Sad news for the New Beretta APX

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Encoreman

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I will try to keep this short. I purchased a NEW Beretta APX .40 compact July 2020, first time to the range about 2 weeks later and either the 13th or 14th round it blew the extractor out hitting my index knuckle on the way out. Called Beretta and they sent me a shipping label, sent it out and got it back in about a month. Btw this firearm was to be my new CC firearm. I kept records of rounds fired as I wanted 1k thru it to say it was reliable. By August 2021 I had 1,039 rounds and was happy. Yesterday I went to range with a friend and on round 31 my APX again blew out the extractor. To say I was disappointed would be understating it. I have more money invested in the 1,000+ rounds than I do in the pistol. I have searched the 'net and found others with same issue. I don't know if it is bad batch or what. Here is a link showing what my brass looked like, I almost think it fired out of battery, what are your thoughts? https://www.craftholsters.com/most-frequent-beretta-apx-problems-beware
 
Wow, not good. I'd send it back to Beretta. Once you get it back, get rid of it. I wouldn't trust it. Especially if you were planning to carry it. Obviously there is an issue that hasn't been addressed with that extractor. Maybe the aftermarket has a solution. Sucks that you have that much ammo through it.
 
If I were a betting man, I'd say not so much an out of battery detonation, but early high pressure extraction. That would explain both a broken/sheared extractor and a case failure. Though, im not sure how the extractor is retained on the APX. Looks like its probably a roll pin through the top of the slide. 40S&W is a pretty high pressure round, and if shooting say, 180g out of a compact pistol, possibly originally engineered for 9mm...seems plausible that it may be unlocking before the bullet has left the barrel and chamber pressure has dropped. That would do it. A heavier recoil spring may solve the issue, but, I certainly wouldn't fault you for sending that one on its way
 
The .40 S&W cartridge is extremely prone to overpressure problems caused by the bullet setback phenomenon during the ammunition chambering. It is a cartridge that works with pressure values close to the limit due to the low internal volume. It is therefore possible that, due to a cartridge not perfectly crimped, the feed ramp a bit steeper than other designs and a slide that returns to battery particularly quickly, every now and then some cartridges suffer bullet setback and some cases explode in the direction of the feed ramp. The fact that the extractor blows out is a perfectly normal thing in case of overpressure: it is not a cause but an effect. Normally the magazine is also thrown out due to overpressure.
I mean, I wouldn't blame the gun but I would focus my attention on the cartridges you usually use or in any case on those with which you have had the two accidents.
It would be good if you did some experimentation with the cartridges you usually use, chambering them as violently as you can from the magazine and then extracting them and inspecting them to see if the bullet setback phenomenon occurs.
 
Yes this was my new cc firearm. Sort of ironic this is the only NEW centerfire pistol I have ever owned. Shot thousands upon thousands when I competed in USPSA thru used Beretta 96, Para-Ordnance LDA, Para-Ordnance P16-40 and never had an issue even remotely like this. BTW in searching the net for similar problems, this is also occurring in the 9mm also. So not just a .40S&W issue. I wish Beretta would refund my money for the ammo and I would gift this gun to somebody. I really thought they had the problem fixed after I got 1k rounds without an issue. So much for that, I would carry my Para P16-40, but it is a little on the large size to conceal. Wanted everyone to be aware. Thanks
 
Yes I am going to ask for a replacement, would rather have the $$$ and I will try something else. What really bothers me more than anything, I was looking at adding my first NEW cc gun and it turns out to be a failure. I totally understand that anything mechanical can and will fail, but this design was at least a few years old when I bought it. My Para P16-40 was used by a competitor when I got it and after 3K rounds we tore it down and only part that was in question was a cracked firing pin stop, and it hadn't failed yet.
 
I only issues ive had with my APX with shooting left. If Beretta sends you a new gun and you don't want it, let me know. Ive been wanting a .40sw version since last year but it appears they dont make it anymore and have never seen any in stores
 
1) Any damage to the brass that would indicate a higher than normal pressure?
2) Same lot of ammo on failure #1 as #2?
3) When you say "blew the extractor out" what exactly do you mean? Extractor left the pistol as one piece or in pieces? Extractor pin (assuming the design has one) was still whole or fractured?

