F. E. M. A.???

They commendered a water company here in Dallas and Hot Springs. Some here who know people who work there have volunteered to go fill bottles. I'm not sure if that answers you question or not.

FEMA has been put under the control of Homeland Defense, possibly due to their fiscal mishandling of the Fla hurricanes.

Probably isn't working out as well as they thought it would

The point of this is simple to me. They administrate. What we always need to ask ourselves is, are we satisfied with how things are being managed? If things are administered poorly, it shows. And then we might look for the reasons they are doing a bad job of managing. It might be who's in charge, their personnel, perhaps the processes and funding they rely on. And then there's the politics. Are those in charge experienced administrators with serious, successful track records? Or, are they political appointees who are hacks?

Well, how they doing?

Even though I'm a .gov employee, I pretty rarely toe the .gov line. However I'm not sure exactly what more FEMA could do given the situation. They can only do so much -- at some point citizens have to contribute and take responsibility for their own welfare.

FEMA puts out a lot of hardcopy material and has a lot of web info on emergency preparedness, including bug out bag info. Most of us here could probably make a better bug out bag than FEMA did, but if all the people who stayed in NO had followed even FEMA's minimal recommendations on preparedness (I believe it's three days of supplies), I wonder how much smoother things would have gone?

IMO the problem in NOLA is the lack of local leadership. Everyone keeps looking for the Federal government to bail them out when they had the means to do a lot more for themselves such as The Buses of New Orleans These buses could have moved people before Katrina hit and just a couple days ago an 18 yo stole one and drove a whole bunch of folks to Houston. NOLA is seriously lacking initiative in the leadership positions.

FEMA gives me the willies after playing Deus Ex.

No kidding...

I wouldn't worry unless we see someone with odd 'facial tatoos' named Bob Page or Walton Simons show up on TV, though.

Riverdog, that flooded lot w/hundreds of school buses begs the question, doesn't it?

Mr. Terry Ebbert, New Orleans director of emergency operations, would you please explain why those buses weren't moving people out of the area during the evacuation before Katrina hit? Kinda silly that you're screaming at FEMA for their inaction...

Even though I'm a .gov employee, I pretty rarely toe the .gov line. However I'm not sure exactly what more FEMA could do given the situation.

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Coordinate.

NOBODY was doing that.

Hindsight is 20/20, but...

Superdome/Convention Center: Immediately after the storm passed, drop 3-4 full companies of Airborne troops. Establish helicopter landing zones, moving vehicles if necessary. Maintain security inside - keep the unarmed population safe from the predatory population. Choppers can bring in some generators, cords, and diesel. Maybe a few big screens. Get 'em set up, keep the folks tranquilized.

While a route is being cleared for ground transportation, and that transportation is procured (allow four hours - shouldn't take much longer than that to get in touch with every school board president within 200 miles), start running buses in. Send victims to Houston, Memphis and Atlanta, and branch from there. Send elderly/infirm and their families first. Keep them together. Insult the manhood of any young men who try to get on the bus. Then send families.Then send the young men.

Since you're flying in food and water, things should remain under control. Fly in a few pallets of Budweiser, and reward a large group of former victims who just became volunteers. Big difference there.

Maintain a peace-enforcement (grin) presence.

Get the volunteers, and go back in with chainsaws, shovels, whatever it takes.

To answer your question
"Question: Aside from some planning-level personnel, does FEMA actually have any sort of huge disaster-response team? Or equipment? Or resources?"

I kind of answered this on another thread but.
Team: sort of. It isn't a standing, full time team. They are people in allied fields who volunteer to be on a FEMA team. They train regularly, but work at other jobs. For example, FEMA team members are often firefighters, nurses, doctors etc.
Equipment/resources: Yes: FEMA has caches located all over the country. Our local FEMA cache is in a warehouse and includes a lot of gear including a couple pieces of heavy equipment and tractor trailers. A significant portion of this stuff was put on a C-130 at Nellis AFB two days ago bound for the gulf coast. The team went by bus and should get there tomorrow.

Hindsight is 20/20, but...

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Naw, I think it's absolutely appropriate in this case, because it's the way you figure out how to do things better in the future. I just think it's not appropriate to completely blame FEMA for the situation in NO. State and local authorities certainly had a hand in the lack of coordination. Unprepared citizens had a big hand in it as well. The NO Mayor screaming and cussing from his safe and comfy location isn't helping matters either.

