AMP press?

I watch winning in the wind, f-class John, and Eric Cortina on YouTube and all three of those guys are using them. If your at that level of competition it's just part of the cost of doing business. Do I want one, heck yes. Is it my next buy, I'd grab an auto trickler first. Sorting by seating pressure for a match makes a lot of sense, I'm just not able to justify the expenditure.

Its an interesting tool for testing seating force, but I think thats really about it. Testing things like effects of annealing, mandrel sizing, neck tension, etc. You can gather those data points to determine what it most consistent and most ideal for you.
I wouldnt load day to day on it as it isnt going to make more accurate ammo as pressing a bullet in with a regular press is the same as using this.

AJC1 said:

I watch winning in the wind, f-class John, and Eric Cortina on YouTube and all three of those guys are using them. If your at that level of competition it's just part of the cost of doing business. Do I want one, heck yes. Is it my next buy, I'd grab an auto trickler first. Sorting by seating pressure for a match makes a lot of sense, I'm just not able to justify the expenditure.

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The wise man understands the difference between his vocation and his avocations. The fool treats each the same.
I think a tool like this is meant more for the passionate professional than the interested hobbyist. Passionate professionals are jealous of their “tricks of the trade” and don’t tend to share the secrets of their success outside of the same vocational group which already knows about every trick and tool in the box. That’s probably why there’s so little discussion among interested hobbyists?

The question on whether or not to invest in that should be answered by 2 things: a) you're making a living shooting, and it improves your income potential or b) you have more dam money than you need and can afford to spend it on gadgets for the sake of having a gadget. Neither of those scenarios apply to me, so the likelihood of this in my future is less than zero %. I do however plan to buy an amp annealer and the amp mate automation addon.

Walkalong said:

I use the old fashioned method, if a bullet seats differently than the others, it gets relegated to practice, barrel warm up etc.. So the question exists, how much difference in seating pressure does there have to be to cause issues?

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I think it mostly important from a consistency of seating force measurement. Thats where the testing with this press I think is important, EI with a combination of annealing, this sizing die, and that mandrel the seating force becomes the most uniform, thus making the most consistent neck tension. I think its an interesting tool, but largely once that combination has been found, you could just seat on a normal press.

The AMP Press is awesome. I don’t have one yet, but it’s on my hit list for 2023. I’ve been playing with one at a buddy’s shop this year, learning how to load super-magnums, and after years using “Hydro-seaters,” this thing solves all of the issues I’ve ever had. The ability to watch the entire seating curve, then correlate the entire batch of ammo and cull any outliers based on the entire set, with the exact same stroke speed applied for each round really improves both the integrity of the seating force data and the utility of the data set.

If you’re measuring seating pressure and sorting ammo - for the reasons we do - then the AMP Press has no equal.

For what it’s worth, the ammo which set the Longest Competition Cold Bore World Record this fall was seated on an AMP press (minimum 3 shots, cold bore + 2, but he hit 4x).

It’s a bit slow and certainly more exacting than I’d want for my PRS ammo, but for ELR or long range BR/F-Class ammo, I would prioritize one on my bench.

AJC1 said:

I Is it my next buy, I'd grab an auto trickler first. .

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What kind are you going to buy? Top of the line?

gifbohane said:

What kind are you going to buy? Top of the line?

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It was a comparative priority. My chargemaster meets my needs currently as the only matches I'm shooting is lever Silhouette. If I get back to competing with the br and the boy is also then ill splurge on the auto trickler. I'm basically starting over letting the boys learning curve set the pace.

taliv said:

If it’s that great and been out a while why isn’t anyone talking about it?

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Idk, I guess I didn’t notice that nobody was talking about it. It has only been out since, what, mid-summer? Circles I run in have been cussing and discussing since then, guys have figured out how to modify the frame and base to accept big ELR cartridges, guys are hammering out how to use the data for culling ammo, I’ve talked to guys doing neck tension tests, stiction and short seating tests with it, chamfer and lube tests, ES and SD tests…

But in fairness, it’s not a broad market item. Think of how few folks seat on arbor presses at all, and then how few of us have force packs or hydro presses… and then how few of us among that niche within a niche within a niche would even consider paying $1400 for a seating press… not many guys will ever own one, and considering it’s only been on the market for ~4mos, eh, I’ve heard a lot more noise about it than it probably really deserves already.

gifbohane said:

What kind are you going to buy? Top of the line?

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AJC1 said:

It was a comparative priority. My chargemaster meets my needs currently as the only matches I'm shooting is lever Silhouette. If I get back to competing with the br and the boy is also then ill splurge on the auto trickler. I'm basically starting over letting the boys learning curve set the pace.

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At this point, I’d give the SuperTrickler time to get their poop in a group, and once that happens, despite being exceptionally happy with my V2 and V3 from MacDonald, I’d get the SuperTrickler (once reliably operational and debugged) instead of the AutoTrickler V4. I LOVE the V4, but I hate the fact it is 100% dependent upon the mobile app to function. At least the V3 could take manual input as well as Bluetooth control. REALLY hoping V5 comes out in 2024 with the same dual tube design and builds back local/manual control. Otherwise, my next unit would be a SuperTrickler.

Varminterror said:

At this point, I’d give the SuperTrickler time to get their poop in a group, and once that happens, despite being exceptionally happy with my V2 and V3 from MacDonald, I’d get the SuperTrickler (once reliably operational and debugged) instead of the AutoTrickler V4. I LOVE the V4, but I hate the fact it is 100% dependent upon the mobile app to function. At least the V3 could take manual input as well as Bluetooth control. REALLY hoping V5 comes out in 2024 with the same dual tube design and builds back local/manual control. Otherwise, my next unit would be a SuperTrickler.

