Front Sight ALASKA?!

Status
Not open for further replies.
I haven't heard about it either in the gun shop world and I see zero/zip/nada in the way of actual DATES on any of the course pages.

I can't even think of a big enough range up that aways. :confused:

They talk about offering some guide services in 2004 on the "activities" page and thats about it for dates. You'd think it would have made news if they were up and running.

Isn't Piazza known for "optimistic" marketing techniques?
 
Doesn't he have some houses he needs to build near Pahrump first?
 
Well it looks like there were some September course offerings, but just one instructor is listed. Hopefully this isn't just a tax writeoff. "Well, nobody showed up for the classes, and here we are during moose season in Alaska with our rifles and gear. What to do, what to do" :D
 
Its on their website for Nevado too. Which is why I just don't trust the company and why I don't train there.

Thin The Herd
 
"Doesn't he have some houses he needs to build near Pahrump first?"

As I understand it, the homes that are going to be built at Frontsight Nevada are going to be custom homes. You just buy the property.


Scam ?
That is a pretty strong claim. What have you got to back it up ? I don't know much about it personally, but you must have some kind of inside information ?
 
As I understand it, the homes that are going to be built at Frontsight Nevada are going to be custom homes. You just buy the property.

I was just being flip, 444. I've been out there for training, heard the sales pitch over and over, and it still doesn't look like the people who bought into it for quite a lot of $$ half a decade ago have a place to live yet. Perhaps I missed it though. I don't read the newsletters anymore (there are only so many times you can read about this or that Bronze Membership auction). The training aspect of the place is good. The instructors when I was there were first rate. I got my money's worth. But as a gun enthusiasts' community, it still hasn't even come close to the sales pitch -- unless that's changed radically in the last six months, anyway.
 
I would rather have dinner with Kerry, Edwards, Hillary, and Schummer than train at Frontsight. Chiropractors with wierd beliefs bug me.
 
Strong Words, dave3006. Even if the head is a crazy scientologist (which I'm not saying his is), that doesn't make his quality of instruction any lower. If I had a choice of recommending someone take the local 'pistol class' or front sights 4-day pistol class (both roughly 75 if you use a grey cert), I'd recommend FS anyday. Would i recommend people use their life savings to buy a platniotitanium mega super one time only membership...ummm no.

atek3
 
Especially when you consider that I have taken three, four day classes there and have never laid eyes on the man.
 
Even people on the Kenai don't read the Clarion. :D

The mystery is why there seems to have been no ad campaign in the Anchorage paper, tv spots or, as far as I can tell, in any local gun shops.

Which seems odd considering that's where the market is.
 
I live about 30 miles from Frontsight, Nevada.
They don't have any ads on TV, or in the newspaper. They do some advertising through local gunshops by offering a free two day class, but that is about it.
Most of their advertising comes from word of mouth from prior students.
This is the purpose of those certificates they give out.
 
Well, if that's a business plan that works for them, more power to 'em.

Course, I'd be more willing to pay for nationally known, top shelf, range-owning training locally if I actually knew it existed. :D
 
I always come out on these threads as being some kind of shill for Frontsight. I really don't care one way or the other about the place other than the fact that I have been there and enjoyed it.
I don't know their business plan but according to their propoganda, they put more people through their classes than all other schools combined. Whether that is true or not, I have no idea. But, I can say that when I was there, there were a LOT of people there. I am talking hundreds: every time I was there (3).

I got some of their certificates. I have given one to every female that mentioned to me that she wanted to learn to shoot a handgun or wanted to buy a gun for self defense. So far the total of people I have sent there is one. A friends wife. She took the four day defensive handgun class and enjoyed it to no end. She was totally enthused about it.
 
Wasn't trying to dig at you 444. I'm just amazed that they would seemingly ignore the densest population of shooters the state has to offer. We are a bit out of the way up here and they don;'t have quite the name recognition of a Gunsite or Thunder Ranch.

I'll probably look into their training, I just can't figure out how not advertising pays for a new remote facility. What do they expect, all the customers fly up from Nevada?
 
I have the same questions about it. I fancy myself a very well informed person as far as local gun matters, but I heard squat about this one. Still, if the neighbors are complaining about the noise they must be doing some shooting there.

It's possible this is a tax write-off or something designed to appeal to outsiders. Perhaps they think they're out of our price range. Maybe they are :D
 
Before I start running my mouth I should qualify a few things.

1. I worked for FS as an instructor for four years. I resigned about a year ago.

2. I've taken 8 four days classes, 2 two day classes, and several one day instructor development classes at FS.

3. I've also trained with Louis Awerbuck, Randy Cain, Jeff Gonzales, Scott Reitz, Bill Jeans, Steve Tarani, Gabe Suarez, Rob Haught, Mike Dalton, Mickey Fowler, and others.

4. I currently operate a training organization called West Coast Tactical based out of So. Cal. Our courses have been reviewed here a few times.

Front Sight's basic curriculums are at least on par, and in most cases better, than many that those I've trained with at the entry level. Their strength, IMHO, appeals to the shooter who is looking for a comprehensive first time training experience and they do an exception job of creating a comfortable learning environment.

