Feeling Constrained At The Range

SimonRL said:
Just curious, do you reload? I shoot 2-3 times a week indoors at 2 different clubs. I recently had my lead levels checked and they were perfectly fine. However, my buddy who loads a lot had sky high levels.
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Yes, I reload, cast and shoot often, just do it outdoors almost always these days. I had been shooting weekly matches indoor on Wednesday night, when I became elevated. Quit that and just practiced during the week, kept shooting the Saturday and Sunday matches (outdoor) and then gradually went back down. There was actually a number of us it happened to at the time. The club actually quit holding the matches all together at that range shortly after. I would be curious to have a better understanding of their ventilation system, I suspect it was the problem.

Your doctor won’t check your blood/lead levels unless you ask them to. So, next time your in for your physical, all you need to do is remind them to check a little of that blood they drew. Then keep that up every year.

As far as loading, just treat your hands like they have poop on them, no sucking on fingers and wash them good when your done.
 
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I'm lucky to be surrounded by National Forest and BLM land. There's a nice county range close by with concrete benches for the 300 yard rifle range. A 1000 yard range with gongs and bunch of pistol pits. I don't go there much, but when I do it's in the morning during the week and I'm usually the only one there. No RSO. The nearest indoor range is 70 miles away. Never been there.
Some pics of the grandson shooting 10 minutes from our home.

20210705_085843.jpg 20200101_114914.jpg 20191031_141712.jpg 20180630_144202.jpg
 
A couple years ago the only remaining unsupervised range I'm aware of in my area (the Lapeer Pit) "went legit" and now has all the restrictions and none of the fun.
All lanes are now under a very nice shelter with a concrete table and enough walls & barriers to trigger your claustrophobia. This means there's no more stand-up lanes at all--which is just ridiculous.

I'm so jealous of all those YouTube videos showing draw & fire, double-taps, rapid fire, silhouettes, etc.
Ain't none of that allowed around here.

I guess all the rules are now necessary because nobody is permitted the opportunity to get proficient at anything except s l o w fire off sandbags at measured distances to bullseye targets.
You know... Real-world action. /s
 
Guy48065 said:
I guess all the rules are now necessary because nobody is permitted the opportunity to get proficient at anything except s l o w fire off sandbags at measured distances to bullseye targets.
You know... Real-world action. /s
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You could always go buy some open land and shoot any way you want as long as the projectiles stay on your property.

Your open to the public daily range had an open house event yesterday. For the most part of the day the 25yd range with 22 benches was completely full with waiting lists and then the 100yd range with 44 benches was also full the whole day. These are again open to the public ranges with shooter levels from newbie to Bench Rest shooters. Both of those ranges employed 3 RO's plus a CRSO for the entire day. Might have cramped some's styles but everyone went home with the same holes they came with.

Morale of this story, Not everyone can afford their own range.
 
kmw1954 said:
You could always go buy some open land and shoot any way you want as long as the projectiles stay on your property.

Your open to the public daily range had an open house event yesterday. For the most part of the day the 25yd range with 22 benches was completely full with waiting lists and then the 100yd range with 44 benches was also full the whole day. These are again open to the public ranges with shooter levels from newbie to Bench Rest shooters. Both of those ranges employed 3 RO's plus a CRSO for the entire day. Might have cramped some's styles but everyone went home with the same holes they came with.

Morale of this story, Not everyone can afford their own range.
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You're not describing the Lapeer Pit which is a fraction of that size (6 100-yd lanes) & only has one available RSO so their hours are extremely limited.
I'm not sure I see your point in the context of this discussion.
 
Guy48065 said:
I'm not sure I see your point in the context of this discussion.
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The whole discussion revolves around individuals being restricted as to what they can do while at a public range. Having to abide by whatever safety range rules that have been put in place. When in actuality all those rules are a means to control the clientele from performing unsafe practices. Just because you are trained and competent in the handling of you firearm does not automatically mean the person next to you is at the same level.

