1911 thumb safety

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Col. Harrumph

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Somewhere on the interwebs I ran into this page on Cylinder & Slide's site:

https://www.cylinder-slide.com/1911safetyck.shtml

I checked my pistol and it failed the first test: thumbing the hammer back ever so gently produced an audible click. C&S says this is the sound of the sear re-seating itself fully in the hammer hooks, which happens because the safety pushed the sear out of engagement ever so slightly.

How dangerous, really, is this condition? What's the fix? C&S's response to my query was to contact the maker for possible warranty work. The "maker" in this case is Turnbull Restoration, who did cosmetically beautiful work on my rusty veteran. I'm not blaming Turnbull for this, their expertise is, in the main, cosmetic. The gun may have had a dodgy safety since it left the Colt mill in 1918.

Oh yeah, the obligatory pics (bfore & after, for context):

1911 356370 (before).JPG
1911 356370 (after).JPG
 
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When you have the thumb safety engaged and pull the trigger, the sear disengages from the hammer hooks to the extent the thumb safety allows - which should be zero. If the thumb safety is fit and working properly the sear should not move at all. If it does the test produces that click. I'd bet you need the thumb safety refitted or replaced and fitted.
 
It is possible - if the thumb safety and sear stop areas are not too far apart to peen the safety lug to create more surface area. But, this should only be done by someone with experience and the result has to provide full engagement and no sear movement. It's usually much better to replace the safety and fit it. These are not drop-in parts.

If you have a bright lamp and can hold the pistol stable against a desk or workbench - you should be able to see the edge of the sear where it engages the hammer while cocked. With the safety engaged watch and pull the trigger. You will see the sear move from the hammer hooks in the small space between hammer and frame. Once corrected it should be rock solid and unmoving.
 
If the thumb safety is fit and working properly the sear should not move at all.
Absolutely correct.

Replace the thumb safety, refit.
I agree. Don't fool around. Replace the part. I recommend the EGW GI thumb safety. I doubt the finish on it will match the Turnbull finish on your pistol. If you ask them, they may refinish the new thumb safety to match what they've already done.

There are some pictures and information at this post that maybe of some general interest on this subject: https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/fitting-and-reshaping-a-1911-thumb-safety.867790/

Make sure the 'smith you take it to to fit the thumb safety really knows 1911s so the job is done perfectly. When you take it to him ask if he'll inspect the sear/hammer contact surfaces to determine if they're damaged and need to be replaced before fitting the thumb safety.
 
I'm almost 100% in the camp that says zero movement allowed. Almost....

In the case of a modern gun that I was going to use for self defense or other shooting around anyone else I would peen and refit the safety lug, have it TIG'd and refit it, or replace with a new fitted safety. Modern 1911s and those that have been upgraded with "match" parts have very shallow hammer hooks and narrow sear noses, often with substantial breakaway clearance cuts on the back of the sear nose, resulting in very shallow engagement (much less than the .020" hammer hook would lead you to believe and some hammer hooks are even less than that). So any movement is unacceptible with those parameters.

With an historical gun like yours it would depend on the intended use of the gun and just how much movement it had. Here's why. A solid 75% of the GI 1911s that I've had in my hands over the years (literally a couple thousand at least) had the same issue. And it did not cause any problems in the context of their intended use for some very specific reasons - The GI hammers have deep engagement hooks (spec is .030") and wide sear noses with no escape/breakaway cut. So you do get literally almost .030" engagement. The amount of movement allowed by the poor sear/safety fit was far less than that, on the order of .005" or less. So the condition did not allow the hammer to fall under any circumstances. Optimum? No. But no one was going to have a discharge due to faulty sear/safety fit. I would bet many of them left the factories in that condition with the full knowledge of the manufacturers and inspectors. I suspect yours might have been one of them.

For peace of mind you might wish to pursue the above approach. Replacing the safety with a non-original part, even on your refinished gun, will reduce the value. Refitting of your current safety, if carefully done, will not damamge the finish and be indistinguishable from its current appearance. Were it mine I would not be shooting that one anyway. It would be kept in a place of honor respecting its age and what it represents. I have plenty more for self defense and range use.
 
Peen the safety lug and refit. It’s not a difficult fix for a KNOWLEDGEABLE gunsmith.
It is possible - if the thumb safety and sear stop areas are not too far apart to peen the safety lug to create more surface area. But, this should only be done by someone with experience and the result has to provide full engagement and no sear movement. It's usually much better to replace the safety and fit it. These are not drop-in parts.

If you have a bright lamp and can hold the pistol stable against a desk or workbench - you should be able to see the edge of the sear where it engages the hammer while cocked. With the safety engaged watch and pull the trigger. You will see the sear move from the hammer hooks in the small space between hammer and frame. Once corrected it should be rock solid and unmoving.
See the last section in the article below.
https://www.brazoscustom.com/post/trigger-group-tuning-and-maintenance-part-1
 
Sorry, but I think the article is confusing, and even as lengthy as it is, it's incomplete. There should be an extra step after performing the click test: a test to determine if the click heard actually is the click that does render your pistol unsafe. Without some sort of positive confirming mechanical test, a subjective audible test as described could mislead shooters into thinking they've got a defective firearm. I heard what sounded like a "click", but I don't know if it's just parts moving against and meeting each other, or if it's the dreaded sear disengagement described in the article. As far as I could tell after performing the test described in the article, my hammer remained cocked with the thumb safety off and the grip safety engaged despite all my efforts to get the hammer to fall, so I regard my pistol as still completely safe, insofar as designed, and I'm going forward treating it as such. I performed the click test using my Springfield 1911-A1 "Milspec", which is a series-70 action.
 
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