Stainless Steel composition on Uberti revolvers

Blackpowderwarrior said:

I've often wondered what stainless steel UBERTI uses on it's revolvers.
My 2021 SS 1858 Uberti is one of the most accurate revolvers I have,"besides my Pietta 44 "Navy".
I've heard peoples theory's on Guns with Italian date stamp "21" being quickly thrown together by unskilled laborers due to the craziness going on in the world.
Also possibly how the stainless is also of poor composition due to material shortages.
But the stainless on my 1858 is pretty darn hard and the revolver itself was darn near perfect straight out of the box.
Does anyone know the composition of the stainless steel used by uberti? I wonder if the stainless used on their cap and ball series is the same as the stainless used in their cartridge guns.
Please chime in with any information you may have.

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This is something I’d be interested in knowing also. My only complaint with most C&B revolvers is the softer steel used. One of the reasons I like the ROA so much is the hard steel (the coil springs are nice too).

I think the SS composition is just fine with the Italian revolvers. Even the steel versions are plenty adequate for their purpose (even as cartridge guns). I can drill into Ruger frames just as easily as the reproductions. The only thing I don't spend time on is the Ruger SS hammer! THAT is some hard SS!!!

As far as the "coil spring" thing, that is exactly what I do with Italian revolvers!! They end up as a "Ruger" version of the same thing (except better!)!!

Mike

Howdy

There are three major classes of stainless steel: Austenitic, Martensitic, and Ferritic.

The last two are magnetic, Austneitic is non-magnetic but becomes magnetic with work hardening, such as stamping.

I can tell you this much.

A while ago I used the 'magnet test' on some stainless revolvers. The magnet was attracted to stainless Smith and Wesson revolvers.

It was not attracted to the one Uberti stainless steel revolver I have.

45 Dragoon said:

I think the SS composition is just fine with the Italian revolvers. Even the steel versions are plenty adequate for their purpose (even as cartridge guns). I can drill into Ruger frames just as easily as the reproductions. The only thing I don't spend time on is the Ruger SS hammer! THAT is some hard SS!!!

As far as the "coil spring" thing, that is exactly what I do with Italian revolvers!! They end up as a "Ruger" version of the same thing (except better!)!!

Mike

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The hardness thing was based on what I’ve read over the years and visual clues I’ve observed. I see more peening where the cylinder latch strikes the cylinder on my Piettas than I do on my Rugers. However, this could be a result of the stiffer cylinder latch springs used on the Piettas causing the latch to strike the cylinder with more force.

Driftwood Johnson said:

Howdy

There are three major classes of stainless steel: Austenitic, Martensitic, and Ferritic.

The last two are magnetic, Austneitic is non-magnetic but becomes magnetic with work hardening, such as stamping.

I can tell you this much.

A while ago I used the 'magnet test' on some stainless revolvers. The magnet was attracted to stainless Smith and Wesson revolvers.

It was not attracted to the one Uberti stainless steel revolver I have.

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Just checked on mine, comparing three stainless guns. Pietta New Army, Colt 2nd gen 1860 Army, and Ruger Old Army.
On the Pietta the magnet stuck to the barrel and cylinder, but not the frame or loading lever. On the Colt it stuck to the barrel and frame but not the cylinder, grip frame, or loading lever. The Ruger was equally magnetic across all parts. I don’t know what it all means as far as hardness goes, but was bored so checked it out. I’ve found that the more magnetic a stainless steel is the less corrosion resistant it is, but even magnetic stainless can perform very well in corrosive environments if it’s been passivated properly.

We used a lot of Type 304 and 304 L (weldable) in liquid fertilizer R&D. Very corrosion resistant, austenitic, therefore not magnetic. I wonder if that is what Pietta is using. Also known as 18-8 (Nickel-Chromium).

C Younger said:

Just checked on mine, comparing three stainless guns. Pietta New Army, Colt 2nd gen 1860 Army, and Ruger Old Army.
On the Pietta the magnet stuck to the barrel and cylinder, but not the frame or loading lever. On the Colt it stuck to the barrel and frame but not the cylinder, grip frame, or loading lever. The Ruger was equally magnetic across all parts. I don’t know what it all means as far as hardness goes, but was bored so checked it out. I’ve found that the more magnetic a stainless steel is the less corrosion resistant it is, but even magnetic stainless can perform very well in corrosive environments if it’s been passivated properly.

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That’s interesting info- thanks.
The italians are capable of the highest quality. Their oilfield forgings are arguably the best in the world.

C Younger said:

The hardness thing was based on what I’ve read over the years and visual clues I’ve observed. I see more peening where the cylinder latch strikes the cylinder on my Piettas than I do on my Rugers. However, this could be a result of the stiffer cylinder latch springs used on the Piettas causing the latch to strike the cylinder with more force.

