New AR shooters at the range, malfunctions and pools of lube

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daniel craig

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So over the course of time I’ve been working at this range I have noticed lots of new AR shooters. I’m one of the guys who clears the rifles as the person enters our store and I’ve noticed a lot of people keep their ARs soaking wet. I’ve also noticed that most of those people are the same people that have malfunctions on our range. Many of those malfunctions appear to be from a larger amount of fouling in the bolt carrier group and and associated parts (once fouling is cleaned out the problem doesn’t exist).

In my experience with the AR platform I’ve seen this happen quite a few times. I’ve also had best results with nearly bone dry or very very very minimally lubed rifle.
Does anyone else shoot theirs basically dry?


Edit: in this case/s the mags were pinned because of the state I live on so seating isn’t likely to be an issue.

Edit 2: I removed the BCGs and they were literally gunned up with fouling. The ammo was good quality too.
Both these have lead me to the conclusion that the gummed up rifle was either never cleaned or lubed too much and got a lot of fouling in it.
 
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Nope, run them wet.

I'm guessing most of what you saw is operator error/ignorance of how the firearm operates. Running an AR wet won't cause malfunctions, but doesn't mean one doesn't have to do any maintenance, but running them wet will by my experience prolong maintenance periods.
 
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I don't like them literally dripping wet, but I tend to run them with more lube than any other firearm I have. I find they are easier to clean up if run wet, and after the first few rounds most of the extra lube blows off anyhow.

-Jeff
 
I think there are a bunch of how-to videos on YouTube advising AR's to be generously lubricated. In my experience with mine, I kept them fairly well lubricated until they were broken in - a strategy that requires frequent cleaning to make it work (which maybe the videos don't tie in) - and after broken in minimal lube. So, I think the AR noobs' problems arise not so much from excess lubrication but from not knowing the tie-ins to cleaning and to breaking in. Just my opinion, FWIW (probably not much).
 
Speaking of this, I went shooting ARs last week with my ol' shootin' buddy who came to town.

He keeps his guns nearly dry, including his AR. I keep my AR wet, but not dripping out of the gun. Like the machines I work on, I hate seeing premature wear due to lack of lube, and since I don't shoot in sandy or cold environments, my guns get lube.

I can tell you, neither of our ARs malfunctioned and neither of them left puddles at the range. Not using crap magazines or testing newly added mods pretty much assured our ARs would run well.
 
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In my experience with people: excessive lube is a result of not thinking (or knowing) about what you're lubing. If your mental model of the gun is a black box, you slobber oil at it; if you know how it works and what interfaces need lubrication, you lube those interfaces with a tenth as much lube.

Also, it seems that if you overlube an AR, it solves that by energetically aerosolizing the excess out the port in the first few shots; I'm surprised to hear about excess lube staying around long enough to cause a problem.
 
WestKentucky said:
Dry. When I assemble I lube everything for the first run but after that it’s a very quick squirt with remoil following a wipe down. The wiping gets the crud off including excess lube, and the remoil keeps things minimally lubed and it seems to work.

I know people hate remoil, but it’s a far cry better than wd40.
Click to expand...

I like Remoil for getting into small places that pivot, like triggers, hammers, and the like. I don't like using Remoil in places that get cartridge gas hot as it seems to evaporate away in a short amount of time.
 
Like the others said, run them wet.

Larry Vickers has probably seen more carbine issues than most, and here's his guidance/opinion:

Far and away the most common problem I see when instructing is lack of proper lubrication. This goes for civilians, LE, and military. Of the groups I train on a regular basis, military Spec Ops definitely understands the importance of lube the most, but it is still common to find weapons not lubricated properly. And what I mean by properly is having lube in/on the working parts of the weapon.

Many weapon systems will not tolerate lack of lubrication and continue to function for any length of time. The US military M16/M4 family and M9 pistol are prime examples of two weapons that do not work well or for long without lubricant. Another example is tightly fitted custom or semi custom 1911 pistols. Simply put, these weapons and others REQUIRE lubricant to function reliably –- no way around it.
Click to expand...

https://www.vickerstactical.com/weapon-lubrication.html

 
Fairly new to the AR platform. Wasn't a particular fan. Still not. Kinda a throw away gun imho. I get the whole modular-customization appeal to some. Just not my thing. Anyway, my unpopular opinion aside, I started out running my PSA wet. Gunked up quick and was difficult to open the bolt at points. Anyway, cleaned it all up and VERY lightly lubed a couple of what seemed to me to be high friction points. Decided to see how long would run without cleaning. 600 rds so far and runs better that it did wet. Haven't relubed anything since cleaning. No failures. I generally run my firearms wet to reduce wear but at some point you just are creating abrasive paste. Or so it seems. Have always read how great AR's are IF KEPT CLEAN. Hasn't been my experience so far with this particular 5.56. Wish I could afford the ammo extortion prices to see how long it will go uncleaned. With my wallet and these prices I'm guessing I have 10 yrs before a FTF. :(
 
I store with a light coat of CLP, add more on the BCG to shoot, and run wet in warm weather. In cold weather, light coat of light lube. Wipe carbon off ASAP after.

I suspect your range rats that are having trouble with running them wet are forgetting the second part of Larry's video; CLEAN THEM! If you do not do so after running them wet, you will have malfunctions.
 
daniel craig said:
So over the course of time I’ve been working at this range I have noticed lots of new AR shooters. I’m one of the guys who clears the rifles as the person enters our store and I’ve noticed a lot of people keep their ARs soaking wet. I’ve also noticed that most of those people are the same people that have malfunctions on our range. Many of those malfunctions appear to be from a larger amount of fouling in the bolt carrier group and and associated parts (once fouling is cleaned out the problem doesn’t exist).

In my experience with the AR platform I’ve seen this happen quite a few times. I’ve also had best results with nearly bone dry or very very very minimally lubed rifle.
Does anyone else shoot theirs basically dry?
Click to expand...
google filthy 14.
last i heard it was over 60,000 rounds without cleaning, just squirting it wet. it probably saw 500 rounds per day, as it was a loaner rifle in Pat Roger's carbine classes, so you can be assured it got driven like a rental car. fouling in the BCG is sort of self regulating. it will build up, but if it builds up too much, the gas will blow it away.

it's more likely the case that malfunctions were the result of sketchy ammo people are shooting during the panic. much of it is underpowered. if you shoot the cheap stuff and combine that with other issues like building the rifle yourself and not aligning the gas port properly, or having magazines with cheap springs, or excessive dirt, then sure, things can combine to cause issues.

edwardware said:
In my experience with people: excessive lube is a result of not thinking (or knowing) about what you're lubing. If your mental model of the gun is a black box, you slobber oil at it; if you know how it works and what interfaces need lubrication, you lube those interfaces with a tenth as much lube.
Click to expand...
i believe the more likely reason is that for the past 20 years, the popular itinerant trainers like the late Pat Rogers, held classes every week that demonstrated to everyone present that dry guns malfunction, and you can fix it by adding any sort of liquid, to include vagisil. the old myth/1980s thinking has been put to rest and the popular forums like ar15.com and m4carbine.net are pretty outspoken about keeping them wet.
 
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