rayatphonix
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I also have a 6.5 Norma/284, and can’t see enough difference between that and the 6.5 PRC. That said, if I didn’t already have a Norma, I’d likely have the PRC mainly because there’s a bigger variety of rifles to choose from.
6.5 PRC The Fastest Growing Hunting cartridge
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David Hoback
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I prefer the 6.5-284 hands down!
Honestly, I’m not a fan of going any larger case volume with .264” bore. If I’m doing a magnum, it’s going to be .284” or .308”. Otherwise it’s just over bore nightmare! Which is the case with the PRC.
And to jmr40, I never said anything about stopping innovation, so don’t put words in my mouth sport!
I’m talking about REBOOTS, which is what the PRC is! Also, I’ll respectfully disagree with what you said… Show me in history, where small changes led to something completely new? Weaponry is what it is, until something BETTER comes along! People used spears to throw until the bow was created. Then they used bows until firearms. There were no “small changes” to either which gave way to the next. That said, do NOT mistake me for a FUDD! I’m in my 40’s & I am a fan of modern tech & weaponry. I prefer Aluminum Chassis over wood stock, and Kydex/Nylon over leather! But I call out REBOOTS when I seem ‘em. Just like the 300aac… No different than when it FIRST came out as the Whisper! The 6.5prc is just another choice of the Winchester or Remington Short Mags, and the Creedmoor didn’t do anything new that reloaders hadn’t already been doing with the 260 for decades.
That’s all I was pointing out.
Honestly, I’m not a fan of going any larger case volume with .264” bore. If I’m doing a magnum, it’s going to be .284” or .308”. Otherwise it’s just over bore nightmare! Which is the case with the PRC.
And to jmr40, I never said anything about stopping innovation, so don’t put words in my mouth sport!
I’m talking about REBOOTS, which is what the PRC is! Also, I’ll respectfully disagree with what you said… Show me in history, where small changes led to something completely new? Weaponry is what it is, until something BETTER comes along! People used spears to throw until the bow was created. Then they used bows until firearms. There were no “small changes” to either which gave way to the next. That said, do NOT mistake me for a FUDD! I’m in my 40’s & I am a fan of modern tech & weaponry. I prefer Aluminum Chassis over wood stock, and Kydex/Nylon over leather! But I call out REBOOTS when I seem ‘em. Just like the 300aac… No different than when it FIRST came out as the Whisper! The 6.5prc is just another choice of the Winchester or Remington Short Mags, and the Creedmoor didn’t do anything new that reloaders hadn’t already been doing with the 260 for decades. That’s all I was pointing out.
citizenconn
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I haven't had any "overbore nightmares" with the handloads we use, nor with the factory ammo I've tried. I do like my 6.5-284 and have not gotten rid of it or ceased to use it. But I do think the 6.5 PRC is easier to load for and a little more efficient design. And I see more rifles available for it, probably because of the Hornady association. They usually garner pretty good industry support before they drop a new chambering.
I don't understand why some people seem to get so angry, not saying you personally, when a new cartridge comes out. But "overbore nightmare" seems like a bit of hyperbole to me. I always attempt to try before I buy. I bought a couple of Savage PRC rifles and they are sweet shooters, bolt lift withstanding, and very accurate. I see marked long range advantage past 900 yards with the PRC over the 6.5 CR. I personally see a little improvement with the 6.5 PRC over my 6.5-284 but that could be rifle differences or the way my shooting partner handloads them.
I've got room for both of them. For those who can't buy both or don't desire to, try to shoot them both before you decide. Variety is the spice of life according to an old saying. Better many options than none.
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David Hoback
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No, sorry.. Didn’t mean the PRC was WAY over bore. I meant going full Magnum with the smaller bores. The PRC is only the beginning. And if the loads are backed off a bit, it’s never an issue. But when run up to it’s full potential, MAX loads certainly are overbore.
citizenconn
Member
It's all good; I didn't take offense. I respect everyone's opinions.
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Im of the opinion that while not necessarily giving way to the next, the "bow" has evolved into a very different weapon than what it started out as.
