Deer hunting with an air rifle

Bell killed elephants with the 6.5x 54 Mannlicher-Schoenaur. And during the Depression, my Grandfather killed deer with the 22LR because that’s what he had.

Doesn’t make any of them ethical or good choices.

Shot placement is everything. A century ago a Native American woman who lived in brown bear country took down one with a 22 LR. She knew the bears anatomy because she had processed beats for their fur and meat. The bear charged her. As the bear got close she move to the side get a shot at the side of the bear’s head. She new the skull was very thin on the side. One 22 LR bullet from a rifle killed the bear. I read the story some years ago on the web. It had a picture of her holding her rifle next to the dead bear. Yes, shot placement is everything, but some understanding of anatomy of a potential adversary tells you where to aim for.

DocRock said:

Bell killed elephants with the 6.5x 54 Mannlicher-Schoenaur. And during the Depression, my Grandfather killed deer with the 22LR because that’s what he had.

Doesn’t make any of them ethical or good choices.

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Just my opinion, but I would think any of the above would be just as likely to provide a clean, humane kill, or possibly even more likely than with a Broadhead arrow.
Not that there is anything wrong with bow hunting. I think my point is that an ethical humane kill is the responsibility of the hunter, not the weapon the hunter uses.

And a .357 PCP air rifle is a very capable rifle. In fact I am looking at a few right now.
I don't plan on hunting deer with one, but if it became necessary to feed my family, I would not be afraid to use it for that.

jmohme said:

Just my opinion, but I would think any of the above would be just as likely to provide a clean, humane kill, or possibly even more likely than with a Broadhead arrow.
Not that there is anything wrong with bow hunting. I think my point is that an ethical humane kill is the responsibility of the hunter, not the weapon the hunter uses.

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Who chooses the weapon?

DocRock said:

Who chooses the weapon?

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I just hope that the chooser of the weapon is not infatuated with YouTube where bad advice prevails, and unless a person is knowledgeable they can believe a lot of nonsense. As for me, if I did hunt big game it would be 30-06. The M1 left a lasting impression on me.

I was into the PCP big bores back around 2000. Had some of them imported from Korea when I was there. Neat and strong for an airgun but those were still about the power of a 45acp. Strong for an airgun but one must know the limits of things. I'm fine with people hunting with them IF they recognize that. Wasn't for me though, didn't like the fill tanks, etc as I enjoy and air gun for its simplicity.

DocRock said:

Who chooses the weapon?

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Of course the hunter does, but the choice of weapons is only one of several factors in moving towards then end result.

Ive got a .357 bulldog ive taken 2 pigs and a sheep with it.
Its tuned for a 147gr bullet at 930-880fp over 3 shots, i can keep all three shots in an inch at 50yds.
Id have no issue hunting deer with it, ive killed more than a few axis deer with a .22lr, and this trumps that by a long shot.

You should see my recent "9mm deer load" post in reloading. A lot of people did not like that idea, even though I stated the gun was a 9mm smg that shoots stupid hot 9mm, a 124gr bullet @1,570 +/-10 fps. Basically a 357mag with a 6 or 8 inch barrel depending on the powder and load. And groups between 1 and 2 inchs at 50 yards.
And to most people that "wasn't enough".

Yeah there's hog hunt vids on the y tube where guys shoot roughly 1oz 458 and 50 cal bullets straight through hogs with air rifles that use 3,000 psi paint ball tanks.
Kills them as dead as any firearm.
Main disadvantage appears to be you have to be close to get a good shot, because of the subsonic natural of air rifles and the lower BC of the bullets.
I didn't see any with hunts a 357/9mm air rifle.

hossfly said:

I watched a YouTube video of a guy repeatedly taking deer successfully with a 357 caliber air rifle with the ballistics of a 38 special.

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In my state he'd get cited, and his air rifle would be impounded.

