Pet Cast Loads in 30-30 And 45-70?

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BigBoreBubba

BigBoreBubba

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I’ve been trying, unsuccessfully, to find loads for my Marlin 30-30 and 45-70. In the 45-70 I’ve tried 300gr Cast Performance LFNGC’s over IMR 3031 and Unique, Cast Performance 420gr LFNGC’s over IMR3031, and 405gr Missouri Buffalo HiTeks over IMR4198. The results have been, shall we say, less than impressive…
I’ve tried 165gr Missouri Whitetail HiTeks over IMR4189 in my 30-30, and the results were pretty abysmal.
I do have a load worked up for my buddy’s BFR 30-30 of a 170gr LFNGC over H335 the shoots really well, but these Marlins are giving me fits.
If anyone has any pet loads or advise I’d surely appreciate it. At this point I’m just wasting powder, primers, an boolits…..
 
PS, I’ve also not had stellar results in 375 H&H using Montana 300gr. LFNGC’s over IMR4064. I’m thinking of trying them over IMR3031 which I have found data for, and IMR4198 which I have not yet found data for.
Any help there would be greatly appreciated as well.
 
BigBoreBubba said:
I’ve been trying, unsuccessfully, to find loads for my Marlin 30-30 and 45-70. In the 45-70 I’ve tried 300gr Cast Performance LFNGC’s over IMR 3031 and Unique, Cast Performance 420gr LFNGC’s over IMR3031, and 405gr Missouri Buffalo HiTeks over IMR4198. The results have been, shall we say, less than impressive…
I’ve tried 165gr Missouri Whitetail HiTeks over IMR4189 in my 30-30, and the results were pretty abysmal.
I do have a load worked up for my buddy’s BFR 30-30 of a 170gr LFNGC over H335 the shoots really well, but these Marlins are giving me fits.
If anyone has any pet loads or advise I’d surely appreciate it. At this point I’m just wasting powder, primers, an boolits…..
Click to expand...
Are trying for plinkers, or full bore?
I've had very good luck with 15gr of blue dot and mbc hitec or Berry's plated. They get about 1600 fps from my wife's microgroove. (Use at your own risk)
Flake powders seem to work better for me than ball powders in lower case fill loads.
 
Hooda Thunkit said:
If you are shooting .308 sized lead in that Marlin, you may be destined for disappointment.

Try .310 -.311, if you can find them.
Click to expand...

That right there. Normal commercial cast are .309" or .310"... try .311" Same-same with your .45-70, you may have to experiment with different sized bullets, or a different bullet entirely. I love me some Cast Performance bullets, but they are hard... if they are undersized for your bore, you will get poor accuracy.
 
Continuing the thought... I have a Savage 99 in .30-30 that I was getting horrible patterns with, using my standard LaserCast .309" 170grn bullet. I went to Montana Bullet and got 100 of their .311" 170's... essentially the same bullet... and *bam!* my patterns turned into very nice groups, all else being equal. My Savage 99 in .308 doesn't seem to care what bullet I put in it, but that just goes to show that any rifle can be different... the Marlin is no different, either, MicroGroove rifling not withstanding.

I've had very good luck with IMR4198 in all my cast rifle cartridges, AA5744 would be runner-up. If I need more velocity, I move to IMR3031... so it sounds like you are in the right ballpark. A closer look at your projectiles sounds in order.
 
Hooda Thunkit said:
Marlin 30-30s, especially those with micro-groove rifling, are notorious for having large diameter barrels.

If you are shooting .308 sized lead in that Marlin, you may be destined for disappointment.

Try .310 -.311, if you can find them.
Click to expand...


These are sized at .311. I load .308 in my buddy’s BFR.
 
I’m
Bfh_auto said:
Are trying for plinkers, or full bore?
I've had very good luck with 15gr of blue dot and mbc hitec or Berry's plated. They get about 1600 fps from my wife's microgroove. (Use at your own risk)
Flake powders seem to work better for me than ball powders in lower case fill loads.
Click to expand...
looking for full power loads. But maybe some plinkers as well. I have some unique for those.
 
