Last S&W HE 1st Model

NIGHTLORD40K said:

I should think it would add some interest to some collectors, but the overall condition will matter more.

Also, having the last example of a small, and relatively unknown, production run is not nearly as significant as the last of an iconic and massively produced model.

The very last H&R Reising, while still collectible, wont generate as much excitement as the very last H&R Garand, for example.

Neat guns, though!

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Driftwood Johnson said:

Howdy

I am a collector. I have two of the revolvers in question. I can tell you that the very last one made, if all the blue is gone, would not impart any extra value to me. I would much rather have one in good condition, not necessarily the last one made,

I found this one in a local shop probably about 15 years ago. Not much blue left on this one. Sorry, I don't remember what I paid for it. But because this model is so unique I was happy to buy it. This one shipped in 1898. SN 36XX. As mentioned, the knob at the front of the extractor rod was pulled forward to swing open the cylinder.

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I bought this one at an auction probably about three years ago. It shipped in 1899. SN 17XX. Yes, S&W sometimes shipped out of serial number order. This one is immaculate. I paid $800 for it a few years ago. Notice how the frame profile near the hammer is almost vertical. That is the easy way to spot one of these from a distance. That part of the frame is slanted on all the I frames, including the later 32 Hand Ejectors that followed this model.

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There is nothing 'relatively unknown' about this model. As has been stated, The S&W Model of 1896 was the first revolver with a swing out cylinder that S&W made. They were playing catch up to Colt, who marketed their first double action revolver with a swing out cylinder in 1889.

I have always felt that S&W rushed this one to market because the lock up system is a throw back to the much earlier Tip Up models. Here is a photo showing the cylinder stop protruding down from the top strap.

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This photo shows the Model of 1896 together with a much older Tip Up revolver. The hammer on both of these models had a rounded cam on top of the hammer.

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The cylinder stop was held down by a split spring mounted under the stop itself.

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The cam on top of the hammer would raise the rear of the cylinder stop as the hammer was cocked. This lifted the business end of the cylinder stop out of the locking slots on the cylinder, allowing the cylinder to rotate. When the hammer fell, the wedge shape at the front of the cam would force the two halves of the split spring apart. This allowed the stop to remain in the locking slots as the hammer fell, keeping the cylinder in battery. A very simple system. I have never seen a Target model, so I do not know what the target sights looked like. The standard model had the rear sight integral with the cylinder stop. It was positioned directly over the pivot point so it hardly moved when the hammer was cocked.

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It should also be noted that the Model of 1896 ushered in the 32 S&W Long cartridge. This model was the first revolver chambered for the 32 S&W Long cartridge. It also fired the 32 Colt New Police cartridge which was dimensionally identical to the 32 S&W Long. In this photo, 32 S&W Long on the left, 32 Colt New Police cartridges on the right. The only difference between the two cartridges was the Colt cartridge had a flat nose and weighed a couple of grains less than the S&W cartridge.

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The S&W Model of 1896 was a very interesting revolver. Any collector would be happy to own one, no matter if it was the first one made or the last one, unless the condition of the first or last one made was spectacular.




It was not until 1899 when S&W released the 38 Military and Police 1st Model (Model of 1899 Army Navy Revolver) that S&W put the cylinder bolt back under the cylinder where it has been ever since. This model was the predecessor to every double action revolver S&W made from that day to today.

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orpington said:

I wouldn’t pay anything extra for it. It’s just a gee, whiz factor. Condition is more important than it being the very last one. Now, if I was offered this last one and another one of this same revolver, in the same condition, with generic non extraordinary serial number at the same price and could only pick one, I would pick the last one just because of this gee, whiz factor.

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WestKentucky said:

You do realize that this model is what essentially set S&W on its path for all modern revolvers, which became the hand ejectors of all types which is what every single manufacturer has copied extensively. I don’t think it gets any more well known, or mass produced than being the thing that an entire industry copied. That said, the very last would likely have been assembled from parts discarded for defect or being tight on tolerances. I would not want it as a shooter, but as a collectible it would be a neat gun. Being last would bright a light premium, maybe an extra 25% give or take.