I explain to people that the range rules are in place to protect me from you, you from me and us from everyone else. Come spend a week with me as an RO on this range and then maybe you will understand and see some of the ignorant things I see on a daily basis.
 
kmw1954 said:
The whole discussion revolves around individuals being restricted as to what they can do while at a public range. Having to abide by whatever safety range rules that have been put in place. When in actuality all those rules are a means to control the clientele from performing unsafe practices. Just because you are trained and competent in the handling of you firearm does not automatically mean the person next to you is at the same level.

I explain to people that the range rules are in place to protect me from you, you from me and us from everyone else. Come spend a week with me as an RO on this range and then maybe you will understand and see some of the ignorant things I see on a daily basis.
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Seems like the safest thing to do at the shooting range, is just ban ammunition completely. Then the only danger will be slips, trips and falls.
 
kmw1954 said:
Guess that would be better than being shot by some careless idiot!
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Yep. Shut all the ranges down. No more shooting. /s

The point of an RSO is to keep the shooters in their booths, with the guns aimed down range. If a shooter can't accomplish that despite being told before entering the range, and then told once again by the RSO (who should be watching because it's their job), that individual needs to be booted by the RSO. Pretty simple really. That's what RSOs are for, to make sure people aren't doing stupid things.

And before you say that's too difficult to accomplish, I've seen it done. For years I was a member at a range where it was done that way. With approval (which was easy to get, simply by displaying competence) people could rapid fire, draw from the holster, from concealment (in any carry position where the gun only pointed down and forwards through the draw stroke), remove the bench themselves, and rake back their own brass from beyond the firing line. But it wasn't completely a member's only range. People came in for trials and members brought in guests frequently. By frequently, I mean almost every time I was there. The front end staff did their jobs of firmly and clearly explaining the range rules, and the RSOs strictly enforced them.

Those RSOs watched people like hawks, and were extremely proactive. They could watch a person and assess the likelihood of that individual (or sometimes pair or group) doing something unsafe. They watched the potential liabilities far more closely, and often stayed closer to them. They did their jobs well and were very effective.
 
Each range is able to set their own rules and procedures and that is the way it should be. The range I work is a Daily fee open to the public owned by the state DNR. Because of the volume of people and varying levels of competence they have determined to set some very strict but general rules for everyone safety. I as a RO do not always agree to some of those rules but I must adhere to them just the same.

My general feeling is this; follow the rules, be courteous to your neighbors, have a good time and I will leave you alone to enjoy your visit. I am not there to instruct anyone or embarrass anyone. My job is to keep everyone and the facility safe, period. Yes if someone is having a problem I will do my best to help them out as long as it does not distract me from watching the range.

Simply put, if you do not agree with any of the ranges rules then you simply need to find some other place to shoot, more to your liking. If that means buying a membership then do it.
 
kmw1954 said:
Simply put, if you do not agree with any of the ranges rules then you simply need to find some other place to shoot, more to your liking.
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Bingo! Which is why I now shoot outside in national forest. The reason for the OP was to try and figure out if I would continue to restrict my practice, or find somewhere else. I'm sure some people get a lot of value out of just shooting their guns slow fire from a low ready, but it turns out I need to incorporate more into my range time to see practical benefits.
 
I have a cottage 200 miles away--far from any big cities. There's a DNR range there that's unfenced & unsupervised. There is a pistol shooting area with a high rail, and a rifle bench rest area with several low concrete tables--all under a long roof with no dividers between lanes.

I've never seen any blood there.

Being far away from the punks and idiots where there's still a bit of respect & concern for others is key and it's refreshing to practice there at MY pace, or to break in a new pistol in an hour.
The Lapeer Pit used to be that kind of place but I guess 50 miles from The City isn't far enough any more.
 
Guy48065 said:
I've never seen any blood there..
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Last summer while working the 25yd pistol range I had a newb that ended his day with a slide bite on his thumb from knuckle to knuckle. 2 rolls of gauze and we sent him to the ER. Took me over an hr to fill out the accident report.
 
Shoot outdoors; you're lucky to have the option that many of us don't.

Also, it is better real-world practice. Sometimes it will be cold outside, or raining, snowing, etc. You can draw from your real holster with real cover garments.

Meanwhile, don't assume you can't influence that range's policies. Go and leave them an honest Google review. Let them know you won't be renewing your membership because it's annoying to be treated as a newbie EVERY time you go there.
 