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I own an AT v3. Probably one of the better purchases Ive ever made for reloading. Would a v4 make my reloading a ton faster? Possibly. But Im happy with what I got.
Ive been watching the SuperTrickler on their Facebook group since they started way back in the day. Very cool development process. I think they will eventually squash all the bugs on the software side.

GeoDudeFlorida said:

Passionate professionals are jealous of their “tricks of the trade” and don’t tend to share the secrets of their success outside of the same vocational group which already knows about every trick and tool in the box. That’s probably why there’s so little discussion among interested hobbyists?

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Being involved with auto racing for most of my professional life I understand closely regarded secrets as well as things done with “fooling” someone as the intent. It’s harder for competition to catch up, if they are fooling with things you already know are less fruitful.

I was really shocked when I entered competitive shooting, where almost everyone seems to share any and everything. All the way to the folks at the top of the various sports.

I’m with @jmorris - I have never experienced any of this in any shooting sport:

GeoDudeFlorida said:

Passionate professionals are jealous of their “tricks of the trade” and don’t tend to share the secrets of their success outside of the same vocational group which already knows about every trick and tool in the box. That’s probably why there’s so little discussion among interested hobbyists?

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Shooters tend to be open books - especially the guys making up the tip of the spear in competitive sports. Sure, you’ll occasionally find some mid-pack monkeys with inferiority complexes who act like jerks, but typically there’s extremely good tribal knowledge sharing by high level shooters. Hell, even Timmy Tactical pricks which sour the world of 3 gun have their ego gets the best of them so they can’t help but tell new shooters the better way they would do something…

Grappling martial arts - wrestling, Brazilian Jiu Jitsu, and Judo have all been that way in my experience as well. Open minds get welcomed with open arms, and nothing is a secret.

Rising tides raise all boats.

Kaldor said:

I own an AT v3. Probably one of the better purchases Ive ever made for reloading. Would a v4 make my reloading a ton faster?

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No, it wouldn’t make your reloading a ton faster than a V3, with the only exception being if you are loading magnum and super-magnum cartridges which take two strokes of the Auto-Throw on the V2/V3, and likely not even much faster for those, it seems.

The V4 does a little better with different powders than the V2/3, but really isn’t so different in performance. The V4 does take up less bench space, and it’s faster to adapt from one charge weight to the next, since we’re not manually adjusting the powder drop column any more - but if you have your throw and trickle tuned well on a V2/V3, you’re not going to speed up much on the V4 or the SuperTrickler.

What frustrates me so far seeing the ST take 2-5minutes to throw charges. I’m sure they’ll get this worked out, but it’s an issue today (including the one I’ve been able to touch). What also frustrates me is the (relatively naïve) product commercialization philosophy they use - they tried to produce a perfect device out of the gate, with a VERY long go-to-market phase, and have insisted they will not be releasing a second edition for “many years, if ever.” But we all know, products don’t survive contact with the enemy, AND we know consumers will buy continuous innovation, and when the incumbent product line releases new revisions every few years, it’s pretty clear that Adam has a great chance to keep outrunning them. I think a software patch on the ST will be a huge boon, they just need to get there.

Both of these are probably great analogies though - how many guys around here really have heard about the AutoTrickler/Throw set ups, or the Ingenuity Trickler, or the SuperTrickler - or the Prometheus? How many guys have heard of a K&M Force Pack or 21st Century Hydroseater, let alone heard of a Prazi press, or the Zero Press, or Hood Combo Press? Hell, most reloaders don’t even know about arbor presses… and most of this gear has been around a LONG time…

Niche within a niche within a niche within a niche.

Varminterror said:

No, it wouldn’t make your reloading a ton faster than a V3, with the only exception being if you are loading magnum and super-magnum cartridges which take two strokes of the Auto-Throw on the V2/V3, and likely not even much faster for those, it seems.

The V4 does a little better with different powders than the V2/3, but really isn’t so different in performance. The V4 does take up less bench space, and it’s faster to adapt from one charge weight to the next, since we’re not manually adjusting the powder drop column any more - but if you have your throw and trickle tuned well on a V2/V3, you’re not going to speed up much on the V4 or the SuperTrickler.

What frustrates me so far seeing the ST take 2-5minutes to throw charges. I’m sure they’ll get this worked out, but it’s an issue today (including the one I’ve been able to touch). What also frustrates me is the (relatively naïve) product commercialization philosophy they use - they tried to produce a perfect device out of the gate, with a VERY long go-to-market phase, and have insisted they will not be releasing a second edition for “many years, if ever.” But we all know, products don’t survive contact with the enemy, AND we know consumers will buy continuous innovation, and when the incumbent product line releases new revisions every few years, it’s pretty clear that Adam has a great chance to keep outrunning them. I think a software patch on the ST will be a huge boon, they just need to get there.

Both of these are probably great analogies though - how many guys around here really have heard about the AutoTrickler/Throw set ups, or the Ingenuity Trickler, or the SuperTrickler - or the Prometheus? How many guys have heard of a K&M Force Pack or 21st Century Hydroseater, let alone heard of a Prazi press, or the Zero Press, or Hood Combo Press? Hell, most reloaders don’t even know about arbor presses… and most of this gear has been around a LONG time…

Niche within a niche within a niche within a niche.

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The ability to switch powders more easily and not have the occasional drum catch on long stick powders is a draw for me on v4 for sure. I havent tested it yet as Im still building the rifle, but the highest throw Ill likely see is 75ish for my 300 PRC, so I dont think Ill need to double that.
Adam has done a good job continuing to move forward. Between the AT and Shotmarker, the AT taking my powder handling to the next level, and the SM giving me true precision feed back at the target when we set it at 600 and 1000, they were excellent purchases.
Your right about a niche of a niche of a niche though. Niche things for a niche crowd. But if they can make a buck, good for them.