As was pointed out in a post above, everybody stands around waiting for the Fed.Gov to bail them out when something goes wrong. We really have developed a culture of, "the government has to DO something!" To me, it's a far cry from the government of self-sufficient citizens that founded the USA.

FEMA - Federal Emergency Management Agency. From the name I take it they are "managers" which means, they are all pencil pushers.

I assume they are supposed to know where to obtain equiptment and supplies.

I further assume they go into a disaster area with no idea what they are facing nor any ideas as to what supplies may be needed.

With these assumptions, there was no way they could start relief supplies going in until Katrina was out of the area, and they were able to arrive and start deciding what is needed and where to get it. After that they put out a call for certain supplies, manpower and equiptment.
This amounts to several day delay before help starts arriving from the outside.

What I see of most authorties in NO is the total inability to do much action on their own.

Many, no all, of the citizens did not seem to be able to do much to help themselves. They kept looking for the government to come in and take care of them.

Hmmm, hindsight huh, preparing for the future, hmm. OK how about next time don't build a big freakin' city right on the coast below sea level, where a possible CAT 5 hurricane could hit it! Sounds good to me. Oh, also instead of the government babying the local populace all their lives, resulting in welfare zombies. Maybe we could have let them learn to work hard, appreciate what they earned and learn self-reliance, just a thought.

I like to look at who is running an agency before I get overly critical.

In January of 2001, George W. Bush appointed Texas crony Joe Allbaugh to head FEMA, despite the fact that Allbaugh had exactly zero experience in disaster management. By April of 2001, the Bush administration announced that much of FEMA's work would be privatized and downsized. Allbaugh that month described FEMA as, "an oversized entitlement program."

In December 2002, Allbaugh quit as head of FEMA to create a consulting firm whose purpose was to advise and assist companies looking to do business in occupied Iraq. He was replaced by Michael D. Brown, whose experience in disaster management was gathered while working as an estate planning lawyer in Colorado, and while serving as counsel for the International Arabian Horse Association legal department.

Been catching Fox News once in a while. Sheppard Smith reporting from an overpass where hundreds of refugees(?) have been for 5 days.
He's talking about how emergency vehicles have been driving by and nobody has brought them food or water, nor brought transportation to get them out of there.

I expect that part of the reason is because there are people who are not on dry land who need help alot more than they do.

My question is, if all those vehicles are able to get there (along with the Fox satellite truck) why haven't those people walked out of there instead of just standing around waiting for someone to come and get them? I know I wouldn't just stand there waiting for the govt to come and bail me out.

He was talking about people there who were almost dieing and needed medical help.

Why don't they put them in the freaking Fox news truck and get them some help? Why don't they drive the frapping Fox news truck somewhere and get them some water? Would it ruin their story?

Where's the idiot mayor of N.O.? Instead of doing something constructive he's on the radio whining and crying and cussing the fedgov for not respnding quickly enough. Typical liberal. No solutions, just point the blamethrower at everyone else.

My question is, if all those vehicles are able to get there (along with the Fox satellite truck) why haven't those people walked out of there instead of just standing around waiting for someone to come and get them? I know I wouldn't just stand there waiting for the govt to come and bail me out.

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I wondered the same thing. I believe it's because these people aren't used to taking initiative. The news reports I saw mentioned that the people on the overpass came from the projects, and after generations of having the government care for them cradle to grave - thinking outside the box and taking intiative isn't possible.

Im still wondering what happened to all the LA rescue personel. Where are the local people? It seems like this state is *completely* dependent on the feds. Usually FEMA moves in to support the locals and to fill in the gaps when necessary. To have a federal agency capable of a rapid and effective response to a major dissaster anywhere in the country is an absurd notion. You would need a force the size of the U.S. army, specifically trained to handle any disaster strategicly stationed throughout the entire nation. IN othe words this country would have to be "occupied" 365 days a year in preperation for the one disaster of this scale that happens every 5-10 years.

Rather than paying for something on this scale, we instead have this thing that we call "state governments". You see, the Unites STATES of America is made up of 50 seperate states, each state has its own tax base and is expected to provide its population with the basic necesesites that are expected of a government, including basic disaster response. So what the hell happened to Louisiana? Where have all their tax-dollars gone, if not to fund basic needs such as this?

it's ok guys

Dubya himself admitted he could have done more to prepare. he's the one that lets all the emergency fund$$$ loose, sends in the guard, etc.