Charlie98 said:
That right there. Normal commercial cast are .309" or .310"... try .311" Same-same with your .45-70, you may have to experiment with different sized bullets, or a different bullet entirely. I love me some Cast Performance bullets, but they are hard... if they are undersized for your bore, you will get poor accuracy.
Click to expand...


The Cast Performance bullets I tried were .458’s, the Missouri bullets are .459’s.
The 30-30’s are .311’s.
 
I have been going through this with my Marlin for about a month now. I am using Acme hi-tech coated cast bullets and Alliant 2400 powder. The bullets in stock when I ordered were only 135 grain and direct load data was not easily found. Thanks to lots of good advice from members here, I got it worked out.

The Marlin micro-groove rifling is shallower than usual, making it easier to strip the rifling if they are pushed to fast. There seems to be a pretty hard velocity limit somewhere around 1400 fps for my rifle/bullet combo. I dropped the powder charge about 1 grain, from 14 to 13, and things tightened up a lot.
 
BigBoreBubba said:
The Cast Performance bullets I tried were .458’s, the Missouri bullets are .459’s.
The 30-30’s are .311’s.
Click to expand...

Although this sounds counterproductive, you might try straight cast, not coated, in the .30-30, if you are already at .311" If memory serves, my .311" Montana bullets are gas checked as well... which I suggest if you are intending to push these above 1500fps, and it sounds like you are.

As far as the .45-70, the poor accuracy with the .458" Montanas doesn't surprise me (because of the diameter,) and, again, I might get away from the coated bullets and just try traditional lube and a gas check, at .459"
 
This at be an obvious question but I’ll ask any way. Are gas checks sized the same as the bullet? In other words do you need 0.309” gas checks to go with 0.309” bullets?
 
Like Charlie said ^^^ . Here is what I use with my Lee mold when I cast 150 and 170 grain bullets for my Winchester 94. They work very well..https://www.sagesoutdoors.com/30-7-62-mm-caliber-015-copper-gas-checks/

I am running them with Hodgon Leverevolution powder and getting 2260 FPS average with the 150 grain bullets and 2060 FPS with the 170 grain. Very good accuracy and no noticeable leading.
 
Ok good. So I don’t have to find gas checks to match whatever sizing die I need when I start casting my own.
 
DMW1116 said:
Ok good. So I don’t have to find gas checks to match whatever sizing die I need when I start casting my own.
Click to expand...

Just to be clear... they are made for specific bullet calibers... i.e. .308, or .348, or .270, etc, but the actual bullet diameter within that size range doesn't matter... i.e. .308", .309", .310", etc.
 
I use IMR3031 for my cast .30-30 loads, using a gas checked Lee 170gr I cast myself tumble lubed with LLA. I stopped at 26gr charge weight because it shoots very well and I was looking for a load that was just a touch less than full power.
 
Ifishsum said:
I use IMR3031 for my cast .30-30 loads, using a gas checked Lee 170gr I cast myself tumble lubed with LLA. I stopped at 26gr charge weight because it shoots very well and I was looking for a load that was just a touch less than full power.
Click to expand...


I think I may try 3031 on the next go around. I load a 170 Gas Checked for my buddy’s BFR using H335. It does really well. I may try it too, especially since I’ve got 16 pounds of it….
 
BigBoreBubba said:
I think I may try 3031 on the next go around. I load a 170 Gas Checked for my buddy’s BFR using H335.
Click to expand...

DMW1116 said:
Does he get a giant fireball with H335? I’m moving away from it because of that.
Click to expand...

That was my first thought, too!

H335 works well enough, but it's not a very shooter friendly powder... I think you'll have good results with IMR3031.

I have backup loads worked up with H335, for just in case, but the only cartridge I like to use it for is 5.56mm, where it does very well.
 
Charlie98 said:
That was my first thought, too!

H335 works well enough, but it's not a very shooter friendly powder... I think you'll have good results with IMR3031.

I have backup loads worked up with H335, for just in case, but the only cartridge I like to use it for is 5.56mm, where it does very well.
Click to expand...


5.56/223 and 308 are the primary cartridges we use H335 for, but it does have quite a few more uses. I’ll probably do some experimenting with it.
 
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