Once is coincidence and twice is enemy action, assuming you used different ammo for both blow outs and the cases showed no signs of overpressure. I'd either take a full refund from Beretta or a new pistol. If they will only send you a new pistol I'd sell it as a new pistol to get some of the money you've sunk into the pistol back. With a 1/1000 rate of failure there's no way I would be able to have confidence in it going forward.

BSW
 
Here is John Farnam article on a case blow out he had with an APX https://www.ammoland.com/2018/04/beretta-apx-pistol-problems-customer-service/#axzz7GmKIy9lJ

Read more: https://www.ammoland.com/2018/04/beretta-apx-pistol-problems-customer-service/#ixzz7GmKmzqly
Under Creative Commons License: Attribution
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Like all modern pistols, the Beretta APX is designed to protect the shooter when something like this happens (which does occasionally, with all pistols). Leaking gas is channeled into the magazine well, which usually results in the magazine itself projectile-ejecting. In my case, the magazine body stayed inside the pistol while the follower, remaining rounds, spring, and base-plate all jettisoned out the bottom.

The extractor blew off the pistol. This is also very typical, and by design. The bullet squirted out the muzzle and went downrange. Frame, slide, and barrel were all undamaged.
 
That brass in the link looks like a barrel with an unsupported chamber. I thought APX were full supported in the chamber. I am doubtful a heavier recoil spring would make a difference. Maybe a heavier slide.

Pretty disappointing if this is a regular thing with the APX. I was planning to pick one up this year. i was just trying to get used to the cosmetics first.

Have you looked into the PX4 in 40s&w?
 
Have you looked into the PX4 in 40s&w?
Well as much as I hate to say it, this is probably my last Beretta. If it was just mine and no others I would not be so quick to want to change brands. I hope to speak to a customer service rep tomorrow and see what they say when I let them know it isn't just my pistol. I will keep this forum up to date on what transpires. I wanted to tell everyone, go out and buy a couple of APX's as they are great guns, sorry but I can't say that. Thanks for the replies.
 
Well as much as I hate to say it, this is probably my last Beretta. If it was just mine and no others I would not be so quick to want to change brands. I hope to speak to a customer service rep tomorrow and see what they say when I let them know it isn't just my pistol. I will keep this forum up to date on what transpires. I wanted to tell everyone, go out and buy a couple of APX's as they are great guns, sorry but I can't say that. Thanks for the replies.

Thank you back. I had high expectations for the APX and was looking hard at them. The ones I shot were great but I was shooting other folks pistols and not dumping thousands of rounds through them. I will just stick to 92 and PX series until Beretta addresses this. No big deal... I was just looking at a modular pistol for my next wondernine or fab40. Kind of funy that people play this off like its a design feature. I didnt know guns were supposed to be designed to "safely" blow up. Good thing you bought a Beretta. Next time you speak with them make sure to tell them thank you.

Huge Beretta fan BTW. Shame on them. They should refund you or offer a PX4. Maybe see if you can get a 9mm 92fs. Last Beretta.... thats funny. Might as well say last ice cream cone. Explains why I have been seeing APX pistols so cheap lately.
 
Kind of funy that people play this off like its a design feature. I didnt know guns were supposed to be designed to "safely" blow up.
All guns can "blow up", because it is the round that is exploding, for whatever reason. What happens to you and the gun if a round explodes, can be a function of the design features.
 
All guns can "blow up", because it is the round that is exploding, for whatever reason. What happens to you and the gun if a round explodes, can be a function of the design features.

Right but this is looking at it like..... yeah they blow up sometimes but look how well it blows up. I wonder if Beretta was rushing this out for the trials and couldnt get it dialed in. Then just decided oh well... good enough for those sucker meal team six types. Hate to say it but if this is not an uber rare occurance and completely ammo related it needs to be recalled or pulled.

The article talks about this being an extractor issue... I must be missing something. It looks like an unsupported chamber or an out of battery situation to me. I dont see how the extractor is causing this. Extractor popping is the result of the case rupture not the cause. Maybe I am missing something though.
 
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an out of battery situation to me. I don't see how the extractor is causing this
Starling this is exactly what I thought when it happened the first time. At this point in the hard to find ammo situation, I shoot lots of different ammo, no steel case though. When this happened the first time I was going to include the piece of mangled brass for them to inspect. The CS rep about had a fit, don't include any ammo with the gun, I explained it was a much mangled fired piece of brass, he still insisted not to send it. I think I will include a photo with it this time, but in all honesty I think Beretta knows there is an issue they just don't want a recall that would cost them money in replacement or lost sales. I really am looking hard towards a Sig.
 
