Semi-auto Fighting Shotguns

Read Ayoob…he likes 20 ga autos….75% of the punch, 50% of the recoil….

A past thread on 1301 and 930 reliability:

https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/mossberg-930-auto-reliability.906026/#post-12305078

Only self-loader I trust enough for HD would be an Auto 5, but Im not a fan of shotguns for combat anyway.

Semiautomatic shotguns I would trust for HD, in order:
1. Benelli M4
2. Beretta 1301
3. Remington 1100, if maintained by me personally.
4. A-5/ Rem. 11, if maintained by me personally.
The shotgun I actually keep for HD?
An Ithaca 37.

Im really not a big fan of shotguns for anything but hunting, but I do have a few, both pump and auto, and most of them arent set up for hunting. For hunting, I use my old SKB O/U 20 ga.

I have an old 1100 that Ive had since the 80's. I used to hunt with it some, but its been wearing a 20" rifle sighted barrel and a pistol grip stock for about 25 years now. Its always been reliable with heavy buck and slug loads.

I hunted with my dads old Auto 5 a few times as a teen. I always hated that thing, as it was long and heavy. Sucked carrying it around all day. I was more accustomed to my Ithaca Model 37, which was quite a bit lighter and handier.

The Auto 5 always seemed to work OK, but with that long barrel and the weight, it wasnt "handy" and wouldn't be my choice unless I had nothing else. I have seen a couple that were cut down just in front of the fore-end the past couple of years, and they looked like they might be a bit of a different critter.

More recently, Ive picked up a couple of the Lynx12 AK type shotguns. They are a copy of the Russian Saigas. The more I shoot them, the more I like them. They are handy like any other AK, and for the most part, handle and work just like one. They shoulder and shoot very naturally too. They have a manual BHO, and load a little differently, but its still basically the same as any AK.

I have 5 and 10 round mags for them and they are pretty handy. Its nice to just have a chestbag already loaded and not have to deal with loose rounds, bulky bags, or those typical crappy belts that always seem to be missing rounds when you go to get some. Its also nice to be able to quickly fully load the gun, or empty it if need be. And a simple mag change instantly tops off the gun. Like anything else though, you do need to put in some time with them to figure things out and get it down.

They have an adjustable gas system, and so far, with it set for the #1 buck loads I normally use in them, they have reliably fed anything Ive put in them, but the low brass Dove loads. Those worked too for the most part, but I did have a couple of stoppages when the guns were new.

If youre an AK fan, or even if you arent, they are certainly with a look. Very reasonably priced too.

My only semi-auto shotgun is a modified Sportsman 48. I bought it used from the LGS for $125 in 1998, and in the past couple years I had it fully converted to a classic looking fighting platform- 18.5" shortend barrel, hunting dimples removed for 4+1 capacity, Kickeez pad installed, and sling studs fitted.

I have an FN SLP. Got it without the pistol grip. Has been 100% reliable when fed a diet of what it likes. Came with two gas pistons or what ever you call them. Had to swap that out. Didn’t like certain brands of double oh’s. Test before you trust the ammo. Replaced the sights with tritium ones. Can’t find extra barrels. And the ones I can cost a bunch and are not what I want. Easy to clean. Well made.

Also have a Linberta. Reliable as the day is long. If it breaks, it’s a throw away. Parts are non existent. And lastly a Mossberg 9200 that was made on Wednesday. It works well. Again, not know for reliability so also a throwaway if it breaks.

In my experience a pump is more reliable in theory, but in practice a semi-auto is more reliable. Most pumps fail due to operator error. Kept reasonably clean and used with halfway decent ammo MOST name brand semi-auto shotguns are boringly reliable. There are some I wouldn't trust.

A pump will continue to function if neglected and abused. It will function with many light loads that a semi-auto won't handle. I suppose in a survival or TEOTWAWKI situation I'd rather have a pump. But for normal SD situations I trust my Benelli M1. I'd also trust the Beretta, and Remington's I've owned. Same with Browning and Winchester.

As others have stated a shotgun isn't my 1st choice. But I do keep a Benelli and an 870 ready just in case. I'd reach for the Benelli 1st if I heard a bump in the dark.

I have had good experiences with the mil issue Benelli auto as well as the Mossberg 930 JM pro I used in my 3 gun days. The Benelli stayed in the arms room, and the 930 found a new home when I hung up my 3 gun spurs. Pump action guns are what I have available now, if required for any type of defensive use.

I have plenty of options in handguns, rifles, and shotguns, but if I had to defend myself or my family in a HD type of situation, I wouldn't need more than about half a second to select the Browning Auto 5.

I recently paid a lot of money for a Benelli M4 (even got the H2O finish). I think all Benellis are way over-priced (I also have a Nova and an SBEII) but the quality, workmanship, design and material is good enough for me to pay the inflated freight. So far, the M4 has not disappointed in the criteria I am most concerned with when it comes to any firearm intended for self-defense: extreme reliability. The jury is still out for my M4: only time and many more shots downrange will tell me if my money was well-spent.

Personally, I would recommend the gun you are most familiar with. I have a couple of Browning B80s. I shoot 1,000s of rounds out of them annually. 40 year old semi auto shotguns and very rarely have a failure to eject or failure to feed. I get the pump idea but I would argue that it’s more likely for you to short stroke a pump than for an auto to malfunction.

