Home made 38 special shot shells!

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LNK

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Today, I decided to make shot shells for my revolvers. We have recently had a chicken hatch a clutch of guineas, her second clutch, and we found many gone in the morning. There are holes into the coop and we suspected rats. We moved the momma and her remaining keets into a more secure space. We have 6 separate coops and I need to be able to dispatch a critter without shaking the whole place. Thus a shotgun is out. I have some 22 shot shells, but the payload doesn't get it done, as I found out with our first victim.

So I got out the 38 Lee loader and sized/primed a dozen cases. I used two grains of bullseye, then an over powder wad I punched out of some heavy card stock. Filled the case with #7-1/2 bird shot from some dove loads I have, put an over shot wad over the shot, and crimped. Took a couple outside to pattern from about 15 feet. About all the pellets in a basketball size group. They penetrated the double wall corrugated Target, but not the single wall corrugated behind it. Will post how they do when we get our next volunteer. Hopefully tonight.

Anyone have any better ideas on on how to make them? I thought about using my 38/357 molds and filling with shot and then filling molds with bees wax to make a frangible projectile. Maybe hot melt glue. Open to ideas or suggestions.
 
That's a good idea. Jus' thinkin', but did you ever consider using .357 Mag. brass for a slightly bigger payload? They would still easily fit in the cylinder.

I'm thinking I might sacrifice a #8 shotshell and give that a try.
 
DocRock said:
That’s the way to do it. #9 shot would deliver more shot for the ranges at which revolver shot shells are effective, but if 7.5 is what you have got, it’ll do. 15 feet is about maximum effective range for a revolver shot shell and if that’s your likely shooting range, 7.5 may even be a better choice.
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15 feet is about the longest shot I would even take. I am hoping it is enough velocity to take out the rat, without being too powerful. I will definitely report my findings. Yes, 7.5 shot is the smallest I have, so it will have to do. Around here, shot shells are unobtainium.

Thanks for the input.
 
Laphroaig said:
That's a good idea. Jus' thinkin', but did you ever consider using .357 Mag. brass for a slightly bigger payload? They would still easily fit in the cylinder.

I'm thinking I might sacrifice a #8 shotshell and give that a try.
Click to expand...

I did consider it, but wanted them to be able to be used in the 38 special revolvers too. My wife likes the lighter J and K frame revolvers more than the GP100/L frame size. If I find I am not getting enough payload on victim, I may make some up.
 
LNK said:
I did consider it, but wanted them to be able to be used in the 38 special revolvers too. My wife likes the lighter J and K frame revolvers more than the GP100/L frame size. If I find I am not getting enough payload on victim, I may make some up.
Click to expand...

I was thinking .357 brass without a bullet would easily fit into a .38 chamber.
 
Laphroaig said:
I was thinking .357 brass without a bullet would easily fit into a .38 chamber.
Click to expand...
:eek: :what:FWIW, If you can slip a .357 Mag case into the chamber of your .38 Spec you have a problem. The case length of the .357 Mag is deliberately longer than the chamber of a .38 Spec just to prevent that from happening. The Max length of a .38 Spec chamber is 1.1630" and the Min case length for a .357 Mag is 1.270" ( 1.290 max minus 0.020 ) according to SAAMI specs from the SAAMI Z299.3 – 2015 published standard. Some of the older .38 cal revolvers (using heeled bullets) have longer full bore chambers, but they are even weaker than a .38 Special.
 
merlynski said:
:eek: :what:FWIW, If you can slip a .357 Mag case into the chamber of your .38 Spec you have a problem. The case length of the .357 Mag is deliberately longer than the chamber of a .38 Spec just to prevent that from happening. The Max length of a .38 Spec chamber is 1.1630" and the Min case length for a .357 Mag is 1.270" ( 1.290 max minus 0.020 ) according to SAAMI specs from the SAAMI Z299.3 – 2015 published standard. Some of the older .38 cal revolvers (using heeled bullets) have longer full bore chambers, but they are even weaker than a .38 Special.
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Both cartridges headspace on the rim. And you seem to be using some strange numbers for case length. 38 Spl is 1.155” (and COAL is 1.55”) while for 357 Mag, case length is 1.29”. So, a 357 case, without bullet, should indeed chamber in a 38 special.
 
DocRock said:
And you seem to be using some strange numbers for case length. 38 Spl is 1.155” (and COAL is 1.55”) while for 357 Mag, case length is 1.29”.
Click to expand...
merlynski said:
The Max length of a .38 Spec chamber is 1.1630" and the Min case length for a .357 Mag is 1.270" ( 1.290 max minus 0.020 ) according to SAAMI specs from the SAAMI Z299.3 – 2015 published standard.
Click to expand...
The quoted spec for the CHAMBER length of the .38Spec is correct as is the MINIMUM case length for the .357Mag.
So, a 357 case, without bullet, should indeed chamber in a 38 special.
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The presence of a bullet is immaterial. At the 1.1630" point, the .38Special CHAMBER begins to taper in and a case longer than that will not chamber whether there's a bullet or not. A MINIMUM length .357Mag case (empty--no bullet) is 1.270" long and therefore it will not chamber in a .38Special chamber that is the proper length. That is, in fact, exactly what the designers of the .357Mag intended.
 