Even the adaptation of using traditional composite materials and non D form factors allowed for a greater usage range than just a straightish piece of wood and string.
Modern wheel bows are almost entirely different mouse traps than their traditional counterparts, as are modern crossbows, and airbows, tho they still do the same thing in the end.
Arrows and points have gone thru an significant "improvements" as well, much like our "modern" bullets. While they look awful similar, and still perform the same basic function.
Firearms have done much of the same. At the end of the day they still attempt to deliver a projectile to a target, but an over the counter Savage Axis in 6.5CM will on average do so "better" than anything similar from even 100 years previous.
The difference is just culmination of all of the common innovations that have gone into creating the modern "budget rifle"
There are also dead ends in development, of which stuffing more and more powder under a projectile is one imo.....but as a hobbyist, those are some of my favorite cartridge designs to explore.
I havent gone as far as an 80gr case in the .264 bore, but the .264WM loaded with RL-33 and topped with a VLD is an impressive cartridge, as are the other big inefficient magnums.
....just my rambling thoughts lol
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citizenconn
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I think "inefficient" being the key word here.
When I was looking for a better long range cartridge that would take me more easily to 1500 yards, 1 mile, eventually 2500 yards, I looked seriously at the 300 WM and the 338 LM, but their case design and in the case of the 338 the cost, kept me from pulling the trigger on one in favor of the 300 PRC. Sure, the 300 WM, with a custom longer throat, can be loaded where it has similar ballistics to the PRC, I've read. But I wanted an off the shelf rifle with decent factory ammo support that would be easy for my shooting partner who does our reloading to handload.
I looked seriously at the 300 Norma Mag and was about to pull the trigger on one when they came out with the PRC. I hemmed and hawed for a while and eventually got a couple Savages in 300 PRC. I like the more modern, efficient case design and lack of belt. I wasn't already invested in 300 WM cases or dies or rifles so it was pretty easy to rule that one out, though I think its a fine legacy chambering which I shot some in the military.
I decided against the 338 LM because I thought it was expensive, overpowered and inefficient for what I wanted to do which was shoot a mile to 2000, maybe 2500, yards. I have a bunch of LM brass I picked up at the shooting range from when the Ruger Precision Rifle came out in that flavor. I'd watch those guys mag dump it at the range, shooting 2, 3, 4 boxes and all I could think as they shot was $5, $5, $5, $5, $5. This was before the pandemic when $5 a shot was pretty unusual.
I still think the 300 Norma Magnum is a fine cartridge and may still get one if I find the right rifle. Anyone here have one? What can you share about what you like about it and maybe why you would pick it over other chamberings?
As far as the 264 WM, I have been itching to get one of those ever since I picked up a pile (150) of pristine brass at the range a few months ago. I've bid on a number of them on gunbroker, but bidders seem to go crazy bidding for rifles in that particular chambering, especially left handed ones. I have no problem shooting most right handed rifles because I buy ones that are handedness neutral or put them in a chassis. But a lot of the older rifles chambered in 6.5 WM have very right handed specific stocks. Anyone, the search goes on for one that floats my boat, even if it is an old, inefficient, and overbore cartridge. I am (getting) old, am inefficient to a fault and my ex-wife would probably say, if not "overbore" then definitely a "bore."
David Hoback
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Oh yeah, I didn’t figure you were.
I’m glad you pointed it out so I could expound. It definitely was misleading the way I stated it. Unfortunately my brain does that at times. Kinda merges two thoughts & one sentence in t’other.I’ll also add, I’ve no major problem with the 6.5prc. The factory backing of it has been good. So that’s good.
My only point was it’s not anything we haven’t seen. Just expressing my thoughts. Now, if we are talking about running out to a mile, I guess theoretically it’ll have a bit easier time than the smaller volume 6.5’s (260 & Creedmoor) But either of the two will still get out that far. And if I’m going for ELR shooting ranges, I wouldn’t want just good enough. Big, heavy caliber & a full Magnum load. And being I like doing my own stuff, I’d likely go a bit on the weird side, with a 7mm-300, or maybe the 7mm Practical. But then, I could just do a 7 or 300 RUM. Thing is…, I don’t like Teeth rattlin’, BONE jarring recoil.