THose flooded buses- are just one example of what FEMA should have been there sooner to move to high ground before the flooding.

disasters of this magnitude are what we pay federal taxes for, and part of why the army corps of engineers, and guard exist. LA should do more of it's own preparation for this type of thing, no doubt, but- it does in part by generating a HUge tax base off a tiny piece of land, NO to make sure the feds
want to keep them on the map

oops.

i would say the HUGE problem would be that there really isnt any way for most of the smaller states to have enough supplies .

should the city of NO be expected to own huge swaths of land outside itself to store buses on? maybe, but it just isnt feasible.

when the better part of a state is ruined, they go from being Louisianans to
Americans.

FEMA does emergency management, training and coordinates federal $$$. They (FEMA) are paying for several teams of firefighters from MA, VA, AL and probably other states that are operating (search and rescue) in Louisana, MS and AL. They bring supplies of food, water, etc. They assist with recovery (write checks)

They don't come in and take over the incident, they legally can't.

They can't force state or local governments to have good emergency plans and use them. They can't make state and local leaders to exercise leadership.

Maybe the feds could have done better, but the cluster f... in NO is a case of the failure of state and local officials. When you can't answer the question "who is in charge?" there is a problem. Legally, the Governor of Louisiana is in charge. All I've seen her do is wring her hands. All I've seen the mayor do is complain.

Maybe they should dig up Huey Long or elect Rudy Guilliani Governor next election.

"why haven't those people walked out of there instead of just standing around waiting for someone to come and get them?"

Because the local law enforcement people have blocked off the exits and will not let them pass. I'd bet the reasoning is to keep the people in one place so when they have the transportation ready to get them out, they can do so.

If we can make air drops such as the ones made in Afganistan to the locals to feed them, I'd like to know why this can't be done there? I'd bet you even money a LAPES drop could be made on that overpass if you could get the people to the side. Right now, its all about food, water and medical treatment until they can get the transportation arranged.

I expect that when Congress returns next week, the speeches will be fascinating. This blame game will be the worst part of the whole incident.

The dumbest thing, at least intuitively, that I have heard so far is mention of tax cuts to stimulate the economy. I would think either shelving other spending programs like the highway bill or a tax increase would be necessary to finance all this.

One of the first things on the list should be establishment of port facilities as an alternative to New Orleans and the distribution system from that new point of entry. Second would be rationing of gasoline. If you just raise the price, then only the prosperous can drive.

It is only a matter of time until the stock market and retirement savings tank again.

Of course the first thing is to establish order in NO. If the people are unmanagable or no one wants to go in there and be at risk or shoot some of them to get their attention, then it would be best to just gas the whole area and put them out of their misery. Even if you dropped in water, only the strongest and meanest would survive. They still wouldn't have water, because a few would be hording it.

You would think that someone ought to do something, but which mother's son is supposed to go in there and start shooting citizens who just want some water.

My guess, based on Louisiana's history, is breathtaking incompetence and corruption at the city and state level as the main factors behind the poor disaster response. The great pile of immediately available resources is in the city's and state's hands, not the federal government's.

None of which, of course, rules out the federal government being stupid. But the federal government's resources are by definition national, meaning spread out all over the place, not already sitting in Louisiana. If you asume they are perfectly administered (not bloodly likely), you still have a lag of a couple of days before they are there in full force. Everything in the meantime is 100% the city's and state's response, which as we know was breathtakingly, utterly worthless.

the big lesson

There is no salvation through civil service.

Sure, I know, some of them are conscientious. Granted. But the intrinsic culture of civil service is the enduring problem. Keep changing figureheads, keep appointing "czars," nothing will change.

The military is the only bureaucracy that works reasonably well and that is because it has rock-hard discipline and a code of selfless moral honor--and even the military isn't perfect by any means. What is true for the military goes for the fire departments and paramedics and the good LEOs. These people are warriors; they are throwbacks to something higher than employment security.

The answer is distributed power, the more local and personally responsive the better. If that means militias, so be it; if it means neighborhood cooperatives, so be it.

The small lession we all learned: Be able to survive, on your own--with food, water, shelter, and arms--for at least a week.