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Well actually the peening is caused more from late timing (bolt drop) than anything else. The bolt needs to hit the cylinder fully before the locking notch (which happens rather early on a Ruger). Hitting the notch on the edge is how you destroy a notch. Spring tension Has some to do with it for sure but "timing" is everything!! Lol

Mike

45 Dragoon said:

Well actually the peening is caused more from late timing (bolt drop) than anything else. The bolt needs to hit the cylinder fully before the locking notch (which happens rather early on a Ruger). Hitting the notch on the edge is how you destroy a notch. Spring tension Has some to do with it for sure but "timing" is everything!! Lol

Mike

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The Ruger bolt rides the cylinder all the way around. That's why Rugers always have a drag line.

Hello Guys,

Here's what I know about Stainless Steel,
When we do a Restoration on an old Snowmobile,
we use a lot of Stainless Steel bolts & nuts, they stay nicer looking.
How-ever, if it is something which needs to be adjusted or removed,
we use a lot of Anti-Seize or mix stainless with other alloys (SS Bolt with a Steal Nut).
The stainless steel will "roll a thread" and will lock up tight, making removal impossible.
I don't know if this would be an issue with a black powder weapon,
but would hate to have it happen with a nipple or simple screw.

AntiqueSledMan.

hawg said:

The Ruger bolt rides the cylinder all the way around. That's why Rugers always have a drag line.

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That’s true. Maybe I’ll adjust the timing on the Piettas.

45 Dragoon said:

Well actually the peening is caused more from late timing (bolt drop) than anything else. The bolt needs to hit the cylinder fully before the locking notch (which happens rather early on a Ruger). Hitting the notch on the edge is how you destroy a notch. Spring tension Has some to do with it for sure but "timing" is everything!! Lol

Mike

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I have noticed the delayed cylinder latch on the Piettas. One of my New Army’s was so late releasing the latch that it would occasionally skip the notch if the gun was cocked fast enough. I was always careful with it, but I let someone else shoot it and it skipped the notch. Left a nasty scar where the hammer struck the out-of-time cylinder. It got adjusted shortly after that.

hawg said:

The Ruger bolt rides the cylinder all the way around. That's why Rugers always have a drag line.

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Not really.

The Bolt pops up roughly halfway between chambers on a Ruger. So the drag line does not go all the way around the cylinder. In this photo the spot where the bolt pops up is clearly visible as the spot at the beginning of the drag line. I have had this Blackhawk for over 40 years, the drag line is quite obvious. I have always believed that a Ruger's timing was purposely set this way so there would be no chance of the bolt popping up too late. Don't forget, Rugers are mass produced. I suspect the bolt and hammer are drop in parts and there is no fine tuning done to the action, so having the bolt pop up this early guarantees the bolt will never pop up too late.






Colts and colt replicas have a teardrop shaped lead in to the locking slot. A properly timed Colt (or replica) will have the bolt pop up in that tear drop shaped lead. This Colt New Frontier shows the bolt is popping up slightly early, just before the lead. Notice too the there is a slight amount of peening at the trailing edge of the bolt slot, probably caused by extra fast cocking before I owned this revolver.






This Uberti Cattleman also shows the bolt popping up slightly early, just before the tear drop shaped lead.






The 1858 Remington had no lead in to the cylinder slot. The conversion cylinder in my 1858 Remmie follows suit and does not have a lead in. The reflection shows a very slight amount of battering, but it is very minor. The lighting highlights it.






By 1875 when Remington brought out their cartridge revolver, they also included a lead in to the locking slot. This Model 1875 Remington was made sometime in the late 1870s or early 1880s, so I don't worry to much about it being slightly out of time. I don't shoot it much.

bob97 said:

That’s interesting info- thanks.
The italians are capable of the highest quality. Their oilfield forgings are arguably the best in the world.

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I have a few 25mm weld on Stainless Unions we purchased from an Italian manufacturer. They’re rated at 3000 PSI and the most beautiful pipe fittings I have ever seen.

Does the composition of the stainless really matter? As long as it resists corrosion?

Driftwood Johnson said:

The Bolt pops up roughly halfway between chambers on a Ruger. So the drag line does not go all the way around the cylinder. In this photo the spot where the bolt pops up is clearly visible as the spot at the beginning of the drag line. I have had this Blackhawk for over 40 years, the drag line is quite obvious. I have always believed that a Ruger's timing was purposely set this way so there would be no chance of the bolt popping up too late. Don't forget, Rugers are mass produced. I suspect the bolt and hammer are drop in parts and there is no fine tuning done to the action, so having the bolt pop up this early guarantees the bolt will never pop up too late.

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I've always heard that the bolt should drop a full bolt width before the notch to prevent peening and over running.

Nope. But different grades of stainless resist corrosion different amounts. Some are formulated to resist corrosion in high heat and high corrosion environments, others not so much.