But I digress. The question asked by the OP was if the 6.5PRC is the fastest growing hunting cartridge. And I believe the resounding opinion is it in fact is NOT even in the running for the MOST popular. Honestly… if I was a betting man, I’d say the three most popular hunting cartridges by far, are still 30-06, 7mm RM & 300 WinMag. And to a lesser degree, 270 Win & 223 Rem. But that’s just my betting’ money. And if the Creedmoor is brought into it, I’d also bet the vast majority of Creedmoors are owned by people who don’t hunt, don’t reload, and likely don’t even shoot that much. Oh yeah air a second… that’s ME! Well, since being disabled anyway, LOL!
troy fairweather
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The 6.5 prc is just about exactly the same powder capacity as the 270 win.
David Hoback
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citizenconn
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I think you are right on the money there, especially with the 7mm RM in the Western US. It's probably neck and neck with the 300WM.
I have a .30-06 in an MDT chassis and mostly use it with a brake or suppressor. When I wanted a long range target rifle that would also double as a long range hunting rifle I got a .300 PRC. I load it anywhere from 180 to 250 grain, though most of the hunting bullets me and my hunting partner (Dad) use are 212 to 225. The 250 are A-tips and cost way too much and are reserved for target shooting past 1000 yards.
I also still really like the .270 Win for hunting. I considered the .270 WSM but never pulled the trigger on one since I am in Texas and mule deer is about the biggest critter I am likely to encounter outside a private ranch. Now that the 6.8 Western is out I'd go that way instead. I think I'd prefer the 6.8 Western over the 6.5 PRC for hunting, but with the 7mm PRC coming out that's probably an even better option.
It's great to have more and more options, even if many of them are darn near the same thing in a new wrapper.
The .264WM factory chambering is limited by two factors, usually it runs a 1-9 or so twist, and the throats on factory guns are short to cram it into a 30-06 length action.....kinda like the 300wm in that respect.
I cant help with the 300NM, tho my buddy and I were looking at it for a similar use and are on the fence for much the same reasons. The LPM also.
WisBorn
Contributing Member
The fastest growing cartridge 6.5 PCR?
I have not seen a rifle chambered in it ?!?!
I have only visited a few shops though. Based on the new rifles that I have seen in the racks the 6.5 CM and 308 win are the most popular.
I have not seen a rifle chambered in it ?!?!
I have only visited a few shops though. Based on the new rifles that I have seen in the racks the 6.5 CM and 308 win are the most popular.
InTheSwamp
Member
Yeah, it's hard to tell by the rifles in stock at gun shops. I visit 4 or 5 regularly, and the only PRC I've seen is the RPR. But, "fastest-growing" is not determined by how many are in stock, but by today's sales vs yesterday's.
The online shops do have a healthy stock of PRC, and more manufacturers are jumping on it. Bud's, love them or hate them, is a good indicator of what's hot, or not.
dogtown tom
Member
So what do you think is "hot" from that inventory count?
"in stock" status isn't an indicator of sales. It may actually show what IS NOT selling.
And with Bud's you never know if that's their stock or a live inventory feed from a distributor.
dogtown tom
Member
Forty years ago I would have agreed with 30-06. But today? Not even a contender.
Oddly, no mention of .308? .30-30?
I'll see fifty times as many .308's as I do .30-06. I'll see more 6.5 Creed than .30-06
As far as the popularity of 5.56/.223? More than a few here in Texas use the same AR in 5.56/.223 to hunt deer as they use to hunt hogs. It may be more popular than 30-06.
InTheSwamp
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That's irrelevant. You don't stock inventory that doesn't move. Whether Bud's, Caterpillar, or Dell.
dogtown tom
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Never been a gun dealer have you?
Heck, never been a retailer of any product have you?