Visited my local Range USA this weekend to find that they had removed all the tables from behind the firing line. I asked them why and was told the had several ADs where people were actually loading their guns at the table instead of loading their mags. The manager didn’t look too impressed when I told him he should have kept the tables and fired the ROs. Now that I think about it maybe they need a new manager too.
 
SimonRL said:
Visited my local Range USA this weekend to find that they had removed all the tables from behind the firing line. I asked them why and was told the had several ADs where people were actually loading their guns at the table instead of loading their mags. The manager didn’t look too impressed when I told him he should have kept the tables and fired the ROs. Now that I think about it maybe they need a new manager too.
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So instead of placing the blame on the maroons that caused the unsafe practice you want to blame the management. Typical.
An AD behind the firing line would have and should have had the maroons removed on the spot and asked not to return.
 
kmw1954 said:
So instead of placing the blame on the maroons that caused the unsafe practice you want to blame the management. Typical.
An AD behind the firing line would have and should have had the maroons removed on the spot and asked not to return.
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Seems pretty reasonable to place the blame at the feet of those who are employed specifically to prevent exactly that kind of dangerous situation.

A better question would be, how did the ROs not notice people were loading guns at the benches behind the firing line? And if they did notice it, why was it not stopped before the range suffered several ADs? It sounds like someone wasn't doing their job.
 
WrongHanded said:
Seems pretty reasonable to place the blame at the feet of those who are employed specifically to prevent exactly that kind of dangerous situation..
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Really?
How often do you work as an RO on a busy range?
I do not know the range being presented here but I can tell you that I have been in the position of trying to control a shooter at one end while a shooter at the other end was not following rules. At this range there are 44 benches and on the weekends all 44 can be full.

Recently I was doing a walk-through inspection after calling a cease fire. was halfway down the line and someone shouted out and pointed. I turned around and a shooter was already halfway down the range to his target before the all clear was given. As much as we would like we do not have eyes in the backs of our heads. So what would your reaction be to that happening to you?
 
kmw1954 said:
Really?
How often do you work as an RO on a busy range?
I do not know the range being presented here but I can tell you that I have been in the position of trying to control a shooter at one end while a shooter at the other end was not following rules. At this range there are 44 benches and on the weekends all 44 can be full.

Recently I was doing a walk-through inspection after calling a cease fire. was halfway down the line and someone shouted out and pointed. I turned around and a shooter was already halfway down the range to his target before the all clear was given. As much as we would like we do not have eyes in the backs of our heads. So what would your reaction be to that happening to you?
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Sounds like management needs to hire you a coworker. I'd probably go and tell them that, rather than continue to put myself at risk. It sounds like a place that cannot be controlled by one RO alone.
 
kmw1954 said:
So instead of placing the blame on the maroons that caused the unsafe practice you want to blame the management. Typical.
An AD behind the firing line would have and should have had the maroons removed on the spot and asked not to return.
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Management’s job is to protect its customers and if it doesn’t put the people in place to properly enforce the rules then changes have to be made. That’s business 101.
 
kmw1954 said:
Really?
How often do you work as an RO on a busy range?
I do not know the range being presented here but I can tell you that I have been in the position of trying to control a shooter at one end while a shooter at the other end was not following rules. At this range there are 44 benches and on the weekends all 44 can be full.

Recently I was doing a walk-through inspection after calling a cease fire. was halfway down the line and someone shouted out and pointed. I turned around and a shooter was already halfway down the range to his target before the all clear was given. As much as we would like we do not have eyes in the backs of our heads. So what would your reaction be to that happening to you?
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Hire more people.
 
SimonRL said:
put the people in place to properly enforce the rules then changes have to be made. That’s business 101.
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Only then we get people coming on forums like this and complaining about the unfair rules and their freedoms being constrained by the Range Nazi's... Yes I do see those comments made even on this kind forum.
 
I was on the board of directors for our club for ten years. Unfortunately these are constant problems with idiots. We were forced to implement more restrictions and people still tried to break the rules. Had to remove a few members and send others to remedial training. It’s a constant problem.
 
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