NFA Laws Don't Make Sense

SmeeAgain · Feb 13, 2022

I often question the logic behind some gun laws. Especially the NFA.
For example... short barreled rifles and shotguns are LESS effective but somehow a greater threat to public safety?
Why is a buttstock even an issue?
A handgun MUST have a rifled barrel... of course that's preferred, but why is a smooth bore pistol a greater threat?
Seems the trend is less effective firearms are considered more dangerous than improved designs.
And suppressors being NFA items is just stupid! We can't reduce the sound of gunfire without a mountain of paperwork & paying a tax, yet wearing ear protection is just fine.
Do members of Congress know ANYTHING about firearms?

LocoGringo · Feb 13, 2022

Generally, no, Congresspeople don't know anything about firearms. Many of the laws are made by people who know nothing about the tools they are regulating. There is no logic behind the laws...only the appearance of "doing something" that won't offend the general public.

Ultimately, the NFA is unconstitutional in its entirety...at least that's my view.

mjsdwash · Feb 14, 2022

The NFA was written to prevent the US military from selling off its obsolete arms to the public at a time when they needed money, people were losing faith in US government, and US based Bolshevic's were stirring uprisings. It kept a significant amount of small arms and light artillery out of the public reach. The NFA does make sense, as long as you see it for what it is.

SmeeAgain · Feb 14, 2022

mjsdwash said:
The NFA was written to prevent the US military from selling off its obsolete arms to the public at a time when they needed money, people were losing faith in US government, and US based Bolshevic's were stirring uprisings. It kept a significant amount of small arms and light artillery out of the public reach. The NFA does make sense, as long as you see it for what it is.

I can see how that might apply to some full auto firearms but the military isn't known for short barreled rifles or shotguns. I remember suppressors used on some of the early M16 variant carbines but they were marginally effective at best. Besides that the NFA had been in effect for decades.
As for full auto, while extremely entertaining, it's rarely practical and an incredible waste of ammo.
If someone who actually knew what they were talking about went down the list of laws, most could be scratched off as being too stupid to be there.
As for the unconstitutional part... that's another topic all together. That should have gone to court as soon as it was signed into law.

Carl N. Brown · Feb 14, 2022

"I often question the logic behind some gun laws. Especially the NFA."

It a 1934 law intended to reassure the public the government was doing something about gangsterism caused by Prohibition and the Depression.

"... short barreled rifles and shotguns are LESS effective but somehow a greater threat to public safety?"

The original argument was to prevent gangsters from sawing off less-regulated rifles and shotguns to make concealable weapons to get around federal, state, and local restrictions on pistols and revolvers which were more regulated.

"A handgun MUST have a rifled barrel... of course that's preferred, but why is a smooth bore pistol a greater threat?"

A smoothbore Colt SAA in .45 loaded with shot is a greater threat to snakes and small vermin than than one with a rifled barrel which scatters the shot. There was a small number of gunsniths making such "snake guns". Then the definition of Short Barrel Shotgun supposedly to restrict sawed-off shotguns was re-interpreted to make a pistol sold as pistol into a sawed-off shotgun if the rifling was removed to make it work better with shells loaded with shot.

"And suppressors being NFA items is just stupid! We can't reduce the sound of gunfire without a mountain of paperwork & paying a tax, yet wearing ear protection is just fine."

Great Britain, France, Finland agree. It is harder to buy guns there but the law regards sound suppressors (aka silencers and mufflers) treats them as a legitimate accessory to protect hearing. Our law makers in the 1930s based their decisions on watching gangster movies.

"Do members of Congress know ANYTHING about firearms?"

The most prolific and loudest gun control supporters pride themselves on knowing nothing about guns and active hate gun owners. Occasionally legislators will introduce a law less restrictive than that already in place, wonder why the "gun lobby" isn't pushing back, then quietly withdraw it.

SmeeAgain · Feb 14, 2022

Carl N. Brown said:
"I often question the logic behind some gun laws. Especially the NFA."

It a 1934 law intended to reassure the public the government was doing something about gangsterism caused by Prohibition and the Depression.

"... short barreled rifles and shotguns are LESS effective but somehow a greater threat to public safety?"

The original argument was to prevent gangsters from sawing off less-regulated rifles and shotguns to make concealable weapons to get around federal, state, and local restrictions on pistols and revolvers which were more regulated.

"A handgun MUST have a rifled barrel... of course that's preferred, but why is a smooth bore pistol a greater threat?"

A smoothbore Colt SAA in .45 loaded with shot is a greater threat to snakes and small vermin than than one with a rifled barrel which scatters the shot. There was a small number of gunsniths making such "snake guns". Then the definition of Short Barrel Shotgun supposedly to restrict sawed-off shotguns was re-interpreted to make a pistol sold as pistol into a sawed-off shotgun if the rifling was removed to make it work better with shells loaded with shot.

"And suppressors being NFA items is just stupid! We can't reduce the sound of gunfire without a mountain of paperwork & paying a tax, yet wearing ear protection is just fine."

Great Britain, France, Finland agree. It is harder to buy guns there but the law regards sound suppressors (aka silencers and mufflers) treats them as a legitimate accessory to protect hearing. Our law makers in the 1930s based their decisions on watching gangster movies.

If someone could design & manufacture a "silencer" that's as small & works like the Hollywood version, they would be a billionaire overnight!
As far as the rest of your explanation, it makes perfect sense. Thanks.

AlexanderA · Feb 14, 2022

SmeeAgain said:
For example... short barreled rifles and shotguns are LESS effective but somehow a greater threat to public safety?

It has nothing to do with effectiveness.

You have to look at the legislative history. As originally proposed, the NFA would have banned (actually, taxed) handguns. As a corollary to that, "handguns" made from cut-down rifles and shotguns were included. (Otherwise, it would have been too easy to sidestep the handgun ban by making your own from a rifle or shotgun.)

The handgun ban was dropped, but the corollary provisions stayed in. After the NFA became law, the details were filled in administratively, over many years. That's how we got a mass of seemingly incoherent rules.

alfsauve · Feb 14, 2022

I use to tutor people learning tax law. The very first thing I did was take them outside and tell to leave "fair" by the door, then they could come back inside. The tax laws/rules are designed for what's best for the IRS, not the citizen.

Same applies here. Leave "logic" by the door. It'll be mentally less painful that way. Gun control is all about "control" not taxes, not safety and not crime.

unspellable · Feb 14, 2022

Various aspects of the NFA are there for different reasons. Prior to the NFA we had the excise tax on firearms. Marble got an exception for the Game Getter by claiming farmers used it for pest control so it was an agricultural implement. Comes the NFA and it and all smooth bored hand guns are "other firearms" purely by historical accident. Silencers were included on grounds that poachers would use them, not gangsters. Short barreled shot guns were included for reasons given above. How ever the trench gun was used in WWI giving the lie to the Miller decision that a short barreld shot gun had no militia application.

Frank Ettin · Feb 14, 2022

Off topic. These rant fests don’t help understanding what the law is and how it works.

NFA Laws Don't Make Sense

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