Even WalMart, the largest retailer in the world, will have product "that doesn't move"......it gets put on the clearance aisle.
Inventory that does move, doesn't stay in stock for very long.
InTheSwamp
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Never been a gun dealer have you?
Heck, never been a retailer of any product have you?
Even WalMart, the largest retailer in the world, will have product "that doesn't move"......it gets put on the clearance aisle.
Inventory that does move, doesn't stay in stock for very long.
It actually does, because it sells. The supply chain will keep the shelves stocked, in order to make money... Because IT SELLS.
No seller would spend any money, stocking, or advertising something that does not sell. Got it?
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CoalTrain49
Member
Given the fact that most of the new compact cartridges have been developed by ammo manufacturers I'd say it's likely just marketing driven. I think it's a bit like new car manufacturers having something new and different to sell regardless of the advancement in any new combustion engine technology. Hornady would probably be the money behind the marketing.
The last three new rifles I bought were .223/5.56. Mostly because I knew ammo would be available. I don't hunt anymore but if I did I would probably just buy a 30 caliber something or other. That checks a lot of boxes for me.
Can anyone imagine how cheap a .308 rifle and ammo would be if for some reason that was the only thing anyone could produce.
The last three new rifles I bought were .223/5.56. Mostly because I knew ammo would be available. I don't hunt anymore but if I did I would probably just buy a 30 caliber something or other. That checks a lot of boxes for me.
Can anyone imagine how cheap a .308 rifle and ammo would be if for some reason that was the only thing anyone could produce.
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Gordon
Member
I'll stick with .264 WinMag , 45 years now. Always usually used 140 grain bullets. I could take an elk if I had too ( a good one showed up and I had a tag) , but long range deer and especially antelope is the targeted game. All-around light hunting mode I use a .270 WSM which will dependably take Elk . Just Elk I gave son my .300 weatherby and I use a beloved .375 H&H , actually a reamed out one for .375 weatherby.
Edited to note my son currently uses a Thompson Center tuned 6.5 CM with 140 grain bullets with a suppressor for deer hunting and a .300 Weatherby with a muzzle brake for elk hunts.
Edited to note my son currently uses a Thompson Center tuned 6.5 CM with 140 grain bullets with a suppressor for deer hunting and a .300 Weatherby with a muzzle brake for elk hunts.
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WisBorn
Contributing Member
Was the 6.5 PRC developed primarily for hunting?
troy fairweather
Member
Precision rifle cartridge
dogtown tom
Member
When an item is OOS at a retailer, its because its sold out, because the distributor is also OOS or the manufacturer cannot keep up with demand.
OR
Because the retailer decided not to reorder, the distributor deccided not to reorder or the manufacturer discontinued production.
Your near total ignorance of the "supply chain" in regards to firearms is laughable. The "supply chain" doesn't keep the shelves stocked with the most popular firearms because the firearms industry ain't like selling butter, eggs and canned goods. Mom&Pop gun stores ordering ten guns a week aren't going to enjoy the discounts that Academy and Cabelas do, nor will they have their orders given priority (called allocations) on product in greatest demand.
Yet every day, all over the world, salesman convince buyers to buy their wonder product. And it doesn't always sell.
For firearms, that would include the Glocks in .45GAP, Rock Island 1911's in .22TCM, the Colt M4 rimfire or Mossberg 715 rimfire AR's..............guns that dealers bought that stayed on the shelf until they sold at a loss. Heck, compare the sales of any handgun in .40S&W fifteen years ago vs today. There was a massive decrease in the sales of .40 handguns once the FBI said nope, we going back to 9mm. So did the gun buying public.
See, you think no seller would spend any money selling, stocking or advertising something that does not sell..........yet right there......thems called examples of stuff that was heavily advertised, stocked and sold. I have more examples if you want them.
I do. You don't.
Didn't read it did ya?
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WisBorn
Contributing Member
I guess I'm not surprised that it is growing as a hunting cartridge with 200 fps more velocity than the 6.5 cm. Both cartridges designed for target shooting that work well for medium sized game.
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