Shot gun shell reloading......

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Remington1911

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I have reloaded rifle and hand gun for decades, I have also played shotgun games for about 5 years now....something about riding around on a golf cart and busting clays coming from different ways is just fun for me. I usually use an 1100 in 20 and until here lately shells have been cheap enough to not bother. I also have a Auto 5 in 16 that I just love to shoot, and have done a round or two with it but the shells are MUCH more spendy over the 20.

This is the total extent of my shotgun use, clays....that is it. At its highest point it was ~200 rounds between the wife and I a week. Costs of shells have cut that WAY down.

So already reloading brass I am tossing around the idea of reloading hulls. I know it would be money saved on the 16, thoughts on the 20....both the wife and I shoot 20's.

Are hulls like brass and they have a life span, if they do what kinds of signs do you look for, does the plastic start to crack like a case will....I am really coming into this blind.

I have looked at some reloading setups, and thinking with the volume I am thinking about....way more then the rifle stuff I usually do where 50 rounds is a large run.....thinking of something along the Progressive route. I generally shy away from progressive presses as it does not give the control I want for the rifle rounds, do I loose anything as far as how accurate things are with a progressive shot press.

I am leaning to the RCBS grand press, but looking for pointers and things to look for.

Like I said at the start, reloading for over 20 years now, but never done shotguns.
 
I am the opposite. I started reloading shotgun shells long before I got into metallic. Big time trap shooting and pheasant hunting drove it for me. I've had a couple of MEC progressive presses, and they work well. But hulls do wear out pretty fast. The weak spot is the crimp. They start cracking there and soon won't hold a crimp. For 12ga, I'd say you get 5-10 loads out of a good hull (AA, etc).

At least with the MEC's I've owned, you can't convert them to different gauges. You'd need a loader for each. I have not looked at shotshell loaders in a long time, so maybe that is possible these days? But something to consider.
 
Yes, shotgun hulls have a finite life. With modern hulls, they will usually fail at the crimp folds first, showing visible cracks when held up to the light.

I would consider a single stage loader, especially for the 16s. It's not difficult to run 4 boxes or more an hour. I generally load in the off season and get ahead of the curve. Any loading in summer months is a bonus done on rainy days. I'm still using a Pacific 155. They are available quite cheaply second hand. Major assembly is nearly indestructible, and bolts and springs have hardware store equivalent with common threads and sizes.

Edit to add...checked online prices and they are through the roof on second hand equipment. That said, I did find the 155 in 20 Ga on Ebay with most useful accessories (a decent selection of bushings and such) for a lower price than a new MEC. The 155 is a durable unit, IMHO superior to anything made by MEC, and the one I saw looked very lightly used.

16 Gauge will be difficult, both in terms of finding a press, and finding useful components and loads. There is a very narrow range of components suitable for 16 gauge loads. Do some research on available loads and wads and be prepared to jump if you find an appropriate powder. Stocking some filler and overshot cards at the 20 gauge size (used over 16 Ga shot columns) will almost certainly be required to make "close" component combinations crimp properly.
 
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Remington1911 said:
I am leaning to the RCBS grand press
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Discontinued?? No 16 ga.

When shot runs out of case, its time to chuck it, tape it for 1 last firing.

I would look at the Mec for a progressive. I have always used the Mec 600 jr in 12,20,28 & 410.

100 rounds an hour in 12 & 20 ga. The 28, 410 are slower.

All shotgun stuff here- https://www.shotgunworld.com/

Forget switching gauges on 1 press. To much set up time, after switching. Loaded a case of 28, then 410 , not fun.
 
A long time ago, in a land not far away, I began reloading with a $20 Lachmiller press in 12 ga I bought from my neighbor. The end product worked even later when I acquired semiautos and were a lot better than the cheap stuff you could buy back then. They didn’t use very good wads in the old days on budget stuff, often just a disk of cardboard.

These days, even the cheap stuff uses good wads and like 9mm, 223 and such, in good, plentiful times, the math is quite discouraging, when it comes to savings.

It makes the most sense when you are loading the odd balls that cost a lot, like .410, 28ga but you can often still make better for less, even with 12 & 20 but I generally use 366’s to speed things up.
 
Guess I am learning the 16 is going to be difficult.....figures the stuff I like it usually the biggest pain.

