-175grn) bullets in the Garand, it's true, but it's slower than IMR4895.

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True enough, my error, but ever so slightly slower, all three are very close to one another in almost every application. What you can do with one you can pretty much do with the other with a few minute differences given individual rifles and bullets, in my experience. The big jump is going to the 4350 range, pressure curve not optimal for M-1 or M-1As.

Jeremy2171 said:

Hornady garand data is a horrible source. Unless you like training wheels.

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Well having been reloading for over 4 decades, quite successfully and safely, not pushing my Garand loads isn't using training wheels, it's just being smart...

I use the mildest loads I can that will cycle the rifle , seems to do just fine . Very accurate and very easy on the rifle . The Garand is not a rifle that needs jazzed up loads to shoot well .

I like 47.0 grains of IMR4895 with bullets in the 150-170 range.
Shoots great! No reason to beat up the chassis for a few more FPS

I use IMR4895

Here's the old NRA info...

you may need to click on it to make it bigger

https://i.imgur.com/PXxLwZw.jpg

The above loads are what I started with, same as Master Po's site. I use slightly lower charges, maybe 3/4 or 1/2 grain lighter and get very good accuracy. Never bent an OP Rod either...