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NIGHTLORD40K said:

Didnt mean to dissuade you or be a downer, its still a rare and cool addition to any collection, I just dont think being the last adds that much to the collector dollar value on that particular gun.

I could be wrong, its been know to happen once, lol.

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Driftwood Johnson said:

Howdy

I am a collector. I have two of the revolvers in question. I can tell you that the very last one made, if all the blue is gone, would not impart any extra value to me. I would much rather have one in good condition, not necessarily the last one made,

I found this one in a local shop probably about 15 years ago. Not much blue left on this one. Sorry, I don't remember what I paid for it. But because this model is so unique I was happy to buy it. This one shipped in 1898. SN 36XX. As mentioned, the knob at the front of the extractor rod was pulled forward to swing open the cylinder.

View attachment 1013946




I bought this one at an auction probably about three years ago. It shipped in 1899. SN 17XX. Yes, S&W sometimes shipped out of serial number order. This one is immaculate. I paid $800 for it a few years ago. Notice how the frame profile near the hammer is almost vertical. That is the easy way to spot one of these from a distance. That part of the frame is slanted on all the I frames, including the later 32 Hand Ejectors that followed this model.

View attachment 1013947






There is nothing 'relatively unknown' about this model. As has been stated, The S&W Model of 1896 was the first revolver with a swing out cylinder that S&W made. They were playing catch up to Colt, who marketed their first double action revolver with a swing out cylinder in 1889.

I have always felt that S&W rushed this one to market because the lock up system is a throw back to the much earlier Tip Up models. Here is a photo showing the cylinder stop protruding down from the top strap.

View attachment 1013948




This photo shows the Model of 1896 together with a much older Tip Up revolver. The hammer on both of these models had a rounded cam on top of the hammer.

View attachment 1013949




The cylinder stop was held down by a split spring mounted under the stop itself.

View attachment 1013950




The cam on top of the hammer would raise the rear of the cylinder stop as the hammer was cocked. This lifted the business end of the cylinder stop out of the locking slots on the cylinder, allowing the cylinder to rotate. When the hammer fell, the wedge shape at the front of the cam would force the two halves of the split spring apart. This allowed the stop to remain in the locking slots as the hammer fell, keeping the cylinder in battery. A very simple system. I have never seen a Target model, so I do not know what the target sights looked like. The standard model had the rear sight integral with the cylinder stop. It was positioned directly over the pivot point so it hardly moved when the hammer was cocked.

View attachment 1013951




It should also be noted that the Model of 1896 ushered in the 32 S&W Long cartridge. This model was the first revolver chambered for the 32 S&W Long cartridge. It also fired the 32 Colt New Police cartridge which was dimensionally identical to the 32 S&W Long. In this photo, 32 S&W Long on the left, 32 Colt New Police cartridges on the right. The only difference between the two cartridges was the Colt cartridge had a flat nose and weighed a couple of grains less than the S&W cartridge.

View attachment 1013952




The S&W Model of 1896 was a very interesting revolver. Any collector would be happy to own one, no matter if it was the first one made or the last one, unless the condition of the first or last one made was spectacular.




It was not until 1899 when S&W released the 38 Military and Police 1st Model (Model of 1899 Army Navy Revolver) that S&W put the cylinder bolt back under the cylinder where it has been ever since. This model was the predecessor to every double action revolver S&W made from that day to today.

View attachment 1013953

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Driftwood Johnson said:

So how much was he asking for it?

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Driftwood Johnson said:

I paid $800 for that beautiful nickle plated one. Don't recall what I paid for the other. Certainly not $1199.

If it matters, putting it in a fancy wooden box with notes about the model does not make it anymore valuable.

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AndyUSMC1107 said:

Roger That!

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StrawHat said:

Another thing to consider is S&W made parts like frames in batches and stored them to be assembled at a later date. They were serial numbered but not necessarily released in order of number. The one offered you may have the highest number but it also may have left the factory the first year it was made while lower numbers sat in storage until needed.

To determine when this one was released to the public would require a letter from the S&W historian, Roy Jinks.

Kevin

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