LD

hossfly said:

..., He is careful and successful. Sticks to perfect broadside. ..., In any event if you know your tool and stay within it's limits you're golden

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Well, no we really don't know that, based on his videos. Even if you personally know the guy, you'd have to religiously follow him into the field for every hunt, then then you could only say, from date X to date Y, I went with him every time and he was "successful". Because he's unlikely to ever show a botched shot where the animal got away and wasn't found until after many hours of tracking, and it was still alive, in pain, and had to be dispatched. It's human nature to not show a failure.

As for knowing your tool and being golden, well I'd say that's too broad a statement. Minimum bow draw weights and minimum cartridge power level are normally set because below those minimums, at some point, you have too much room for error. The "limits" are an arbitrary judgement by the individual. You yourself wrote that you would not call a .38 a deer cartridge. Neither would I, as I would say it is too limited to be used for sporting purposes vs. deer. That doesn't mean it can't be made to work, but outside of an emergency situation, like starvation, I'd say something more powerful should be chosen.

As for judging, well if this fellow kept his exploits to himself, then he'd be free of judgement, but..., since he chooses to put this activity out in public, he then impacts you and me and all people who harvest deer, as we are all subject to laws which are made by people who do not harvest deer. So YES the hunting community could say to him, at least, "Stop putting that out in public!". .., as negative opinions of that impact you and me and others. I don't, for example, transport my deer uncovered to my house or if I choose, to the meat cutter. It's only a few miles either way, but where I live it is not the norm to display one's kill. I've been in other parts of the country, and at the and of deer season there were bucks dangling from trees in the front yards all over the neighborhoods. That's not the case where I live now. There is such a thing as "liberal creep"... well I call it commie creep. The states where the closet commies live get so bad they move into red states, but continue to vote blue..., and then things go bad where they now are, and the cycle repeats. 50 years ago my state was red....,

LD

hossfly said:

I watched a YouTube video of a guy repeatedly taking deer successfully with a 357 caliber air rifle with the ballistics of a 38 special. I honestly would tell anyone a 38 is not enough to be deer hunting with but that guy would make a liar out of me

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I had no clue anyone was doing that, thanks for the heads up . I will have to take a look, always interesting to see how other folks hunt deer .

Loyalist Dave said:

In my state he'd get cited, and his air rifle would be impounded.

LD

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Yep, and while it may work, this method as well as a .22lr would be a last resort for survival. I have more respect for the game I hunt than to risk this kind of thing as an experiment.

If he is killing them humanely the experiment is obviously working .

Lewis and Clark used them way back in the 18th century. Many game animals were hunted to extinction using the primitive flint and percussion guns of the same century. Would seem to me it’s the person on the trigger doing the killing that’s the decisive factor.

Tennessee made air rifles, 35 caliber and larger, legal for deer, elk, and bear back in 2018. I have hunted deer back in Ohio with a 410 slug gun and though it has more energy at the muzzle than all but the most powerful air rifles I suspect these large caliber air gun will carry that energy down range much better. 410 slugs are not very aerodynamic.

I have taken whitetails in my state by every legal means except atlatl. I think its too late for me to try atlatl with shoulder issues. If Illinois makes air rifles legal, i will try one.

jmohme said:

Just my opinion, but I would think any of the above would be just as likely to provide a clean, humane kill, or possibly even more likely than with a Broadhead arrow.
Not that there is anything wrong with bow hunting. I think my point is that an ethical humane kill is the responsibility of the hunter, not the weapon the hunter uses.

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Bow hunters will continue to poke sticks through deer but will suddenly chastise a guy for using what they consider "isnt the best option". The irony.

Put it down humanely and I don't care what you use.

whughett said:

Lewis and Clark used them way back in the 18th century. Many game animals were hunted to extinction using the primitive flint and percussion guns of the same century. Would seem to me it’s the person on the trigger doing the killing that’s the decisive factor.

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Well said, sir.

Dale Alan said:

If he is killing them humanely the experiment is obviously working .

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And that you don't know cause it's "You Tube". Were there some fails before he got it right?