Thanks for the link, headed there now.
 
For the 16 I would get a used MEC 600 JR even a used one in another gauge for cheap and a conversion kit to 16. They are often found set up for 12. Balistic Products is a good resource for components and load books. I will raid the trash bin at my club for fired hulls. At present I have about 5 thirty gallon trash cans full of 12 GA Remington gun club hulls to work through. They dont seem to last as long but with them free for the taking by the trash bag, who cares LOL. The 20 GA are not quite so plentiful but have a couple trash cans of those gun clubs as well. I had to buy 16 GA hulls as there were about 20 a year found in the trash though. Watch for used and deals, then jump on them. Buy reclaimed shot when available. It works well for your needs. I would start with a dedicated shotshell reloading book so that combos of components can be researched before purchase, then a list of what you need drawn up and carried when out and about visiting LGS.
 
FROGO207 said:
I would start with a dedicated shotshell reloading book so that combos of components can be researched before purchase, then a list of what you need drawn up and carried when out and about visiting LGS.
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That's all fantastic advice, especially for beginning shot-shell loader's like myself and the OP. Can you recommend a couple of good books, please? There are a lot and they get alternatingly good & bad reviews. A recommendation would be useful.
 
Look for the Lyman Shotshell Reloading Handbook 5th edition. Available now for a bit less than $30 on line.
Balistic Products has a pile of dedicated manuals for purchase on their site. Even a dedicated one for 16 GA loading.
 
RCBS also has a shot shell reloading book.

For the volume the OP is suggesting, the MEC 600jr. I can get 100 to 125 shells an hour for 12 through 28 gauge. .410 is a bit slower.

MEC still offers a 16 ga 600jr so you could get a used one in another gauge and change it if you do not want to buy new. But, you will make the change only once. MEC 600jr is a great press but not real friendly for changing gauges.

If you decide to load 20 ga as well, it is best to get another press dedicated for 20 ga only. MEC 600jr are reasonably priced.
 
I have 5 MECs and a Pacific press. Each for a specific gauge.

16 ga is not impossible, just be ready to stock up.

600 Jr will get the job done
650 is a bit heavier, but basic operations are they same.
Grabber is more money and faster. If you come across a good deal, i love my Grabber. For the volume you are shooting, Jr or 650 will fill your needs.

I only purchased my first 600 Jr new. All others were garage sales and pawn shops finds, it less than 50% of new.

Be diligent and good luck.
 
Make sure you do your research on hulls. They are not all created equal. Before I started reloading shotgun I had saved a large bag of hulls from the bulk shotgun ammo at Walmart but when I started I reloading those hull weren't listed in the reloading manuals with load data. They ended up in the trash. Turns out they are not recommended for reloading. I ended up buying once fired Winchester AA hulls off the internet and they have been great. There are other premium hulls suitable for reloading I just landed on the AAs. I have not shot and reloaded them enough to notice wear but am always looking for cracks or tears.

There are also different wads that you will use depending on the shot weight. Make sure you are using the proper wad based on the load data.
 
I'll add a bit more on safety concerns. As stated, not every hull or wad is the same. You really need to pick a hull and wad then stick to the published data for that hull/wad combination only. You can't safely use load data for a difference hull and/wad than what you have on hand.

Example: if you are using Winchester hulls and Winchester wads, then you need to stick with data for that hull and wad combo. Or say you are using Federal hulls or Remington hulls, then you need to stick with the data for those hulls and also for the type/brand of wads you are using.
 
I think the RCBS Grand is discontinued, but if you can find one, grab it. I've had one for seven or eight years and I love it. Reliable, smooth as can be, and RCBS's parts warranty is second to none.
 
...not every hull or wad is the same. You really need to pick a hull and wad then stick to the published data
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Good counsel.

One of the advantages of doing a little reading is that you find the load data/powders/wads/primers for AA (including AA-HS), Remington Gun Club, and Remington STS is "effectively" identical.

Add the fact people simply throw away Gun Club... and you have an endless supply of very good hulls.
 
MEHavey said:
One of the advantages of doing a little reading is that you find the load data/powders/wads/primers for AA (including AA-HS), Remington Gun Club, and Remington STS is "effectively" identical.
Click to expand...