JohnKSa said:
At the 1.1630" point, the .38Special CHAMBER begins to taper in and a case longer than that will not chamber whether there's a bullet or not.
Click to expand...
That's exactly right - at least for the two .38 Special revolvers I just tried to chamber a full-length resized .357 Magnum case in. The .38 Special cylinders look plenty long enough (by about a quarter of an inch) to chamber a .357 Mag case without the bullet, but when I tried it, the case came up against a pretty solid stop about an eighth of an inch shy of being all the way in the cylinder.:thumbup:
 
As posted. .38 Spl chambers are shorter than .357 Mag chambers. They intentionally made the .357 Mag chamber longer to keep people from accidentally shooting the very high pressure .357 Mag rounds in a low pressure round 38 Spl revolver. Some .38 Spl revolvers won't come close to handling the pressure.

There is no need for volume of the longer .357 case, the .38 Spl case holds plenty of powder/shot for little critters up close.

Y'all be careful out there. :)
 
JohnKSa said:
The quoted spec for the CHAMBER length of the .38Spec is correct as is the MINIMUM case length for the .357Mag.The presence of a bullet is immaterial. At the 1.1630" point, the .38Special CHAMBER begins to taper in and a case longer than that will not chamber whether there's a bullet or not. A MINIMUM length .357Mag case (empty--no bullet) is 1.270" long and therefore it will not chamber in a .38Special chamber that is the proper length. That is, in fact, exactly what the designers of the .357Mag intended.
Click to expand...

Not hard of hearing or reading just yet, so the caps lock is a bit shouty, innit.

Happily, the matter is resolved by @.308 Norma trying it and showing us the 357 case even sized to close on an overshot card won’t fit. Tant pis. The extra capacity would have been nice.
 
Not hard of hearing or reading just yet, so the caps lock is a bit shouty, innit.
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No offense intended. Everything kinda hinged on differentiating between chamber length, case length, minimum length, etc. and there was already some confusion in that area. Figured it would be good to emphasize the critical words.
The extra capacity would have been nice.
Click to expand...
Which brings up an interesting point.

While the .357Mag case is 0.135" longer than the .38Special case, the actual increase in powder capacity is not nearly as significant as one might expect because the max COAL for the two cartridges is only 0.04" different.

If you think about it, it makes sense. As Walkalong points out the longer case wasn't for more powder capacity--there was already more than enough room for powder--it was lengthened as a safety measure.
 
I have loaded Speer plastic cases for such things for years. #8, 71/2 or a mix of shot over the recommended load that comes with the capsules. I bush hogged for many years wearing a 357 or a 44 mag revolver loaded with shot shells and killed thousands of rats. Litterley grew up doing this on the farm every summer from the age of 12 until my 40's.
 
Yup, I have been loading 38 cases the last few weeks for carpenter bees and was going to try a 357 case, but it won’t fully chamber in my Smith 67. The wife said to just trim it down a little and it should fit. :) I had to explain it to her why I was and will be using 38 cases only in it. Then she had the bright idea of using the 357 with 357 brass. I informed her all the 357 brass is already loaded.
 
bullseye308 said:
Yup, I have been loading 38 cases the last few weeks for carpenter bees and was going to try a 357 case, but it won’t fully chamber in my Smith 67. The wife said to just trim it down a little and it should fit. :) I had to explain it to her why I was and will be using 38 cases only in it. Then she had the bright idea of using the 357 with 357 brass. I informed her all the 357 brass is already loaded.
Click to expand...
Tell me more about your carpenter bee load. I thought about them and I am pretty sure the "bug-a-salt" isn't powerful enough for them. What do you load, cream of wheat?

Also, an update, the rats were a little shy last night so no shot opportunities happened. I will update once I get a chance to terminate another one. We also make sure there is no food available anymore once we put up the birds. Maybe they will seek a different restaurant.
 
Now I know that this reply is outside of the OP's topic!

Have you thought about a pellet rifle or pistol ??
 
Bronco72 said:
Now I know that this reply is outside of the OP's topic!

Have you thought about a pellet rifle or pistol ??
Click to expand...
I am the OP, and nothing concerning rat elimination is off topic. I do have pellet rifles and pistols, the problem is the rats don't sit still long enough for me to be quite accurate enough with the single projectile. A pattern, though small, helps me tremendously. Also, single projectiles also focus all the energy on one point, and as I am shooting in a metal walled building, I don't want to make holes. Those are the two main reasons for the low powered shot shells. Thanks for the suggestion.
 
LNK said:
Tell me more about your carpenter bee load. I thought about them and I am pretty sure the "bug-a-salt" isn't powerful enough for them. What do you load, cream of wheat?

Also, an update, the rats were a little shy last night so no shot opportunities happened. I will update once I get a chance to terminate another one. We also make sure there is no food available anymore once we put up the birds. Maybe they will seek a different restaurant.
Click to expand...
I use Good ole Rice (uncooked please) for sparrows in the barn, and would be confident with rice on Bees etc...FWIW
 
LNK said:
Tell me more about your carpenter bee load. I thought about them and I am pretty sure the "bug-a-salt" isn't powerful enough for them. What do you load, cream of wheat?

Also, an update, the rats were a little shy last night so no shot opportunities happened. I will update once I get a chance to terminate another one. We also make sure there is no food available anymore once we put up the birds. Maybe they will seek a different restaurant.
Click to expand...

https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/carpenter-bee-shells.887643/
New updates posting shortly. :)
 
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