I took my A5 upland hunting a few times last year. Never failed, during the first covey rise, I would fail to get the safety off. (B80- safety in front of trigger, A5-safety behind the trigger)

Thus my recommendation to use what you’ve built muscle memory with.

I'm not a big shotgun guy myself, but I have a couple. One is a creepy joe approved double barrel, the other a 930. I haven't shot either very much, but so far so good. I got my 930 before the 1301 came out, but probably couldn't afford one anyhow, so I'll just stick with it. As I said... so far... so good, and I don't use them much. I'm more of a rifle guy.

jmr40 said:

In my experience a pump is more reliable in theory, but in practice a semi-auto is more reliable. Most pumps fail due to operator error. Kept reasonably clean and used with halfway decent ammo MOST name brand semi-auto shotguns are boringly reliable. There are some I wouldn't trust.

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I agree. I've never been that much of a pump-gun guy (though I own more of them than any other type of shotgun), but I've shot with and hunted with quite a few people who used them. Numerous times I've seen people short-stroke them, fail to pump them, or otherwise themselves be the cause of the failure to fire off a round when intended (especially a 2nd round) during a time of "excitement." This might be a covey rise, a dove fly-by, doubles in skeet, or pretty much any surprise or rushed circumstance.

And these instances were while we were just out having fun. I can imagine that in a life-or-death situation, things are likely to go much worse. I don't think I'd recommend a pump as a "fighting" gun for someone who isn't pretty highly experienced with one.

Browning A5/Remington Model 11 all the way. 20" barrel with choke tubes, LPA sights, plastic forearm with shock absorber.
The old guy with the old gun keeps chugging alone, while younger guys with newer designs choke.

For me shotguns are for hunting. I use pistols for self defense on the street and in home. 45acp is my preferred caliber for defense but often carry a 9 for a more compact carry package.

I find pistols much more maneuverable and quicker to point when walking through my house. Even short barreled shotguns can be somewhat inconvenient to maneuver through the house with. For me a long barreled shotgun is pretty much worthless for home defense.

P.S. I have short-stroked more pumps than I have ever had jams in semi-auto shotguns, by far. I guess I am just really not a shotgun person!

I got a FN SLP. It does what I need for home defense and a nice short barrel for hunting. Even used it for sporting clays. Don't ask. Without the pistol grip it looks like every other shotgun.

Duha, I prefer saiga S-12 made in Izhmash factory.

I set out my Rem 1100 slug/3gun shotgun to deal with the covid zombies. There are also a rifle and a pistol around the house, more a case of which weapon am I closest to when a weapon is needed.

I absolutely prefer an auto loader over a pump. I never understood the mistrust of auto loading shotguns by guys who carry auto loading pistols and rifles.

I’d certainly want to make sure they are reliable, but I’d look at any Benelli, Beretta, older Rem 1100. I have a CZ 712 I have total confidence in based on thousands of rounds of low and high brass.

I have a pump Mossy 500 from 1982 I have set up with slugs, but my primary HD guns are rifles and handguns.

If I thought I should have a serious HD shotgun, it would be a semiautomatic for sure.

Buzznrose said:

I never understood the mistrust of auto loading shotguns by guys who carry auto loading pistols and rifles.

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That's been my thinking as well. If a HD shotgun should be a pump, shouldn't a HD handgun be a single-action revolver.

dh1633pm said:

I got a FN SLP. It does what I need for home defense and a nice short barrel for hunting. Even used it for sporting clays. Don't ask. Without the pistol grip it looks like every other shotgun.

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That's what I have. I like the rifle sights.

I added a +3 mag tube for 3 gun so it's an 8+1. It runs heavy birdshot and all the slugs/buck I've put in it.

I am a little more careful to keep it clean, though, so I don't know what happens when it gets real dirty.

My problem is running keeping the gun fed. It takes me a couple of seconds to empty it... A bit more to load it again. I can quad load but I'm not amazing at it. Doubles are easier for me.

Now sure, that's a whole lot of lead down range, but you had best solve the problem on the first tube.

That being said, if you are on a farm or similar you have the option of all kinds of different rounds for different things.

I got a Armscor VR80 for $600. If there is something it can't do, I haven't fount it yet. I left magazines loaded for over a year to see if the shells would deform and fail to feed, and it ate through without a burp. It is under my bed with a 10-rd magazine.

I have a Beretta 1301 Tactical. Great gun, bought all of the Aridus Toys for it, Magpul Stock, Nordic Comp mag extension, Benelli Metal Shell Follower, Fancy Charging Handle, nice sling, Green Dot that co-witnesses with the irons.
The Beretta 1301 gas system is superb and I would stake my life on this gun, it can cycle faster than I can pull the trigger and so far, a few hundred rounds of assorted ammo, not one FTF or FTE.

The only real downside for HD is its a bit long for maneuvering in confined spaces and it only holds 7 + 1. My Smith & Wesson M&P 12 Bullpup is a pump but holds 15 rounds or regular shells or 23 rounds of Mini Shells. But the main thing I dig on the M&P 12 is its OAL of 27.8" with no tax stamp for an SBS, that is perfect for narrow stairways and hallways of a three story townhouse.

The Tavor TS-12 is sweet, but I wouldn't stake my life on its reliability, it's pretty ammo finicky for some, others say it eats everything they feed it so I am not sure who to believe.