While that is true for sheet loads such as those listed, it is not always true once you get into hulls for hunting loads. That is why I always suggest new shot shell reloader to stick with one type/brand of hull and one type/brand of wad and use only the published data for that hull/wad combo.

I mostly reload 410 shells and notice a difference even when going from 2 1/2" Remington Premier Nitro sporting clay hulls to 2 1/2" Winchester AA hulls. The shape of the base makes a difference when it comes to powder charge. Also not every brand of hull is the same length before or after crimping. You can have your press dialed in for one hull and when you switch hulls you might be over crimping or under crimping.

For anyone new, I highly suggest getting shot shell reloading manual or two along with going to Hodgdon's website for load data.
 
To add, when I first got into shot shell loading back in the 1980's, I kept every hull of any description possible. There were not as many brands on the market then as now so we are not talking lots of different hulls to deal with.

It was a bit of pain to make adjustments to the press to account for the different hull, wad, and powder charge. Eventually, I stayed with one brand.

When I was shooting competitive skeet, I'd shoot new ammunition in the matches in part to generate hulls for practice, then shoot my reloads for practice.

I found the better quality ammunition had hulls that had a longer reload life. I used Winchester AA for the most part but there are other good hulls out there.
 
Shot is the killer.
What is it up to?
Like $50 a bag?
Check your local scrap yard I got a metal coffee can full of new bird shot. Meth heads must have stolen old shot gun shells, took them apart in stead of selling them as is.
Looks like mostly 7.5 shot with a little 6 mixed in and some lead BBs, easy enough to pick out the BBs. $3 for 31lb for a mix of 6 and 7.5 shot is just fine with me it will still kill clays and upland birds just fine.
 
12Bravo20 said:
I highly suggest getting shot shell reloading manual or two along with going to Hodgdon's website for load data.
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+1 I admit to skeet loads primarily... but a wild hare on occasion.
https://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=612870

But Lyman's, Hodgdon web, and the loading sheets that come w/ Claybuster Wads are a treasure-trove. Find something you can get, and just stick with it.

postscript:
w/ my 410, I just standardized on
1/2 OZ
AA
Claybuster 5050-410HS(red)
H110 / 16.8 (MEC 12A)
RIO primers
1,290 . . . .

. . . . and walked away
(oh, and a little motor-mica in the shot to keep the filled 410 wad column from being pulled out on lifting the fill-tube)





post postscript: Try buyig any 410 these days ?
:cuss:
 
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Since I haven't shot skeet in a long time, I just stick with reloading 3" 410 shells for hunting. I like having the 11/16 ounce payload over 1/2 ounce limit with 2 1/2" hulls.

After working with Hodgdon and Ballistics Products, we came up with safe load data for my combination of hulls and powder for reloading 3" 000 buckshot loads that works very well for HD/SD uses. I mention this to show that you can contact the different companies and some will work with you on load data. Both Ballistic Product and Hodgdon were nice to work with.
 
I started with a mec Jr. in 16 ga back in the late '70s, and now have a mec 650 in .410 (estate sale gem), and a mec Super 600 in 12 ga (hand me-down-from a generous brother-in-law). All perform very well. I agree that using one press and switching gauges would be a pain, and given the cost of conversion kits, and the time involved dialing things in, I'm not sure it's worth it.

The price of shot is now crazy. I need to look into the reclaimed option.

MEHavey, I'll have to try your advice on the motor-mica for .410. Thanks for that. Shot bridging or pulling up the wad column has brought a few of my .410 reloading sessions to a screeching halt! Cleaning up all those spilled pellets is tedious. P51D :cool:
 
I would just get a lyman manual so you can pick whatever hull-wad-primer-powder-shot combo you can reasonably obtain and stick with it. I went single stage and glad I did.
 
P51D said:
...motor-mica for .410
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I also put an 1/8 tsp in a quart (or smaller 2-cup) tupperware container and shake all the wads in it til coated very-finely. *
That completely stopped all tendency to pull those tiny 410 shot-filled wads up w/ the shot tube upon withdrawing.
powdered graphite would also work, but messier on handling components.


* There's usually enough residual mica in the Tupperware to shake two more loads w/o adding add'l.
The mica also collects a fine dusting on the surfaces of the wad guide to coat lightly on any missed wads.
Magic stuff.
 
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