Most folks simply don't want a boot camp type mentality on the range and many are so apprehensive about what a tactical training experience may be like, they may never train. That said, FS provides a friendly approach to tactical training. I've read many negative comments about the level of training that is conducted at FS. Again, it is very good and the courses are intense and well rounded. I've had well over a hundred days of tactical training from who I consider to be the best of the best and I think I can put things into a realistic perspective based on that experience.

I personally know a young lady who spent ten days on the Alaska property this past summer. She stated that it was a phenomenal experience. Brad Ackman, FS's operations manager lived and worked as a geologist in Alaska for several years and knows the lay of land. He is the driving force behind the Alaska project. I know Brad well and consider him a very good man.

As I understand it, the Alaska property was built as a vacation, adventure, and training venue for folks from the lower 48. IMHO, most folks from the region are already squared away with hunting and fishing as well as other outdoor activities. Again JMHO, but that may account for the lack of advertising in the area.

That said if you're a local you may want to consider handgun, rifle, or shotgun training with them during the summer months when the facility is operational. I think you'll learn a great deal.

If you've trained with FS and didn't enjoy or learn from the experience that's one thing, but to hide behind a screen name and state a position based on rumor and gossip is quite another. I would hope that the training and shooting community has risen to levels above high school cheer leaders gossiping in the locker room about their peers.

AAYMMV

Stay safe!

Fred Darling
 
I'm going to have to stick up for 444 here. I've made my personal opinions about FrontSight well known: I don't like them. However, if I lived 30 miles from their front door, I would train there.

It comes down to dollars and cents. Its probably cheaper for him to take a 4 day class there, then to drive/fly, whatever to Thunder Ranch, Gunsite, or Blackwater Lodge.

At least he is a responsible gun owner getting good, decent training; no matter what your personal opinions are about the owner and the facility.
 
If you've trained with FS and didn't enjoy or learn from the experience that's one thing, but to hide behind a screen name and state a position based on rumor and gossip is quite another. I would hope that the training and shooting community has risen to levels above high school cheer leaders gossiping in the locker room about their peers.

Well Fred, it hasn't. Something I have been preaching for awhile on these internet boards. The moment you post something negative about an instructor, your automatically branded a: TROLL. Or your bad mouthing, etc.

There is rumor, gossip, etc. However, there is also the truth and one's own personal opinions. If the truth and your personal opinion is enough to sway someone from a dangerous and/or less then credible instructor, why not be able to post it?
 
I may very well head down that way next year for dip-netting, so I'll check it out. The folks running it are not advertising enough locally, that's for sure. They should have flyers up. Anchorage only has a few small training outfits that focus on LEO and security guard handgun traning. We really haven't had anything on a larger scale until this place opened up. I for one would love to learn how to be more tactically sound. My marksmanship is fine, but I must admit I do my shooting at targets and furry things, not armed foes. So it's something I do want to work on.
 
However, there is also the truth and one's own personal opinions. If the truth and your personal opinion is enough to sway someone from a dangerous and/or less then credible instructor, why not be able to post it?

Hi Phil,

I've seen your posts on numerous boards and you seem like a very squared away guy. We've trained with a lot of the same people. Please feel free to check me out with them.

Agreed, personal opinions are based on personal experience. I guess the point I'm trying to make is that many have very strong opinions, but don't have the personal experience to back it up. This in my book, is a little disingenuous.

HTH
 
tetleyb
You are right to a point.
I did decide to train there because they are close to my home. But, I have trained at Gunsite before and after the classes I took at Frontsight. So far, I have taken four classes at Gunsite.
I can honestly say, I feel I got more out of the basic handgun class at Frontsight than I did the basic handgun class at Gunsite. I very highly recommend the Frontsight basic handgun class whether you are a novice or an experienced handgunner.
The rifle classe I took at Frontsight was Ok, but not nearly as good as the carbine classes I took at Gunsite. This may have changed but a couple years ago when I took the Frontsight practical rifle class, it was all just square range work with one or two round courses of fire. Pretty mundane. If you were a complete novice, or you lived in the area it is worth taking but a couple years ago, the course was lacking.
Shotgun: pretty much of a toss up.


Fred, I think you will find that at least half the posts on any given thread are conjecture, speculation, rumor, or parroting of something they read somewhere else. Very few posts have anything to back up the statements being made. I bring this up a lot. And, it is ignored. B.S. must be a lot more fun than fact. Even when someone asks a very specific question, most of the answers are pure speculation. And no one questoins it. Why ? I think it is because people just like to give their opinion: I don't think they even read the other posts: they just want to make one of their own.
You will also notice that if the only answer to the question CAN't be a matter of speculation, there are either no answers or few answers. The threads where you really have to know something arn't popular.
 
Please feel free to check me out with them.

Fred, my point wasn't directed toward you at all. I don't know you personally, however, I have heard nothing bad about you. If I did, believe me, I would say something. Its the big mouth in me :)

I guess the point I'm trying to make is that many have very strong opinions, but don't have the personal experience to back it up. This in my book, is a little disingenuous.

Yes, I quite agree. And others embellish and down right lie about their personal experiences, in order to back things up. That was point I was trying to address.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top