Starling this is exactly what I thought when it happened the first time. At this point in the hard to find ammo situation, I shoot lots of different ammo, no steel case though. When this happened the first time I was going to include the piece of mangled brass for them to inspect. The CS rep about had a fit, don't include any ammo with the gun, I explained it was a much mangled fired piece of brass, he still insisted not to send it. I think I will include a photo with it this time, but in all honesty I think Beretta knows there is an issue they just don't want a recall that would cost them money in replacement or lost sales. I really am looking hard towards a Sig.

Could be.... hard to say. Time will most likely tell when and if Ammo ever get affordable and easy enough to get where the average joe is shooting more again. Cant really argue going with the Sig... or a CZ... or a PX4... or anything with a longer history. I am more of a Beretta guy but its really the 92 I like along with the PX. Hopefully Beretta is not getting shady and pretending there is not a problem when there is one.

If it was just one time I would probably give the pistol the benifit of the doubt and suspect ammo. Twice is concerning unless you are just one unlucky fellow. If thats the case please stay away from me. I have my own problems. Joking of course.. kinda.

Do you remember the ammo you were useing?
 
I went back and looked at the OP's link to the Craft Holsters article, that used a pistol-forum thread as source material.

I am a pistol-forum member, and know the reputations of most of the members posting in the linked thread. If that is the source material for the Craft Holsters article, realize the conclusion in that thread was bad ammo and not anything to do with the extractor.
 
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I have seen a thread, I believe on Berettaforum, where the striker channel was very roughly machined, that may have caused the Berettaforum members gun's slide to hang up.

I don't own an APX, but have followed reports of the gun over several forums, and numerous YouTube videos. Certainly, there have been issues here and there, but the gun has predominantly been a strong performer. The legitimate things that have held the APX back, have been a lack of aftermarket support, and not generally function or safety issues, though I'm not doubting the OP's particular issue, just that I don't think this is a widespread issue.
 
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I have seen a thread, I believe on Berettaforum, where the striker channel was very roughly machined, that may have caused the Berettaforum members gun's slide to hang up.

I don't own an APX, but have followed reports of the gun over several forums, and numerous YouTube videos. Certainly, there have been issues here and there, but the gun has predominantly been a strong performer. The legitimate things that have held the APX back, have been a lack of aftermarket support, and not generally function or safety issues, though I'm not doubting the OP's particular issue, just that I don't think this is a widespread issue.

Hopefully its not widespread. Beretta has had a few "issues" through the years that made me scratch my head but whatever. I thought what held the APX back was the Boris Karloff inspired slide cosmetics. I still kind of wanted one though. Time will tell. Beretta doesnt normally kill off new product lines very fast so I will hold off another 5 years or so. I dont like the fall back "Bad ammo" etc. excuse that is used far to often. If Ammo production QC is taking a nose dive...... Not good. I am not disagreeing with you or those on pistol forum though. Could very well be ammo. 2 in about 1,000 seems pretty high though for centerfire.
 
Our OP hasn't listed his ammo, but I assume you did see the ammo used in the pistol-forum thread, and it was panned by nearly all posters.


Edit to add: Let me clarify - the point I'm making is a link was given to a Craft Holsters article that mentioned a reliability/safety issue with the APX, that used a pistol-forum thread as source material for the reliability/safety issue, yet the thread itself indicated the problem was bad ammo and not the gun. That is the point I'm making, and not questioning whether our OP in this thread actually had a problem with his APX.
 
Our OP hasn't listed his ammo, but I assume you did see the ammo used in the pistol-forum thread, and it was panned by nearly all posters.


Edit to add: Let me clarify - the point I'm making is a link was given to a Craft Holsters article that mentioned a reliability/safety issue with the APX, that used a pistol-forum thread as source material for the reliability/safety issue, yet the thread itself indicated the problem was bad ammo and not the gun. That is the point I'm making, and not questioning whether our OP in this thread actually had a problem with his APX.

No worries..... I understand where you are coming from. Thats why I went back and read everything again. Ammo production screw ups start becoming common I may have to put the Berettas into storage and just shoot hi-points. A JCP probably could have handled that load.
 
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